Phil 303 Posted November 18, 2003 Possibility of the current heat 8 (2&7 v 2&7). becoming the "new" heat 5. There will be no tactical substitutions permitted in this race, the thinking behind this being that it will give the second strings and reserves an "easy" race without having to face heat leaders. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew 125 Posted November 18, 2003 Why alter the format ? just ban the use of tacticals in ht 8 and ht14 for that matter! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GREDON 20 Posted November 18, 2003 Very sensible Andrew, but that idea is too easy, for the promoters to work out this year, perhaps in a year or two time Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dekker 239 Posted November 18, 2003 (edited) Could see the point of heat 14 being moved back as it just encourages ppl to throw heat 13 now. But why do they keep protecting the reserves and 2nd strings??? If they want to be heatleaders they have to beat the top riders..... Oh well will just mess the averages up more. Edited November 18, 2003 by Dekker Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
super_carlos 0 Posted November 18, 2003 (edited) I know that our sport allways gets compared to football, but if they change the format it is like saying to Man Utd you are winning 4-0 so you cant play Van Nistelrooy,Giggs and Ferdinand for 10 minutes of the match. This will definatley work againts top heavy teams. Edited November 18, 2003 by super_carlos Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SCB 0 Posted November 18, 2003 All this will do is give the number 7's artificially high averages so if this is he BSPA's answer to helping the youngsters they're very wrong, watch one or two youngster get high averages and get dropped for real 5 and 6 point rider who can walk there easy heats! They're having a laugh. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diamonds_are_forever 0 Posted November 18, 2003 I disagree, I think the change would be good. How many meetings have you watched young reserves get stuck in during heat 2, then trail 1/2 a lap behind in the rest of their heats cos they have no chance. Unfortunately due to the 'strength' of the elite league, unless youngsters have a fighting chance of earning some money by scoring some points, they just won't ever give it a try. Reserve berths should be filled by young up & coming riders eg. Jason Bunyan, not GP riders such as Ales Dryml. If it disadvantages top heavy teams, what does that say about team building...don't build top heavy! Therefore the best riders would have to spread out if the promoters felt their team would be otherwise disadvantaged. I know in working it wouldn't be as simple as that, but it would be incentive to make an even spread of strength through a team. I don't think reserves would be dropped cos of high averages - afterall, not every reserve in the league can come 1st twice every night. Some of them will have to come second, third and fourth! And the slight increase would occur across every team in the whole league, so not everyone is gunna be able to find 6 pointers from nowhere. The arguments on here against the idea are good & valid points, but personally I think the advantages outweigh the disadvantages...anyone agree? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Meynell 2 Posted November 18, 2003 (edited) I disagree, I think the change would be good. Will you think it a good idea when all the other heats have to be re-jigged, with some riders having a gap of seven heats between some of their programmed rides, and others being programmed every other heat? Heat 8 is where it is for a very good reason, which is to give Nos 1, 3, 4 & 5 evenly-spaced rides. If tactical substitutions are a problem, you could simply not allow them in Heat 8. It's one of the BSPA's worst ideas ever, so no doubt it'll probably be approved :-( Edited November 18, 2003 by Kevin Meynell Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lupus 1 Posted November 19, 2003 (edited) Reserve berths should be filled by young up & coming riders eg. Jason Bunyan, not GP riders such as Ales Dryml. Bunyan?......Up and Coming????........PERLEEEEASE!!!!!!! Sorry but that is just the funniest thing I've heard for ages. The day Bunyan EVER gets further than a poor EL second string, I'll win a posh spice lookalike competition!!!!! Seriously, I do think the change to heaat 8 is a good one. As has been said, often the only points the reserve lads get is by taking them off the other reserves - and by heat 8, as it currently is, they're up against heat leaders. VERY confidence sapping I would imagine. Edited November 19, 2003 by lupus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin Meynell 2 Posted November 19, 2003 often the only points the reserve lads get is by taking them off the other reserves - and by heat 8, as it currently is, they're up against heat leaders. VERY confidence sapping I would imagine. They're all big boys and shouldn't be riding in the league if they're that much out of their depth. The reserves already have easier races, what with Heat 2, and then meeting another reserve in at least 2 or their remaining 3 programmed rides. The suggestion to mess around with Heat 8 is just yet more pointless tinkering, that will do nothing to solve the underlying problems in the sport. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gemini 4,894 Posted November 19, 2003 The formula to win a match will be two very strong heat leaders, a crap middle order, one very strong reserve and a 3.00 no hoper. Sounds just like the Coventry team for 2004, if there is no change. We should be okay then. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shoddy 1 Posted November 19, 2003 Look at Ben Wilson at Sheffield this year. Riding last year at number 7 last term to give him the easier rides meant he gets to race the opposite number 7 three times and number 6 twice. He has averaged over 3 and may be left out for a 3 pointer next year if his average doesn't fit. Had he ridden at 6 he would have met each reserve one time less, probably averaged under 3 and been more likely to keep his place this year. It is right that riders like Ben ride at 7 to help build confidence but the suggested change would distort true averages even more and make it harder for young Brits who don't come in and set the league on fire in their first season. It is good that these ideas are thrown around but I would have thought that a true look at this one suggests it is not that great??? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fatface 2,549 Posted November 19, 2003 often the only points the reserve lads get is by taking them off the other reserves - and by heat 8, as it currently is, they're up against heat leaders. VERY confidence sapping I would imagine. They're all big boys and shouldn't be riding in the league if they're that much out of their depth. The reserves already have easier races, what with Heat 2, and then meeting another reserve in at least 2 or their remaining 3 programmed rides. The suggestion to mess around with Heat 8 is just yet more pointless tinkering, that will do nothing to solve the underlying problems in the sport. Totally agree Kevin. When our promoters get together for their once-a-year meeting, is this the sort of pointless drivel they'll be discussing for hours on end? Is this the sort of thing that will draw thousands of people through the gates. "Oooo, the no7 gets an easier ride?" - I'm there! Surely the big issues are: Good Tracks - well prepared and deep Good Competitions - a bigger EL and no mickey mouse BLC Real teams - less rider replacements, guests, doubling-up and other silly "only-in-speedway" rules Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
