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Sidney the robin

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Posts posted by Sidney the robin

  1. Posted · Edited by Sidney the robin

    anders is a tidy little rider sid, getting better all the time. Riding for uncle Len obviously suits him. I can remember him having demonstration rides at rye when he was just a nipper.

    Followed his progress since his rides at Swindon would love him to follow in the footsteps of Kilb,Crash,Keener, Dukey, Wellie,Rosco, the Smart's/ Chessell's and bless him Martin Hewlett it would be great.

  2. Posted

     

     

     

    The worrying thing is... where will we be in 10 years' time? The SKY cash has been chucked in the wind and, in a way, can count our selves grateful that BT jumped on board and gave it half a season coverage.

     

    Obviously the ones that still attend and will probably ridicule this post and feel that speedway is as good as it was 40, 30 and even 10 years ago. Promoters need not fear for their loyalty. It's the ones who have spent their lives working their way towards their next live speedway event and are now getting out of that habit... that's a worry.

     

    Another winter nears, another five months speedway's problems must be addressed. We don't need GP stars... do we? Just look at the racing from Poole on Monday, in the main from bread an butter guys. It is still thrilling, no question about that.

     

    But it's like a board game bought from the carboot sale right now... all the pieces are there but it has no rules as such.

     

    On here the old folk some of us anyway get slated accused of negativy but as you said where is the forward thinking.? Even if the BT money is there the money is tight so the likes of Doyle may have to be sacrificed for the shorterm at least.I would like to see the regular 1/7 teams back with regular fixtures with clubs living within there means.The rules to be simplified showing that the rules cannot be manipulated by certain people build from there the product is there the potential to improve British speedway is there.
    • Like 2

  3. Posted · Edited by Sidney the robin

    The vast majority of my meetings this year have been At NL level. I've done a few top flight meetings, but only one at championship level. This is mainly down to geographics. Living in the south east everything is NL apart from rye, and that suits me fine. My last two meetings at Eastbourne and Kent were run in very wet conditions with full commitment from the riders, which is the way it should be.

    Hi "City hope you are good, have you been impressed with Anders Rowe on the occasions you have seen him??? hopefully a future Robin.!!!

  4. Posted · Edited by Sidney the robin

    You keep saying you are surprised by Morton being rated highly by others, but when you look at his achievements, you shouldn't be. The fact that he achieved more than others generally rated above him is an indication of that.

    Thing is, you also mention his longevity in the sport, but he really wasn't around that long. He retired at 34 before having that one season with Sheffield. Simmons, Jessup, Kennett etc were all around a lot longer.

    Steve

    But Morton was a star from say aged 19/20 to say 34 along time most of it at a very high level indeed, quality longevity i meant.Nearly 15 years at a high level is an achievement in itself he held his high level of form for quite a period not alot of people do that.

    Jessup was never a favourite of mine but he would be in a list with Lee,Collins, ect) Carter was also only in this list because his career was cut short.Jessup is a strange one i never enjoyed watching him much he was a quiet personality but you have to say he was a great rider and in 1980 he had a great year.But i dont agree he would of won a GP series his team around him and aquipment was questionable in my opinion not sure on that side of things he would of.had the endurance to win a series.

  5. Posted

    G gold

    S silver

    B bronze

    When u copy and paste into here you lose formatting

    But basically what Falcace was showing is that on achievements Mort should be number 1

    I am quite surprised that Morton is high up in alot of people's list in amongst the other four.He was a great rider but his gating was his achlilles heel but he did have a fair amount of success and his longevity was impressive.

  6. Posted · Edited by Sidney the robin

    A really poor year for the Pirates i expected a home win last night but they still come up short.MF this year has had a knightmare expected to much of Klintd and for me put to much trust in K.K and Andersen.A catalogue of mistakes this year treated Newman harshly made changes in Zengota,Kerr,Starke,Kennett,none of them really worked.Next season if they have Woryna, Kurtz,Holder,Shanes they have something to work on a youthful looking line up.

  7. Posted

    Sidney, I have many memories, and still feel exceptionally privileged to have them and for knowing Michael like I did,

    When he rose to the top of the tree, you would have thought the BSPA would have bent over backward to assist him, helping to give the sport the promotion it dearly needed. But they did everything in their power to obstruct him. They publically crucified him at every opportunity.

    One, of many instances that spring to mind, was when his Dad Andy had purchased the Elsworth Moto-Park and was running its first meeting. Michael in support had cancelled racing in Europe that Sunday to be there supporting his father. Michael at that time was holder of the Golden Helmut. His next month's competitor was to be Gordon Kennett.

    When the dates were announced, Michael explained he was not able to ride at Eastbourne on the Sunday because of this prior arrangement with his dad. The BSPA ignored Lee's reasoning and ordered him to ride saying 'as you are not riding at a scheduled meeting, you will race on them dates'. Michael replied he would not race regardless of BSPA threats...

    In the home leg, on the Saturday, Michael beat Kennett 2-0, Standing beside Michael in the pits, I witnessed Kennett coming up to Michael to congratulate him, and saying 'see you tomorrow'.. Michael then explained he would not be there for reason already given and handed over the Golden Helmut for Kennett to take home and have it on display tomorrow. He would then be declared as the new Holder...

    True to his word Michael was at Elsworth that day, He actually said to me there, ' I bet my name is rubbished at Eastbourne today'. Needless to say he got a right pillaring in the press about letting the fans down. He was subsequently fined and striped of the title. but the annoying fact was, in this case he was the innocent party, but only a few fans knew that.... It was little wonder he lost all respect for the BSPA....

    Nothing has really changed since then a shambles to be honest, going back to the ban endless riders people who held total respect within the sport Briggo being one pleaded with them to overturn the ban.Did they listen NO also there was a huge amount of support from the general public and the BSPA knew that but still stuck two fingers up to all of us and did as they pleased.I am sure now that would never be aloud to happen in law and being aloud to get away with it since that day it still leaves a bitter taste.
    • Like 1

  8. Posted

    Despite all of Lee's demon's, I still count myself fortunate to have seen the guy ride in his early days. Yes Terry Betts was Mr Lynn Speedway, maybe with better kit he could have gone even further, but Lee was the bums on seats star attraction. I always maintain the guy robbed me, robbed me of many years of enjoyment watching him. Still feel privileged to have seen him in his pomp. Never seen anything that good, at that age since.

    Feel exactly the same his career was not prolonged 75/83 but i feel lucky that i see a fair bit of him and at his best was the real deal.I suppose Gollob and Ward are the only riders since that have excited me like that also Crump jnr, and Adams for different reasons.

    I remember when he turned up at Lynn's practice day just before his comeback with his old leathers stuffed in a carrier bag.Was sad.I also remember his first race back at Saddlebow Road.Big crowd..He had the trapper that was Todd Whiltshire in his first race,who was going very well..I remember Lee trapped him and won the race by half a straight.

    He was still very fast,but only if he gated.Did'nt mix it like in the good old days :cry:

     

    A memory i have was taking my wife to the Abbey in his comeback 85??? and Michael turning up late 7 oclock ish bag slumped over his shoulder he scored three points was horrible seeing that.As you said a few glimpses of his old magic he beat Gundersen/Carter easily at Saddlebow and in 85 without the EFS could of won the Supporters trophy.

  9. Posted · Edited by Sidney the robin

    That day at Coventry, I took a bus load of Lynn fans to the British Final, as you say it was thought to be a mere formality, The 5 yr ban was a joke and the appeal would be overturned. allowing Lee to compete that evening. This was supposed to be an appeal hearing against the original fictitious offence, but nothing is ever straight forward to the BSPA. Yes, the appeal was upheld and dismissed, but they then concocted a new offence and banned him for a year instead... They were always going to ban him, no matter what's depths they had to dig. Again they had taken the fans for a ride. Total contempt as ever... Why did they use his name in advertising the event when they knew he wouldn't be there.......

     

    Of them 26 people on that bus that day, I am the only one who still goes and support the sport. and you wonder why the fans don't come anymore....

     

    It was a dark day for the sport that day his career was finished, mentally he never recovered his comebacks were never that serious and to be honest seeing him ride then was pretty depressing .
    • Like 1

  10. Posted

    Hi Sidney, you OK.

     

    A simple answer to your question is NO, Robert Lambert and Michael Lee were worlds apart. As good as Lambert is, he is a long way from the class of Lee. It was once said that Lee could put 1000 on the gate whenever he rode. Bettsy again was totally different in that he was the ultimate team man. Some one who rode his bike with such pantase you would have thought he was sitting in an arm chair. Never the worlds best, but he was Mr Consistent and had a big following.. Martin Rogers shipped Bettsy out to Reading, opening the door for Dave Jessup to come in and partner Lee giving the Stars team a strong one two. It was questionable whether it was a good move. I accept they finished 1st and 2nd in the 1980 World Championship, but it didn't work out as it should have done, Jessup, a renown loner, seldom contributed to team spirit, and, more often than not, arrived with only one bike and frequently borrowed from others. It wasn't long before supporter were accusing Rogers off bad decisions letting the skipper go like he did...

     

    It has been said when Bettsy left, Lee lost that guiding influence and was easily led on that destructive path. Lee eventually left Lynn for Poole , but still retained his vast following at Lynn. At the first return when his new club, the place was heaving. The crowds had returned in their 1000's to see their prodigal son. The result that night was not important, all the fans had come to see was Michael Lee.

    Unfortunately, that night, the Ref was the shameful Mr John Eglese, who took an obvious vendetta against Lee to a new level.. He alone was the reason that Michael was banned from that meeting, and subsequently banned for further five years, later reduced to one. I cant speak badly enough of this referee for the damage he did to the sport.. That night he deprived 1000's who had come and paid good money to see Lee ride. Of them, it been estimated as many as half of those Lee fans never went to speedway again.

    That night, John Eglese ended the speedway career of a great rider, and also killed the interest of a lot of fans....

     

    Such a shame i was gutted went to Coventry for the British Final thinking his appeal was a formality that he could still take his place but they still only reduced it from five years to one year. Look Michael had alot to answer for but he was generally good for the sport polite good with the supporters and at his best was a superstar.Bettsy was a great guidance for him down to earth understood how it was to be young once and Betts,Lee, Tiddler were a great team all those three high up in amongst my favourite ever riders.
    • Like 3

  11. Posted

    Grand Prix champion, BLRC champion, Inter-Continental champion, World Pairs champion, twice WTC top scorer, seven World Final appearances, and he wasn't one of the top riders in the world??? Okay...

    Steve

    Yes he was of course, but he was never good anough to win a WC was he better than Louis? ( i was not a fan) maybe did he achieve more than Wilson maybe was he better than those two for me he wasn't.

  12. Posted

    Robert doesn't look like going down the "throw it all away" line but he is still young. Robert is well capable of going all the way to the GP's and even to a world title ( assuming he can gate more consistently than he does currently ). He has natural talent on a bike in much the same way as Michael Lee had. Perhaps Michael Lee's success came too easily and too early but they are very different personalities.

    No disrespect but Lee for me naturally was quite away in front of Robert by along way, Lambert though is a rider i like and hope he bulldozes himself into the bigtime he is certainly good anough.
    • Like 1

  13. Posted · Edited by Sidney the robin

    I've only been to 4 meetings this season...... But then again my nearest track is over 1,200 kms away. The likes of TWK will always find a reason not to go, just leave them in their 1950's bubble and look forward.

    Very harsh indeed and my son played pro football for a few years and we went and took him training as much as possible four meetings only do you stay at home and watch Eastenders.? Dont be that brutal four meetings really??.. surely you have the money but dont bother dont be so brutal when you dont know what other people's situation is think about it.??...

  14. Posted

    I can't believe that people are simply using the BLRC to support their claims for Morton... Yes, it was a great achievement (albeit on his home track), but is that it? And Sidney, you really think that Willie's WTC max would elevate him above Mort?

    Come on, let us look at what else he won; things that everyone seems to have forgotten (other than a vague mention in passing by falcace).

    First was the 1978 VW/Daily Mirror GP. He won the final, and overall, against Simmons, Louis, and a host of other top names.

    Then - and for me, THIS was the highlight of his career - there was his triumph at the 1980 Inter-Continental Final. In a meeting that was generally considered to be tougher than the World Final, Mort turned in a superb display of racing to top the list.

    In view of this brace of victories (which everybody else seems to ignore), along with the other achievements mentioned above, I would DEFINITELY put him no lower than third in the list. Oh, and yes, I hated Carter, but I can differentiate between "ability" and "favouritism"...

    1 - Simmons

    2 - Carter

    3 - Morton

    4 - Louis

    5 - Wilson

    Steve

    I would certainly put your 4/5 Steve in front of Morton because for me at there best in certain years they were in the top few riders in the world.Morton was not ok he won the White City round in 1980 but i never ever considered him good anough to win a WC but his record overall was an outstanding one.

  15. Posted

    I was also at that meeting and remember the Golden Helmet match race...may have been the last time I saw Tommy race?

    That was certainly the last time i see him ride, i see him at the Abbey in 75 scored 11 (Also the WF at Wembley) also Steve he rode at White City in 76 early on maybe you see that to.???

    I got Tommy Jansson's autograph that night. He was there on his own in the away pits, sitting against the back wall, then, as you say, came out in the second half.

    Strange that dont you think he must of been on a good guarantee?? in those days at Swindon you had a cheap side as well the gate to get through to the starting gate side was usually opened at about heat 10.
    • Like 1

  17. Posted

    It did show over those few years WK something you remember Carter did fall out with alot of riders ie) PC and at that time i took Collins side.Peter was a rider everyone respected and even Eric Boocock said if only Carter could of been less brash with it looking back i do believe Carter would of made a brilliant world champion 82 he was robbed by a crazy rule.

    On the other hand....he won a BLRC unlike Simmo or Wilson (when it really meant something), he made more appearances for England than all the rest. He top scored for England in successive World Cup finals, unlike all the rest. Like Carter and Wilson, he never placed in a World Final, but he did reach more World Finals than all the rest. And if placing in a World Final is the barometer, would you rank Gordon Kennett and Les Collins (same era) above Morton, Wilson and Carter? He also won a major World Championship qualifying round in addition to the British Final unlike all the rest...

    GREAT POST and you really have a strong case "falcace" for me i suppose i sometimes get blinded by riders who did not quite do it but were class acts.Wilson, E.Boocock,Betts,Ashby,Adams,Sigalos,P.Crump all come into that category.Also you see loads more of Mort than me and at Hyde Rd was a sight to be seen he was one of a few who could beat Nielsen on merit.Mort's pass of Carter in the Northern riders Championship is one of the greatest passes i have ever seen top class a top rider TOP bloke to.
    • Like 1

  18. Posted

    Robert, over time could become the next Bettsy.

    Lee, nah, different class. Lee was streets ahead at his age.

    Like the Holder post! Just shows he can ride dodgy tracks when he wants too.

    Can you ever see a 16 year old lad now ever coming into the top league and beating and mixing it with the best Lee was a one off one of the best riders i have ever seen.
    • Like 2

  20. Posted

    I'd say it's harder to win a series Sid - unless you are one of the top two in the world that year, then I'd say it would be tougher to win a one off final.

    Was a great achievement no doubt. and was no fluke. He had an outstanding season. It no way imo he would have won a gp series. But being arguably the worst British world champ is still far more than most achieve.

    If woffy finishes top 2 this year Sid would u rate him best ever? With another world title?

    NO i personally dont think Woffinden at his best would beat Lee /Collins. Craven i did not see ride but his record speaks for itself.Also in yesteryear when Briggo/Mauger (ect) rode in British Final's it was mighty tough to qualify for a WF now i think Grand Prix results are percentage results.
    • Like 1

  21. Posted

    Completely and utterly biased...but, aren't we all? Morton is the most capped of all these and won everything there is to win individual and as a team internationally and domestically bar the World Title. Yep, he gets overshadowed by PC having raced in the same era. But he beats all these guys on longevity and his CV is at least equal to Simmo and better than the rest.

    No he is number five quite easily for me and his CV is not as good as Simmo and did he score a maximum in a peak WTC year like Wilson ? No also was he placed in a WF like Louis NO.

    Hi Sid

     

    Thank you for that.

     

    My problem with Carter is that I never liked him and, to a point, have allowed that to colour my view of him as a Rider.

     

    Plus all the other Riders you quoted were Team men. I always considered that Carter was all about Carter. Hence my positioning him as I have.

     

    I hope that explains my position.

     

    I know there are people who will disagree with my reasoning, but I have put it as I see it.

    Yes can see your point of view WK and at club level Carter was quite a selfish rider for usually a weak Halifax team riding for England he was different.
    • Like 1

  24. Posted · Edited by Sidney the robin

    Carter -should have been World Champ in 82. Penhall had him off.

    Louis - rostrum place in my first ever World final.

    Simmons - might have put him second if he hadn't deliberately dropped his average at Swindon.

    Wilson - 1975. Booooo!!

    Morton - possibly because he was always second heat leader behind Peter Collins.

    Louis beat Crash from the back Wilson after a first ride fall that really cost Ashby it did hurt at the time but i was a big Bostik Willy fan anyway so it did not matter.

    Hey Sidney the robin - re Morton: is that Wal, Val, Chris or Dave! :lol:

    You have a guess you tell me.??? 😀😜
    • Like 1
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