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Could you please clarify a few things regarding the rolling averages

 

 

"As the details of each 2011 Meeting are added, the race details from corresponding meeting in 2010 are automatically discounted from the calculations."

 

So what happens if TOM SMITH rode in all matches bar the away trip to EASTBOURNE last season. ... This season he has ridden in five matches already and then rides in the away match at Eastbourne. ... As he has no score from the previous season to be taken off, which scored does get taken off to include this new score ?

 

By 'corresponding' I mean that when Tom Smith rides in his first meeting in 2011, his first meeting in 2010 drops out of the calculation.(Providing he had done at least 28 matches in 2010)

or as in the case of teams that have switched leagues, many wont have scores from the previous season at that track.

 

 

" If a rider completed less than 28/38 matches in 2010, then all of the 2010 figures will be used up until the total number of matches (2010 + 2011) exceeds 28/38."

 

 

So if JOHN BELL rides in 25 meetings the previous season, will he get a new average after 3 meetings this season ?

John Bell will get a new average on May 1st. If he has ridden no matches in 2011 it will still be his starting average. (25 matches from 2010) In his fourth match of 2011 the first match of 2010 will drop out of the calculations.

 

"Riders on Assessed/Converted averages will maintain that average until they have completed 4H & 4A. All other riders' Rolling Averages will be effective no matter how many matches they have ridden this year with the usual 23rd of the Month cut-off date."

 

1 - What happens if a rider has an assessed average this season but still rode in say 8 meetings last season (4 home and 4 away) .... Will these scores still count towards their new average or will it be the first 4 home and 4 away this season ?

If he rode 8 matches in that league last year, that would be his Rolling Average for this year, he would not be assessed. Only Riders changing Leagues (Or who did not ride 8 matches last year are on Assessed/Converted averages.)

 

2 - Will riders on Assessed or Covertred averages get new GSA's straight away (within 7 dayds of reaching 4 home 4 away) .... or have to wait for the following month ?

Yes

 

3 - Is there any reason why riders that have moved up or moved down wont have their scores from the previous season converted to be included this season ?

You can't convert meeting scores, it has to be points scored in that particular league.

 

 

4 - If a rider was doubling up last season and rode in 10 matches for example ..... will these scores be included in their new average ? .... will they just count the first 4 home 4 away this season ? ..... What will be counted for a rider that doubled up last season but has moved up full time this season ?

If he has a valid Average for that league (More than 7 matches) then that is the start of his Rolling Average for this year.

5 - What scores are used if a rider switches leagues ? ..... will the scores in the one league be used along with the scores in the other league ?

See answer to Q3

 

 

 

There seems to be a few grey areas using this method as a rider could start on a 4.32 average, score 7 points in a meeting, but his average drops down as the meeting being taken off is a meeting he scored 11 points in the previous season .... so just trying to understand the ins and outs to this system.

True, but over 28/38 matches it is not going to have as big an effect as a good (or bad) meeting in the early stages of the season. And at the end of the season, most riders will have an Average that reflects his 2011 performances only, as did Green Sheets in previous years.

Cheers

 

.

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Cheers for those answers Gambo, but just a few queries

 

 

"If he rode 8 matches in that league last year, that would be his Rolling Average for this year, he would not be assessed. Only Riders changing Leagues (Or who did not ride 8 matches last year are on Assessed/Converted averages.)"

 

 

So what is the ruling over Pawlicki ? .... He did 11 matches last season bjut still has an assessed average !

 

 

Will he get a new average when he has done 28 meetings altogether ... or 4 home and 4 away this season ? (as he did that last season)

 

 

 

How many meetings do riders that have switched leagues have to ride to get new averages ? .... riders like Ryan Fisher, Oliver Allen, Ricky Wells etc

 

 

also riders that doubled up, if they rode a few meetings, will those matches count if they step up ? ... like Joe Haines ?

Edited by T.N.T.

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Cheers for those answers Gambo, but just a few queries

 

 

"If he rode 8 matches in that league last year, that would be his Rolling Average for this year, he would not be assessed. Only Riders changing Leagues (Or who did not ride 8 matches last year are on Assessed/Converted averages.)"

 

 

So what is the ruling over Pawlicki ? .... He did 11 matches last season bjut still has an assessed average !

 

 

Will he get a new average when he has done 28 meetings altogether ... or 4 home and 4 away this season ? (as he did that last season)

 

As far as I understand it, Pawlicki started with an 11 match RA which is now a 14 match RA (11 + 3 EL Matches this season)

His 5.00 assessed average seems to be part of the deal struck between Coventry & the BSPA.

 

How many meetings do riders that have switched leagues have to ride to get new averages ? .... riders like Ryan Fisher, Oliver Allen, Ricky Wells etc

You answered that yourself in Question 2 of your previous post! 4H & 4A!!

also riders that doubled up, if they rode a few meetings, will those matches count if they step up ? ... like Joe Haines ?

As I said before..............If they have a valid (8 or more matches) average for that league then that is the RA the start with!

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If a rider has an official rolling average, does their average get updated in real time i.e. After each meeting. Or will the new averages be given on a monthly basis?

 

Thanks.

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I notice on the BSPA site that Pawlicki will be given an average on the 1st of May but thats wrong.

 

17.4.4 A Rider starting the season with an Assessed CMA will have a new Established CMA upon completing 4 Home and 4 Away fixtures, which becomes effective 7 days after the last qualifying Meeting. Should this not be achieved in order to be effective from 1st May, then the MC will issue a revised CMA.

Shamek started the season on an assesed average, so fit into the criteria above. If the rules said that meetings last eyar counted too, then he'd have an average but the rules clearly state anyone on an assessed average only gets an average when he completes 4 home and 4 away and Shamek has NOT completed 4 home and 4 away.

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I notice on the BSPA site that Pawlicki will be given an average on the 1st of May but thats wrong.

 

 

Shamek started the season on an assesed average, so fit into the criteria above. If the rules said that meetings last eyar counted too, then he'd have an average but the rules clearly state anyone on an assessed average only gets an average when he completes 4 home and 4 away and Shamek has NOT completed 4 home and 4 away.

 

it isn't wrong at all according to the last sentence of the rule. It clearly says if a rider hasn't done 4 home & away meeting then a revised average is given from the 1st May

Edited by screamer

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it isn't wrong at all according to the last sentence of the rule. It clearly says if a rider hasn't done 4 home & away meeting then a revised average is given from the 1st May

So Dennis Andersson should have a new average then. And all other assesed riders.

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are used. In speedways case if a rider has a potential 40 meetings a year then the last ten meetings used. I know you have the problem of home away fixtures and riders getting injured but looking at the two years they are using; it is way too long and will not work. A rolling average should change with every meeting rode, not wait until certain dates because then it no longer is a true rolling average.

 

Quite right. Team positions should be selected based on current form. Leaving a high scoring reserve at 6 or 7 is only fair if all teams benefit from this at the same time. Leaving a seriously struggling 1 to 5 in the main body of the team for too long will do no good for his confidence and may eventually result in such a rider being permanently damaged. The principle of rolling averages is OK but it would be fairer all round if it was based on a shorter and more current period

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If a rider has an official rolling average, does their average get updated in real time i.e. After each meeting. Or will the new averages be given on a monthly basis?

 

Thanks.

 

New averages are issued the same as before, i.e. the 1st of the month, with the 23rd of the previous month being the cut-off date.

 

ATB

 

Dave

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it isn't wrong at all according to the last sentence of the rule. It clearly says if a rider hasn't done 4 home & away meeting then a revised average is given from the 1st May

 

 

Can you post a link to the Rule, it would be interesting to see them. ;)

 

ATB

 

Dave

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New averages are issued the same as before, i.e. the 1st of the month, with the 23rd of the previous month being the cut-off date.

 

ATB

 

Dave

Thanks for getting back to me.

 

In my opinion the riders should get a new average after every meeting apart from assessed riders. I guess the only problem with that is the advanced team declaration but I can't see that being a problem we can't overcome. Maybe this is something which can be addressed over time.

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Thanks for getting back to me.

 

In my opinion the riders should get a new average after every meeting apart from assessed riders. I guess the only problem with that is the advanced team declaration but I can't see that being a problem we can't overcome. Maybe this is something which can be addressed over time.

Couldn't agree more

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Can you post a link to the Rule, it would be interesting to see them. ;)

 

ATB

 

Dave

 

It would. I have downloaded the SR for 2011 to find that the relevant chapter 17 to be missing.

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Will Richard become the first victim of the dreaded rolling averages?

 

His official Rolling Average in the Elite League is 4.95, yet his real (unofficial) average this season based on the meetings he has ridden for Coventry is just 3.90.

 

Presumably, if he takes a break then next season he will still be on 4.95, which clearly does not recognise his loss of form - or indeed, as some might argue, a return to a more realistic level?

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Will Richard become the first victim of the dreaded rolling averages?

 

His official Rolling Average in the Elite League is 4.95, yet his real (unofficial) average this season based on the meetings he has ridden for Coventry is just 3.90.

 

Presumably, if he takes a break then next season he will still be on 4.95, which clearly does not recognise his loss of form - or indeed, as some might argue, a return to a more realistic level?

I bang my drum for the last time on this subject. The time sclae used to calc these "rolling averages" is way too long, it makes no sense at all and is totally unfair because riders who lose form are going to be left high and dry on averages that promoters will not take a chance on. Boy do speedway make it hard for themselves!! Between 8-12 meetings should be used. How hard is this.

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