Carter Where Does He Rate With The Great British Riders?

[fatface 2,545]

There is nothing wrong with a healthy discussion, but when terms such as "codswallop" and "preposterous" are used, that's when things get ugly. There are no rights or wrongs when it comes to the opinion of whether Kenny or Joe had the "most natural talent".

If the vigorous terms I have used in this discussion offend you, then I apologise. Bear in mind they are attacks on opinions and not personalities. I wouldn't do that, quite simply because I don't know any of you. So I will just assume you are all thoroughly decent blokes and blokesses.

 

Others have chosen to suggest other people are immature, fawning or even asking whether they are wired up correctly. That's their approach, that's up to them.

 

The statement "Screen is 20 times more gifted than Carter was" is one I would strongly challenge and believe thoroughly justifies the use of words such as "codswallop" in response. Others have gone with "laughable" and "utter tosh".

 

There have been other remarks on this thread that would also deserve a similar response: "Joe Screen has more natural ability in his little finger than Briggo" and "Jason Garrity has more natural ability on a bike than Carter". But I digress.

 

On the "20 times more gifted.." point, I have presented a fact-based argument to validate my view. Others have presented more first-hand and anecdotal evidence in support. You might not like the terminology, but the opinion remains the same.

[ImpartialOne 160]

If the vigorous terms I have used in this discussion offend you, then I apologise. Bear in mind they are attacks on opinions and not personalities. I wouldn't do that, quite simply because I don't know any of you. So I will just assume you are all thoroughly decent blokes and blokesses.

 

Others have chosen to suggest other people are immature, fawning or even asking whether they are wired up correctly. That's their approach, that's up to them.

 

The statement "Screen is 20 times more gifted than Carter was" is one I would strongly challenge and believe thoroughly justifies the use of words such as "codswallop" in response. Others have gone with "laughable" and "utter tosh".

 

There have been other remarks on this thread that would also deserve a similar response: "Joe Screen has more natural ability in his little finger than Briggo" and "Jason Garrity has more natural ability on a bike than Carter". But I digress.

 

On the "20 times more gifted.." point, I have presented a fact-based argument to validate my view. Others have presented more first-hand and anecdotal evidence in support. You might not like the terminology, but the opinion remains the same.

Sorry, I've had another go on the ready reckoner and it's come out this time at 16.46 x more talented.

 

Also, I've just spoken to Joe, he's been to the doctors and apparently the talent has spread from his little finger and is now all up one arm.

[stratton 1,491]

Sorry, I've had another go on the ready reckoner and it's come out this time at 16.46 x more talented.

 

Also, I've just spoken to Joe, he's been to the doctors and apparently the talent has spread from his little finger and is now all up one arm.

I thought there was an air of opology from Falcace fair play he didnt need to all his points valid and made in good faith.Myself and Falcace will have to admit defeat but its been fun all the same.

[ImpartialOne 160]

I thought there was an air of opology from Falcace fair play he didnt need to all his points valid and made in good faith.Myself and Falcace will have to admit defeat but its been fun all the same.

Totally agree on all points, especially the bit about fun, which we should never stray too far from, and the defeat bit.

[stratton 1,491]

Totally agree on all points, especially the bit about fun, which we should never stray too far from, and the defeat bit.

Yep it has been fun,cant win them all i suppose.

[chunky 6,071]

cant win them all i suppose.

 

Depends how much natural talent you've got...

 

Steve

 

 

 

[The White Knight 9,039]

Depends how much natural talent you've got...

 

Steve

 

 

OUCH!!!!

[fatface 2,545]

Myself and Falcace will have to admit defeat but its been fun all the same.

Erm, think you're just speaking for yourself there Sidney. An enjoyable debate indeed, but not one I am admitting any defeat on whatsoever. Where I suspect I will have to admit defeat is to Impartial One and Chunky's propensity for always having to have the last word. In that area, they are formidable.

[chunky 6,071]

Where I suspect I will have to admit defeat is to Impartial One and Chunky's propensity for always having to have the last word. In that area, they are formidable.

 

I don't have to have the last word...

 

Steve

 

 

 

[ImpartialOne 160]

I don't have to have the last word...

 

Steve

That's true.

[chunky 6,071]

That's true.

 

Thank you.

 

Steve

 

 

 

[stratton 1,491]

I don't have to have the last word...

 

Steve

Falcace are you saying Chunky and The Impartial One act as a team?

[ImpartialOne 160]

Falcace are you saying Chunky and The Impartial One act as a team?

That'll be chunky you're talking to then.

 

We did win the Forum Pairs together last year but couldn't compete with Shovlar and Starman this year.

[DaveG 1]

My involvement with Speedway is really from 1974 to 1984 although 73-88 could be claimed and even then I would say that 76-81 were the maga years for me travelling each and every weekend.

 

Ok well as far as British Riders go I posted my top 20 a short while ago and seem to remember that Dave Jessup was perhaps the unlucky man with an EF whilst leading in a World Final which would probably have made him winner.

 

Gordon Kennett is often talked of a World Champion but I was there that night he came second and sort of remember him never being considered during the evening yet being on the Podium at the end smooth stylish great team rider though but did not set that World Final alight.

 

PC well very talented and fearless, Simmons smooth but Kennett like and so many others that was the 1970's really there was a depth of British talent that decade nearly every track had 1 some 2.

 

Now Lee and Carter were the men that should have led the next decade with Lee being the bigger talent than Carter but both were reckless with their careers, lives, skills everything.

 

Simmons, Jessup, Betts, Wyer, McMillan not all World Class and many others but treasured their careers (Simmons later revelations have hurt a bit) was Carter in a hurry maybe was he unlucky well who knows but no more unlucky than the earlier Brits.

 

1960's dominated by Oceanics

1970's Mauger and Scandinavians

1980's Americans and Danes

 

 

And to end with a bit of fun PC couldnt beat Roger Johns round Plough Lane so everyone could have their day!

Edited May 7, 2012 by DaveG

[Parsloes 1928 nearly 495]

Excellent posting from DaveG - a very perceptive account of that era. I loved Gordon Kennett and he was superb around White City (which I also loved) but he was never in truth World Champ material - even though, of course, he did fantastically make second in '78.

Dave Jessup was to me actually a lesser star than Gordon (but that was probably just me!) - but the facts speak for themselves and he was desperately unlucky never to be world champ...