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iris123

Un-official World Finals

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"Make your own choice" what do you mean by that? It has been researched and proven from programmes and "Paris Match" magazine? What else do you need?

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10 minutes ago, andout said:

"Make your own choice" what do you mean by that? It has been researched and proven from programmes and "Paris Match" magazine? What else do you need?

I advised "Make your own choice" because I am completely confused as to what is a definitive list of winners of the French-staged 'world championships.' 

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27 minutes ago, gustix said:

I advised "Make your own choice" because I am completely confused as to what is a definitive list of winners of the French-staged 'world championships.' 

You have them......Speedway Champions site is accurate......

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4 hours ago, andout said:

You can look at the programme cover on the Speedway Championships website, all the riders are listed on that cover.

Also, how we know we are correct in the finishing three they are listed in this 1934 programme.

1931 Lamont, Tauser, Bellissent

1932 Wilkinson, Bellissent, Killmeyer

1933 Meynier, Wilkinson, Lamont.

1934 Rye, Case, Killmeyer

1935 Rye, Murphy, Bellissent.

 

That's all, there were no more than these five annual world championships from 1931 to 1935 in Paris.

In 1936 the FIM took over and staged the first officially sanctioned world championship final at Wembley. 

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11 hours ago, andout said:

"Make your own choice" what do you mean by that? It has been researched and proven from programmes and "Paris Match" magazine? What else do you need?

This is the trouble with some who spread this stuff . Historic facts aren’t a matter of ‘ make your own choice’ and it isn’t a matter of ‘lots of sites state such and such ‘ or ‘ why has nobody ever questioned this  before ? ‘
One such article stating Cullum was unofficial world champ by gustix 

http://www.speedwaymuseumonline.co.uk/puttmossman.html

Edited by iris123
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6 minutes ago, iris123 said:

This is the trouble with some who spread this stuff . Historic facts aren’t a matter of ‘ make your own choice’ and it isn’t a matter of ‘lots of sites state such and such ‘ or ‘ why has nobody ever questioned this before ? ‘
One such article stating Cullen was unofficial world champ by gustix 

http://www.speedwaymuseumonline.co.uk/puttmossman.html

???? Who is Cullen? No mention in the Putt Mossman biog!!

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Auto correction on my phone . Just typed it again and it changed it once more to Cullen . No idea why. It doesn’t change anything

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1969 World Pairs Final which was initially a non FIM endorsed event, if I recall, but has long since been recognised as the first staging of the World Pairs competition.

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5 hours ago, gustix said:

???? Who is Cullen? No mention in the Putt Mossman biog!!

In quite an extraordinary coincidence I have just come across a spectacular photo of Peewee 'Cullen' in mid air after a crash at Yankee Stadium, New York in 1937 !!! I kid you not. Must have had auto correct problems even in those days :rofl:

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7 hours ago, gustix said:

There is reference to the French-staged world championships in this article including the names of the champions: http://www.speedwayplus.com/france.shtml

These are the 'world champions' for the events staged in France 1929-37:

1929 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1930 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1931 meeting 1 - 1.Billy Lamont
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Vic Huxley
1932 meeting 1 - 1.Jack Parker
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Bluey Wilkinson, 2.Billy Lamont
1933 - 1.Claude Rye, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 1 - 1.Fernand Meynier, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 2 - 1.Jean Landru
1935 - 1.Billy Lamont, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1936 - 1.Pee Wee Cullum
1937 - 1.Martin Schneeweiss

Edited by Guest

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6 minutes ago, gustix said:

These are the 'world champions' for the events staged in France 1929-37:1929 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1930 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1931 meeting 1 - 1.Billy Lamont
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Vic Huxley
1932 meeting 1 - 1.Jack Parker
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Bluey Wilkinson, 2.Billy Lamont
1933 - 1.Claude Rye, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 1 - 1.Fernand Meynier, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 2 - 1.Jean Landru
1935 - 1.Billy Lamont, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1936 - 1.Pee Wee Cullum
1937 - 1.Martin Schneeweiss

Oh dear John, you do make a rod for your own back......

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2 hours ago, gustix said:

These are the 'world champions' for the events staged in France 1929-37:

1929 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1930 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1931 meeting 1 - 1.Billy Lamont
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Vic Huxley
1932 meeting 1 - 1.Jack Parker
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Bluey Wilkinson, 2.Billy Lamont
1933 - 1.Claude Rye, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 1 - 1.Fernand Meynier, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 2 - 1.Jean Landru
1935 - 1.Billy Lamont, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1936 - 1.Pee Wee Cullum
1937 - 1.Martin Schneeweiss

FFS John, please stop this nonsense.....you know this is not true and has been proven so.

Please stop the usual nonsense of trying to "Never let the facts get in the way of a story".

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9 hours ago, steve roberts said:

1969 World Pairs Final which was initially a non FIM endorsed event, if I recall, but has long since been recognised as the first staging of the World Pairs competition.

Not sure that is true.....would like to proven wrong though?

There was talk once of doing this and also the 1968 Pairs in Kempten but I wasn't aware it had come to fruition.

Edited by andout
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1 hour ago, gustix said:

These are the 'world champions' for the events staged in France 1929-37:

1929 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1930 - 1.Charles Bellisent
1931 meeting 1 - 1.Billy Lamont
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Vic Huxley
1932 meeting 1 - 1.Jack Parker
1932 meeting 2 - 1.Bluey Wilkinson, 2.Billy Lamont
1933 - 1.Claude Rye, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 1 - 1.Fernand Meynier, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1934 meeting 2 - 1.Jean Landru
1935 - 1.Billy Lamont, 2.Leopold Killmeyer
1936 - 1.Pee Wee Cullum
1937 - 1.Martin Schneeweiss

certainly not !!! why do You repreat all this proven nonsense again and again?

Tell me who was this Jean Landru ? Never came across this name when researching the Paris speedway meetings of the 1930s ! And You claim he was a world champion in 1934 !

 

There were no more than FIVE World Championship Finals in Paris !

 

Champions du Monde de Dirt-Track 1931 - 1935

1931 Billy Lamont

1932 Arthur 'Bluey' Wilkinson

1933 Fernand Meynier

1934 Claude Rye

1935 Claude Rye

 

An interestig note about Charles 'Pee-Wee' Cullum winning it in 1936. He did win the Grand Prix of Paris in 1936, and the trophy on offer for the winner was indeed the one that had been used for all five World Championships from 1931 to 1935.

The winners of the World Championships had not been allowed to keep the trophy, and had to give it back to the promoters. But in 1936 it had become obsolete as the FIM now ran the official World Championship, and there was no longer such an event in Paris.

Instead of their world championship, the French promoters staged a one-off big international Meeting in July of 1936, the Dirt-Track Grand Prix of Paris, and offered the former world championship trophy to the winner for good. Cullum won it and took the trophy with him back to America, were not so long ago it has been auctioned along with other Cullum memorabilia.

 

The top three of that 1936 Dirt-Track Grand Prix of Paris were:

1st Charles Cullum (America)

2nd Leon Boulard (France)

3rd Dicky Case (Australia)

 

 

 

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