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Iwould also not allow team to be built arond averages , but by grades (no not the complicated one used before) just 3 grades Heat leader, Second String and reserve

 

Each team could biuld to a Maximum of 3 heat leaders ,2 Second strings and 2 reserves

 

a starter over 7.00 heatleader btween 4.5 and 7.00 second string , below 4.5 reserve

 

So Wolves could track Nicki Pedersen, Fredrik Lindgren and Peter Karlsson while Poole could track Hans Andersen, Kryzstof Kasprzak and Chris Holder ...... However teams like Ipswich would have a top 3 of Miskowiak, Nicholls and King !!

 

 

If there was to be a grading, it would have to be more balanced out.

 

GRADE 7 = 9.00+

GRADE 6 = 8.00 - 8.99

GRADE 5 = 7.00 - 7.99

GRADE 4 = 6.00 - 6.99

GRADE 3 = 5.00 - 5.99

GRADE 2 = 4.00 - 4.99

GRADE 1 = 3.00 - 3.99

 

Each team would then be allowed to have seven riders with a combined grade of say 25 so for Example, Wolves could track Lindgren, Karlsson, Woffinden, Klindt, Proctor, Lawson, Stichauer .... Coventry ~ Harris, Nicholls, Kennett, Barker, Allen and Auty

 

Sounds good, but would there be the riders to go around ?

 

 

CHEQUE BOOK SPEEDWAY ~

And I guess you think this would be bad.

 

Why?

Why would a track like Belle Vue, Ipswich or Eastbourne want to join the Elite League if there are three teams that have all the top riders in there. Could you imagine a Wolves v Belle Vue match

 

Pedersen, Lindgren, Karlsson, Woffinden, Max, Skornicki and Klindt v Hougaard, Gjedde, Wright, Ostergaard, Forsberg etc etc ..... Bet that would really get the fans queing at the gates.

 

 

Grading can work, but the smart promoters will then know that a rider is best to finish on a 6.99 average rather than 7.01 and will make sure this happens each year. That way their team could be 6.93 stronger than most other teams

 

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Why would a track like Belle Vue, Ipswich or Eastbourne want to join the Elite League if there are three teams that have all the top riders in there. Could you imagine a Wolves v Belle Vue match

 

Pedersen, Lindgren, Karlsson, Woffinden, Max, Skornicki and Klindt v Hougaard, Gjedde, Wright, Ostergaard, Forsberg etc etc ..... Bet that would really get the fans queing at the gates.

 

I guess there are lots of points to be made re the above.

 

Firstly, you make the assumption that all the good riders would be with 3 teams, there is nothiing to suggest that that would necessaily be the case.

 

Secondly, at the minute the sport punishes successful teams i.e. if you win the league you more often than not have to break up your team. Which IMO is just plain silly. The emphasis should be on those weaker promotions having to improve their team or face relegation. And it should be one straight down and one play off position.

 

Thirdly, it would help ambitious promotions (perhaps in the PL) to attract the occasional world class rider so as to allow them to attain an EL place. e.g. KL could go and sign Tomek Gollob for example to boost their promotion bid. Now that would put bums on seats.

 

Fourthly, why do those teams that you mention have a given right to appear in the EL. If they don't bring their teams up to scratch and finish bottom, they should be relegated. Simple. I'm sure if that were the case they'd be bursting a gut to improve their team. i.e. the emphasis should be on improving and unfortunately the averages system doesn't allow it.

 

Fifthly, some people will state that the current set up allows all promotions to have an even chance the next season. Does it? IMO I don't think so. When did Ipswich, Eastbourne and Bv last win the EL? approx 10 seasons ago. So the current set up can't be working that well.

 

Sixthly, if cheque book speedway brought about a stronger team or two entering the EL then perhaps the SKY matches would be more competitve. And that SKY cash would be spread about the country a bit more thereby rewarding success and not keeping it amongst the EL closed shop i.e. rewarding failure.

 

 

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The sealed bit is tough, but other sports use some kind of item that would break when the engine is broken apart (like a unique coloured wax seal).

 

The most popular karting class uses a sealed engine, which is done with some sort of plastic tag that breaks if the engine is dismantled. Engines can only be serviced by approved agent, who are supposed to use stock parts with no modifications.

 

However, there are a number of problems with this approach. Firstly, with the best will in the world, all engines have small differences and you find the top drivers go around buying up several engines to source the best 'standard' components to put together in a higher performing engine. This is perfectly legitimate, but somewhat defeats the purposes of having standardised engines.

 

Secondly, some sealed engines have been found to have tampered with, obviously by some agent who's prepared to bend the rules for a favoured client. The chances of being caught were (at least in the early days) slim because it was assumed sealed engines wouldn't need checking on a regular basis.

 

I personally don't like the sealed approach because it not only precludes you from doing your own servicing/tuning, but it puts the agents in a powerful position to charge daft money for doing even the most basic things. This is in a sport with almost no prize money, so goodness knows what it would be like in a professional sport.

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However, there are a number of problems with this approach. Firstly, with the best will in the world, all engines have small differences and you find the top drivers go around buying up several engines to source the best 'standard' components to put together in a higher performing engine. This is perfectly legitimate, but somewhat defeats the purposes of having standardised engines.

 

Quite right Humph. You could bet your granny's bottom that a standard works Jawa rider would be quicker than young Brendan Bottomly's standard Jawa at Scunthorpe. The reason is before every engine leaves the factory it will get tested under controlled conditions and the better ones will be filtered out. You could even engineer a slightly quicker engine and seal it and still keep within the rules. Purely by choosing and matching parts within a closer tolerance band.

 

This though only applies to very few engines, in general though most will be quite similar.

 

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Monday Night SKY league which includes GP riders who want to race over here on a set night, SKY deal covers all costs ...........

Proper club race nights for a new British League ............ well who knows but hopefully would include EL and a number of PL clubs including KL ;) and not including the GP riders/riders who don't want a full british league campaign.

 

Sounds good but who knows what the BSPA have in mind?

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Teams should only have one reserve at 7 who must be the current lowest averaged rider over say the previous 10 matches. This rider should be the only one that can be used to replace off form, injured or sick riders and may have up to an additional 3 rides. The next lowest average must ride at 6 and the rest, 1 to 5 may be positioned in any order of the TM's choosing. Each team's riders current averages to be calculated on a rolling basis of the previous 10 meetings.

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If there was to be a grading, it would have to be more balanced out.

 

GRADE 7 = 9.00+

GRADE 6 = 8.00 - 8.99

GRADE 5 = 7.00 - 7.99

GRADE 4 = 6.00 - 6.99

GRADE 3 = 5.00 - 5.99

GRADE 2 = 4.00 - 4.99

GRADE 1 = 3.00 - 3.99

 

Each team would then be allowed to have seven riders with a combined grade of say 25 so for Example, Wolves could track Lindgren, Karlsson, Woffinden, Klindt, Proctor, Lawson, Stichauer .... Coventry ~ Harris, Nicholls, Kennett, Barker, Allen and Auty

 

Sounds good, but would there be the riders to go around ?

Agreed that promoters would work the averages as always but those who go out to win the league probably wouldn't get the chance and that in turn would share the winners around?

I would go for less gradings:

Grade 5 8.5+

Grade 4 7.5 - 8.49

Grade 3 6.5 - 7.49

Grade 2 5.5 - 6.49

Grade 1 4.49 and less

Then teams built to 20 points perhaps. I'd had thought that the promoters would have to work out to see if the riders that are on the books at present would all get a job with these gradings, it's pretty important for british speedway to keep the riders that do want to race here!

 

Another way of changing speedway/possibly making the racing better imo would be to change the meeting format so that there are more races with riders of similar calibre. If that happened the riders averages would change completely of course, more thought has to go into this idea than I have given it haha, sounds good though :)

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I would like to see the lineup's of heats 12, 13 & 14 changed as follows:-

 

12-1&7 v 3&6

13-3&6 v 1&7

14-5&4 v 5&4

 

This would prevent riders 1&5 being asked to race against each other 3 times causing them to achieve lower averages than their ability. It would also reduce the averages of lesser riders who currently have easier races to a more realistic level.

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<!--quoteo(post=1597400:date=Sep 19 2009, 09:04 PM:name=billybikespeedway)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (billybikespeedway @ Sep 19 2009, 09:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1597400"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would not say it would be a bad idea , but knowing speedway promoters they would not GO and promote to get the money ,they would say to their regulars "well its going to cost you £25 to get in so we can compete"<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

 

Yup never really thought of that. Although I think it (no averages) may actually attract more promoters into the sport. The ex Coventry promoter (apologies can't remember his name) was effectively chased away from speedway and perhaps a little bit more money.

 

IMO the fact that he'd to break up a winning team, plus he couldn't easily improve a losing team helped in his decision to walk away.

 

I think the big fear that one or two teams will suddenly track 7 Nicki Pedersen's or 7 Tomek Gollob's I just don't think is a realistic fear.

 

Most promotions aren't making a fortune just now so I fail to see where all this money would appear from to dominate the sport.

Some really great points made on here my feeling always has been forget about stupid averages .If you are a promoter you could not field seven Jason Crumps even if you wanted to because of the exspense.When i first started going i see loads of good meetings that were 50-28 or 53-25.We have been obsessed with trying to keep teams close, bring back building a team keeping it defending cups.Thats what i want more teams fans can identify with not musical chairs riders moving every year.Get speedway back on track i dont care who wins just improve the product.

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I would bring into speedway the system for starting that is in use in BMX racing, get rid of tapes, all riders have to touch the bar, then go when it drops. starting gate problems solved

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I would bring into speedway the system for starting that is in use in BMX racing, get rid of tapes, all riders have to touch the bar, then go when it drops. starting gate problems solved

 

If it was thin enough it might be worth trying.

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I would bring into speedway the system for starting that is in use in BMX racing, get rid of tapes, all riders have to touch the bar, then go when it drops. starting gate problems solved

 

Where would the starting gate be? If it was on the straight it would need to go into a recess in the track, how would you keep the shale out. If it wasn't would you start at the end of the straight?

Some tracks may not have the room to do this. I remember they tried a thick rope laid behind the bikes to stop backward movement, so maybe a bar behind the back wheel would be better. :drink:

Edited by tyretrax

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Where would the starting gate be? If it was on the straight it would need to go into a recess in the track, how would you keep the shale out. If it wasn't would you start at the end of the straight?

Some tracks may not have the room to do this. I remember they tried a thick rope laid behind the bikes to stop backward movement, so maybe a bar behind the back wheel would be better. :drink:

 

On a similar theme i.e. messing around at the starts. Yesterday at Leicester a rider was disqualified for not being ready to race by the time the 2 minute warning had expired. After this happened I timed the last minute after the announcer said that all riders now had less than 60 seconds to be ready to race and guess what every race got away on time. Simple isn't it. Why oh why cannot all referees apply this same logic? It would certainly cut out a lot of gardening delays and stop certain irritating starting marshalls from constantly finding it necessary to keep approaching riders to line up when he wants and not when they are ready to.

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On a similar theme i.e. messing around at the starts. Yesterday at Leicester a rider was disqualified for not being ready to race by the time the 2 minute warning had expired. After this happened I timed the last minute after the announcer said that all riders now had less than 60 seconds to be ready to race and guess what every race got away on time. Simple isn't it. Why oh why cannot all referees apply this same logic? It would certainly cut out a lot of gardening delays and stop certain irritating starting marshalls from constantly finding it necessary to keep approaching riders to line up when he wants and not when they are ready to.

 

And still on starting gate matters I would like to see any rider who is deemed to have caused a false start for whatever reason, including going too soon, made to go from 15 metres. No reserve replacements.

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Get rid of 'team' leathers / Kevlar's ….:)

 

in the good old days riders were individuals , Nigel Boocock in blue , Ole Olsen in black , John 'Tiger' Louis , John Cook camoflauge ( what was that all about ?)

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