Vince 9,454 Posted February 7, 2013 Are they capable of running meetings without SCB Referees as well? Why not? They could use somebody they consider suitably qualified. Or running meetings NOT called speedway and NOT governed by the SCB rules and regulations on Speedway? Easily because they don't have to adhere to SCB regulations and could draw up their own. Perhaps simplifying things a great deal. Can't wait to see what will happen when the first rider uses a 600cc bike or removes his silencer, or uses one that's not approved under the SCB regulations. Do you really think nobody else is capable of writing a set of machine specifications for the worlds most simple racing motorcycles? While they were there they could use terms like 'all motorcycles must meet a maximum noise level of x db' and let the riders meet that limit how they and the exhaust manufacturers think best! Maybe, without referees, they will run things like in ancient Rome, with the power to decide being given to the fans, based on who shouts loudest? There may even be polls on BSF or the Speedway Updates site to decide on who was at fault for a first bend pile-up with fans voting using their mobile phones...it just keeps getting better. If you are suggesting that they might try new, moving with the times ideas then it is possible, of course not to the extremes you jest about but just maybe some that will see people wanting to go back to their local Speedway track. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reliant Robin 492 Posted February 7, 2013 What a Great idea! Run a handful of meetings that all make a profit and ditch the bread and butter ones where the riders earn their money all season in front of a handful of spectators netting the promoters a loss. All Promoters should do this. Scrap the League, scrap the Trophy, Scrap the teams, just run a couple of profitable individual meetings each year and everyone will be happy. Anybody know the definition of a parasite? Indeed, collapse the Leagues and just let any Billy Big Balls that fancies their hand at promoting events sort out a few meetings a year And yet some still don't see why the B.S.P.A/SCB would want to stand in the way of such an innovative idea. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Backless 538 Posted February 7, 2013 Six round with four wildcards and 12 riders competing in all rounds. That's 36 riders and 6 tacks who are thrown out by the SCB by the time the series is completed. I can't see that impacting much on the premier League - go on then BSPA. The dozen permanent riders including up to now Berwick's #1 and two of the Newcastle side would be banned at the beginning of May as well as Leicester being without a league place. InJune it would be Rye House's turn to be booted out. Yeah, that'll happen. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince 9,454 Posted February 7, 2013 Indeed, collapse the Leagues and just let any Billy Big Balls that fancies their hand at promoting events sort out a few meetings a year And yet some still don't see why the B.S.P.A/SCB would want to stand in the way of such an innovative idea. What a Great idea! Run a handful of meetings that all make a profit and ditch the bread and butter ones where the riders earn their money all season in front of a handful of spectators netting the promoters a loss. All Promoters should do this. Scrap the League, scrap the Trophy, Scrap the teams, just run a couple of profitable individual meetings each year and everyone will be happy. Anybody know the definition of a parasite? Nothing like getting carried away is there! it's half a dozen meetings over a whole season, not a replacement league and it would have to be run with the agreement and assistance of the current promoters whose tracks were being used. Quite clearly despite the SCB's stance there are people within the BSPA who think the series a good idea. Parasite: derogatory a person who habitually relies on or exploits others and gives nothing in return - not somebody who pays for the use of a stadium then. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pandorum 1,259 Posted February 7, 2013 No wonder the sport of speedway is dying on it's feet. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
21st century heathen 220 Posted February 7, 2013 Anyone's opinion on whether or not it's a good idea, whether it would be run legally and/or competently etcetera really is irrelevant. It will surely come down to a statement of fact as to whether the proposed meetings break the regulations that the like of Rye and Lei are bound by. I refer you to an extract from section 4. OFFENCES of regulations which would appear, taken at face value, to clear it up. 5. competing for, accepting or offering to accept, or advertising an award, in the nature of a title or Championship, in respect of a motorcycle competition, unless such award is recognised by the ACU or SCB I note it states "...motorcycle competition" rather than using the word speedway so it doesn't matter what you call it. The SCB has made it's position in not sanctioning the series perfectly clear. So unless there's a right to petition the ACU to overturn the SCB's decision that's an end to it I would have thought. http://www.scbgb.co.uk/pdf/regulations/2012%20SPEEDWAY%20REGULATIONS.pdf Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonyd 165 Posted February 7, 2013 Six round with four wildcards and 12 riders competing in all rounds. That's 36 riders and 6 tacks who are thrown out by the SCB by the time the series is completed. I can't see that impacting much on the premier League - go on then BSPA. The dozen permanent riders including up to now Berwick's #1 and two of the Newcastle side would be banned at the beginning of May as well as Leicester being without a league place. InJune it would be Rye House's turn to be booted out. Yeah, that'll happen. Aside from the points of if the event is legal or not and if it can be run as a speedway event, what about the following. .......... How can they ( BSPA / SCB) boot any club out of the league for having one of these events at there stadium? If whoever owns the stadium gets a call asking them to hire out the stadium on such a such a day for the right price how can this affect to speedway promotion of that stadium? If the speedway promoters are not involved with the running of the event then it is nothing to do with them. If the event was run and succesful and they decided to approach say 20 or more stadiums around the country to run events through the year would they ban all the teams or promoters from the leagues? (ok dont answer that as its like asking the BSPA get a gun and shoot each other in the foot) What happens when these events are run regular at Wimbledon and say Oxford and other stadiums around the country where speedway cannot even get a foot in the door? My view is that the BSPA / SCB are running scared of these events being better organised and attended than anything they can put on and they would rather try and kick it into touch now rather than attempt to talk or work with the organisers. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skidder1 7,632 Posted February 7, 2013 (edited) Well said 21stCH. Does anyone know if the organisers did approach the SCB/ACU in the first instance?? If not, then one has to assume they knew they wouldn't get permission - but went ahead anyway (almost as if they had some sort of axe to grind against the SCB/ACU/BSPA?? Surely not!!!). If they did approach - as I was informed they did! - then one has to assume they were told 'No, go away', or 'Yes, work with us within the regulations' - neither of which seems to have happened!! Either way, it seems that a 'promising new initiative' has been attempted in totally the wrong way and may well fail before its even had a chance. On the subject of tracks, every track has to be given a SCB/ACU track licence in order to operate speedway. Notwithstanding who owns the stadium, surely the contract between the BSPA Promoter and the track owner would include some sort of condition that would stop any 'one-off' competitive events?! From the track/stadium owners point of view, why would you accept a booking for a one-off meeting that could jeopardise the longer term value of the March to October BSPA club contract? Short term gain for (possibly) long term pain!! Edited February 7, 2013 by Skidder1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
21st century heathen 220 Posted February 7, 2013 Aside from the points of if the event is legal or not and if it can be run as a speedway event, what about the following. .......... How can they ( BSPA / SCB) boot any club out of the league for having one of these events at there stadium? If whoever owns the stadium gets a call asking them to hire out the stadium on such a such a day for the right price how can this affect to speedway promotion of that stadium? If the speedway promoters are not involved with the running of the event then it is nothing to do with them. If the event was run and succesful and they decided to approach say 20 or more stadiums around the country to run events through the year would they ban all the teams or promoters from the leagues? (ok dont answer that as its like asking the BSPA get a gun and shoot each other in the foot) What happens when these events are run regular at Wimbledon and say Oxford and other stadiums around the country where speedway cannot even get a foot in the door? My view is that the BSPA / SCB are running scared of these events being better organised and attended than anything they can put on and they would rather try and kick it into touch now rather than attempt to talk or work with the organisers. The circuit would lose its licence therefore the club could no longer operate out of that stadium. In most, if not all, cases that would lead to the immediate closure of the club. Whether you're pro-FIM/ACU/SCB/BSPA or not it does not alter what's in black and white. All licensed circuits/promoters/officials/competitors have accepted the regulations. Rye, Lei and the riders named so far should not have accepted the invite to stage or compete in the series without it having SCB or ACU approval, which clearly it doesn't. Whether or not we, as fans of the sport, agree with the regulations is another debate entirely (and one that comes up about 5 times a week during any average season). *edit* I should state that I understand a rider's 'I just want to ride my bike' attitude but they all have to abide by the regulations and take steps to ensure they're seen to be doing so. In cases like this I'd have thought an email or letter to the ACU/SCB asking whether the meeting is officially sanctioned would suffice. The rider would be able to demonstrate he'd acknowledged the regulations and tried to gain an assurance that it was okay for him to accept the invite to ride. A simple yes or no reply from the ACU/SCB would let the rider know where he stands. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deano 1,318 Posted February 7, 2013 (edited) The circuit would lose its licence therefore the club could no longer operate out of that stadium. In most, if not all, cases that would lead to the immediate closure of the club. So the track could then be forced to run under the other organisation? If Six tracks were expelled for doing this event, they'd run their own mini league not under the SCB/ACU. If fans see it as being better speedway... more would/could jump? Best to negotiate with these people, us as fans can only win surely? We've been asking for a while for a fresh set of eyes and ears to step in and run something. Edited February 7, 2013 by Deano 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince 9,454 Posted February 7, 2013 For years it was in black and white that ACU riders would have their licence revoked if they competed under another organisation, then it was challenged, found to be illegal and changed. Similar thing with tracks. Many things are accepted as unchangeable until somebody challenges them. I just can't understand why the BSPA / ACU would run the risk of toppling their house of cards because somebody wants to put a couple of extra on top. Here was an opportunity for something slightly different to be tried at no risk or cost to themselves. If the series didn't do well they could say 'told you so' and if it succeeded they could pinch the ideas they/ the public liked and use them for their own events. I think they really need to hope that the MCF don't think the issue is worth butting heads over because having given up the opportunity to work alongside them the last thing Speedway needs is division. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
21st century heathen 220 Posted February 7, 2013 So the track could then be forced to run under the other organisation? If Six tracks were expelled for doing this event, they'd run their own mini league not under the SCB/ACU. If fans see it as being better speedway... more would/could jump? Best to negotiate with these people, us as fans can only win surely? We've been asking for a while for a fresh set of eyes and ears to step in and run something. No, because... Under the authority of the Auto-Cycle Union The Speedway Control Bureau is the sole national body appointed to encourage and control the sport of motorcycle Speedway racing throughout England, Scotland, Wales, the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man. Perhaps another organisation could petition the FIM if it felt the ACU didn't have the authority claimed in this statement, and/or perhaps go to court to challenge the ACU, I don't know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Backless 538 Posted February 7, 2013 No, because... Under the authority of the Auto-Cycle Union The Speedway Control Bureau is the sole national body appointed to encourage and control the sport of motorcycle Speedway racing throughout England, Scotland… The MCF isn't under the authority of the ACU. So, unless the ACU are going to recruit Thatcher's SPG to club everyone in attendance,they can't stop the meetings from going ahead. The MCF licence the tracks, set their own standards & regulations (similar to - or maybe better than - those at present) and obtain all necessary insurances. So there's nothing in theory to prevent the meetings going ahead. If the BSPA blindly dig their heels in, they ban around 36 quality riders & 6 tracks from the PL. If that continued to its logical conclusion, there's the basis for a pretty exciting and dynamic league. And another one run by the BSPA - before consideration is given to anyone (rider or club) jumping ship. Still, in the short term, the next MC meeting should be fun: "So, Uncle Len, been doing much lately?" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raymondbudd 57 Posted February 7, 2013 Whilst I'm not surprised at the SCB response I'm astounded by some of the negativity on this topic. Like it or not MCF is a legitimate sporting organisation, running several high profile MX events (Red Bull nationals etc). It's also worth pointing out that its sister company events22 (also run by Matt Bates) are currently running the UK Arenacross series, so far this year events have been held at the 02, Oydessy Arena, LG Arena and this weekend at the Echo Arena. They also run the Weston beach race, which is one of the largest, motorcycle events in the country. My view is that the SCB should explore every avenue to accommodate these guys, whom have demonstrated ability to professionally run events. As a former MX rider I'm not surprised that some of the best talent in speedway comes from this discipline (Craig Cook etc), clubs should welcome the opportunity to work with these guys and tap into the MX talent on offer. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The White Knight 9,039 Posted February 7, 2013 It seems to me that a situation COULD come to pass whereby there is a repeat of 1964 (remember Unlicensed Tracks then). Perhaps another Provincial League type of arrangement is on the horizon. Who knows? We must wait and see. I don't think that this has run it's course yet though - far from it. Interesting times.......................... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
