Team Building For 2011

[gsmills 0]

I'd like to see an all british N/L . our youngsters deserve a chance to get to the top by going through the leagues. Foreign youngsters have their chances in their own countries. I'd like to see all foreigners starting in the prem. If the NL was all british to start off, with riders at differing levels it could work. For beginners to the sport there should be a level they have to achieve befor entering as a reserve. That would mean we would not have to bar any british lads from this league, however I think there should be a top level when they should go prem. I think a team average of 36 could work.; No1,8pts max with Nos.6 & 7 3pts ea. for team building.

[gsmills 0]

i really agree with you but everybody seems to be missing the point speedway in this country is so hard for a normal lad,the costs are just to much to get to a good level,basicaly £100 a practice on average,so many young good lads ive seen forced to pack up because of financial reasons.there is no support for good juniors, nobody spots them ,what i want to see is academys to bring lads on,let them train cheaply and then we could have a good national league and maybe junior racing, promotors dont really care about the future speedway is in the doldrums and i cant see a way foward

[Edwardian 6]

i really agree with you but everybody seems to be missing the point speedway in this country is so hard for a normal lad,the costs are just to much to get to a good level,basicaly £100 a practice on average,so many young good lads ive seen forced to pack up because of financial reasons.there is no support for good juniors, nobody spots them ,what i want to see is academys to bring lads on,let them train cheaply and then we could have a good national league and maybe junior racing, promotors dont really care about the future speedway is in the doldrums and i cant see a way foward

try scunthorpe mate good facility's good people

[scribbler 213]

try scunthorpe mate good facility's good people

 

With training facilities AND Amateur Racing... and I gather that the riders at these meetings are a friendly,helpful bunch

[gsmills 0]

try scunthorpe mate good facility's good people

we have done cant fault it,its just the lack of help for kids, they have a go then hit a brick wall, i know theres some good kids out there, but will they keep interested, you have seen the under 15 only 5 or 6 riders where are the rest gone, same as my lad no training on big tracks,chucked in at the deep end and they walk away ,we need to make it fun for them and encourage these lads where else do you see such a poor outlook

[Halifaxtiger 5,318]

I personally think that 36 is far too low. Lowering the points limit in the EL hasn't really helped with costs in fact I dont think it will have too much effect on costs in the NL if anything it will push the lower averaged riders demands up because they will be more in demand especially if they are on false averages. Its swings and roundabouts really you push the top guys out in theory to save money but then the lower guys become more valuable. If you listen to the comments made regarding the EL and the lowering of the points limit it has made the product less competitive as the standard is not as high but the costs do not reflect the standard of the league which some feel isn't that much higher than the PL. I agree the league needs a major shake up as costs are spiralling both for riders and promoters how we do that though is anyones guess.

 

As for the Australians in the league you can only have two per club anyway so dont think this needs to be limited any further. What does need to be done though is stringent policing of such riders so that there is no suggestion of ineligible riders competing. I personally just dont see where all the extra riders are coming from if you ban the aussies and lower the points limit drastically. There are only a handful of riders competing in the 500cc class of the U15s this year and very few riders on the sidelines who want to or are able to hold down a team spot.

 

 

This is a very fine post Jayne and one that I think most people outside north east Lincolnshire will agree with (and probably a few there will, too).

 

I have to say I'd sooner see 1 Australian rather than two per team but a total ban would lose the entertainment and crowd pulling appeal that these lads give.

 

There is no doubt that the suggestion that the NL has become a bastion for Australians is nothing but an utter myth.

 

It should never be forgotten that for yourself and others the running of your side is your bread and butter - you are not putting out an NL side to produce riders for a senior team and hence might be prepared to stomach the losses in attendance that could easily be the result of devaluing the product too much. That is something which must be part of the equation when the points limit is considered.

 

 

Well put Shippy22. This was part of the point I was making in that there are just not enough riders sat on the sidelines to replace the older riders. Reducing the points limit drastically only places a higher price on those with low averages and the potential to improve. It also makes the product we are trying to sell weaker. There are lots of comments in the EL section about supporters not paying inflated prices for inferior products, you have to get the balance right between being competitive and offering opportunities for 'new blood'in order to retain the support.

 

Another fine post and I can assure you that the points you make regarding the lack of available riders are not lost on other NL team managers.

 

What I am most encouraged by here is the consistency of your views and your willingness to try and find an acceptable solution with two of those gentlemen I have referred to in my earlier post. There is unquestionably hope for the continued existence and indeed prosperity of the NL when such leading figures are prepared to put at least some of their self interest aside for the benefit of the common good.

[Swift Saint 186]

scunny ,rye and sittingbourne poss are the only tracks to train on regular

 

Please make sure of your facts before making such a sweeping statement.

 

Training takes place at least once a week at Stoke and not just doing laps without help. There are also opportunities at Northside (Workington) and Weymouth and Plymouth have also staged sessions.

 

There amy well be others.

 

Malcolm Vasey

[Parsloes 1928 nearly 495]

Please make sure of your facts before making such a sweeping statement.

 

Training takes place at least once a week at Stoke and not just doing laps without help. There are also opportunities at Northside (Workington) and Weymouth and Plymouth have also staged sessions.

 

There may well be others.

 

Malcolm Vasey

 

There are. Well, there's certainly Lydd (like Iwade in Kent...) as well...

[SimonB 55]

I am with Jayne on the issue with lowering the average limit, it would just make other riders more expensive instead and would not have sucha great impact on the costs of the clubs. My view continues to be that the clubs should be allowed to make their own decisions on how much to pay riders and who to employ within the points limit set by the BSPA. The owners take the risks and should be given the freedom to decide how to provide their customers with the product that they want.

 

In terms of bringing kids on I agree the costs need to be reduced but a large amount of the cost is in the equipment which obviously impacts everyone in the sport. Ticket prices, riders wages and the clubs financial stability are all clearly impacted by the cost of equipment. Making bikes more standardised and cheaper to maintain would really help the sport but how that can be acheived is well beyond me.

[Swift Saint 186]

Making bikes more standardised and cheaper to maintain would really help the sport but how that can be acheived is well beyond me.

 

Certainly not by making newcomers who are mainly kids have to compete against the free for all influx of PL riders doubling down into the Development League which you advocate Simon.

 

There are many riders without League places without bankrupting any more Clubs in a free for all.

 

Malcolm Vasey

[greyhoundp 990]

Heres my attempt;

 

League Championship < no play off>

Champions Shield < Top Four>

National Trophy < remaining Teams Home & Away KO>

KO Cup, same as currently.

NLRC, Pairs & 4TT same as now.

NL Reserves Trophy.

 

Now the nitty Gritty;

 

40 points limit, 7 man Teams or

42 points limit, 8 man Teams

All Commonwealth riders come in on 5 point assesed, no three pointers for whatever reason.

2 Reserve only races, no tacticals allowed, Ht 2 and around Ht 11 to 13.

Only 1 rider over 25 per team.

1 Commonwealth rider per team.

2 Riders in each team to be 3 point average or under.

The lowest official average to be 2.00 points.

 

Costs need to be kept down, or brought down, how that is achieved is debatable, for promotions, riders and spectators we are all going through tough times.

 

Maybe one thing that could be looked at is the possibility of using 250 cc bikes in the NL, is it feasable or indeed practical..?? That could help riders costs, and therefore promoters costs. For the spectators some incentives like kids for a quid, and if you attend ex amount of meetings you get another at half price, these sort of incentives need to be looked at and utilised.

 

I went to Buxton yesterday a round trip of 150 miles,RAINED OFF, will i go again on a dodgy day, i will certainly think twice about it, but if there was some incentive that would encourage me, instead of closed gates to look at.

[Halifaxtiger 5,318]

Heres my attempt;

 

League Championship < no play off>

Champions Shield < Top Four>

National Trophy < remaining Teams Home & Away KO>

KO Cup, same as currently.

NLRC, Pairs & 4TT same as now.

NL Reserves Trophy.

 

Now the nitty Gritty;

 

40 points limit, 7 man Teams or

42 points limit, 8 man Teams

All Commonwealth riders come in on 5 point assesed, no three pointers for whatever reason.

2 Reserve only races, no tacticals allowed, Ht 2 and around Ht 11 to 13.

Only 1 rider over 25 per team.

1 Commonwealth rider per team.

2 Riders in each team to be 3 point average or under.

The lowest official average to be 2.00 points.

 

Costs need to be kept down, or brought down, how that is achieved is debatable, for promotions, riders and spectators we are all going through tough times.

 

Maybe one thing that could be looked at is the possibility of using 250 cc bikes in the NL, is it feasable or indeed practical..?? That could help riders costs, and therefore promoters costs. For the spectators some incentives like kids for a quid, and if you attend ex amount of meetings you get another at half price, these sort of incentives need to be looked at and utilised.

 

I went to Buxton yesterday a round trip of 150 miles,RAINED OFF, will i go again on a dodgy day, i will certainly think twice about it, but if there was some incentive that would encourage me, instead of closed gates to look at.

 

 

Not a bad stab at all

 

I'd keep the play off for the attendances it brings in, otherwise fine.

 

Not sure about 8 rider teams but 40 points is Ok; maybe a little lower say 38.5.

 

Short term exceptions for riders over 25 who are new to the sport, have been out for a while or have been seriously injured.

 

Aussies/NZ on 7.00.

 

Lowest average 2.00 for 15 or 16 year olds; One 2 or 3pt man per team (don't think we could find 20 odd new riders).

 

I am not sure how to get costs down but recent experience has shown me that they are high. Barrie Evans told me two new carburettors would cost him in the region of £1,000 - I am sure that is more than a car - while I bought a gallon of methanol for Ollie Rayson yesterday - £7. Could petrol engines be an alternative ?

[gsmills 0]

if you think 500 are expensive to maintain then youd cry at 250s, i take the point about more training tracks operating, i was just going on the localish tracks,i think what im saying, is when youve got kids that are riding, even at a training session where adults are about, they seem not to want to be there .talking to other dads the kids seem to be so intimidated.What i would like to see is probaly a 3 hour session before the main practice, just for learners and younger novices,with instuctors for them ,youve got to remember some of these lads are stiil at primary school,there still very young we really do need to remember that,i do know there are exceptions and you will always get that, but if we dont train them as kids we lose them and we will never have home grown talent,im proud of what my lad has acheived but with the right help, what may he acheive

[TMW 533]

As the parent of a NL, standard rider, who has experienced mixed fortunes in the NL. I believe you should not stifle talent and to ban riders from other countries would artificially enhance the standard of the British riders, they need this competition, as part of their development. If this was removed from the league they would only come up against it when hitting the premier league therefore delaying the inevitable. They need the flamboyance of the foreigners together with the experience of the more mature riders. I think where the problem stands is the fact that not all riders develop at the same rate this may be for many reasons. A bad accident which has hampered their development. Financial constraints some riders are more financially viable to bring in mechanical expertise, equipment for whatever reason. If they have not hit the bigtime by 16 they will get jobs and have to hold down fulltime jobs, therefore reducing track time I supose a supporter on that basis or even a club would question a riders commitment but it happens or even just plain old different styles of riding and I would urge NL Clubs to consider that aswell. Of course it goes with out saying that Dale Allitt and KL are doing what they can for Chris and my thanks goes out to them(I have no experience of other clubs)but clubs are under so much pressure to role out the next overnight sensation. Darcy Ward has set the bar a little high. Another reason for development inbalances. Darcy Wards Dad and Tai Woffendens, for that matter, were excellent riders themselves therefore these lads have hit the ground running. Anyway to sumise. Points limits fine, foriegn riders fine, mature riders fine but please don't pidgeon hole the lads and just bare in mind that there are other factors that contribute to a riders development. Just because they are not hitting the double figs at 16 is not necessarily because they just can't cut it.

 

And to Miles I am suprised at the welcome you have recieved at practice sessions and amateur meetings as it has not been our experience. From the day Chris walked into Sheffield speedway track and Ben Wilson took him for his first spin they have been very welcoming. If you ever bump into Team Widman at any of the practices or Amatuer meetings I'm sure they will do what they can to help.

 

Tina Widman

[Halifaxtiger 5,318]

As the parent of a NL, standard rider, who has experienced mixed fortunes in the NL. I believe you should not stifle talent and to ban riders from other countries would artificially enhance the standard of the British riders, they need this competition, as part of their development. If this was removed from the league they would only come up against it when hitting the premier league therefore delaying the inevitable. They need the flamboyance of the foreigners together with the experience of the more mature riders. I think where the problem stands is the fact that not all riders develop at the same rate this may be for many reasons. A bad accident which has hampered their development. Financial constraints some riders are more financially viable to bring in mechanical expertise, equipment for whatever reason. If they have not hit the bigtime by 16 they will get jobs and have to hold down fulltime jobs, therefore reducing track time I supose a supporter on that basis or even a club would question a riders commitment but it happens or even just plain old different styles of riding and I would urge NL Clubs to consider that aswell. Of course it goes with out saying that Dale Allitt and KL are doing what they can for Chris and my thanks goes out to them(I have no experience of other clubs)but clubs are under so much pressure to role out the next overnight sensation. Darcy Ward has set the bar a little high. Another reason for development inbalances. Darcy Wards Dad and Tai Woffendens, for that matter, were excellent riders themselves therefore these lads have hit the ground running. Anyway to sumise. Points limits fine, foriegn riders fine, mature riders fine but please don't pidgeon hole the lads and just bare in mind that there are other factors that contribute to a riders development. Just because they are not hitting the double figs at 16 is not necessarily because they just can't cut it.

 

And to Miles I am suprised at the welcome you have recieved at practice sessions and amateur meetings as it has not been our experience. From the day Chris walked into Sheffield speedway track and Ben Wilson took him for his first spin they have been very welcoming. If you ever bump into Team Widman at any of the practices or Amatuer meetings I'm sure they will do what they can to help.

 

Tina Widman

 

 

Very fine post, Tina