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The White Knight

European Union - In Or Out?

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3 hours ago, Vince said:

They were going to be disastrously and immediately affected by voting leave as well.

And how are things going now? :rolleyes:

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3 hours ago, iris123 said:

Each country had a choice and the choice was to move in that direction. It was hardly as you say done without anyone’s permission

If Boris comes back from Brussels with a good deal or a bad one will it be with your permission ?

It won't be with my permission, that's for sure.

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3 hours ago, DC2 said:

It’s the choice between whining ninny and getting on with it! 

Errr.. but Remainers didn't ask for all the chaos to be created, and there was no need for it.

3 hours ago, DC2 said:

Not so long ago in my line of work the government replaced a single page form with a 12 page one and replaced an “open market” with anti-money laundering regulations and various checks that I could not charge extra for.

So much for getting rid of Brussels red tape then... 

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2 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

James Dyson still paying tax in the UK (£127 million in 2018) plus all the National Insurance and income tax from those he employees in the UK. 

So why is he headquartered in Singapore then?

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Just now, Humphrey Appleby said:

So why is he headquartered in Singapore then?

Read the discussion on this thread 2 years ago. Its all been done to death, including your two pen'orth

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3 hours ago, E I Addio said:

A survey by the University  of Essex indicated that those whose business involved the EU tended to vote remain and those whose business didn’t involve the EU tended to vote leave.

So the businesses for whom it doesn't matter whether they're in the EU or not, should be able to mess it up for the (usually much bigger) ones who are involved? Wonderful way for UK plc to do, erm... business.

Quote

You can’t make an omelette without breaking eggs and which ever way you break it down, a large percentage are going to feel aggrieved by the result. 

The more I think about this the more that I think it’s been and utter shambles from the start , and by the start I mean John Majors handling of the Maastricht Agreement and his jiggers- pokery  getting it though Parliament . The Social Chapter, or parts of it were the problem then and they’ve been the problem ever since, because the issue was never really sorted from the start.

Which is why you shouldn't change the status quo if a large percentage are going to be aggrieved. 

As for the Social Chapter, people are objecting to have statutory paid holidays which didn't exist for everyone in UK law, amongst many other things that are taken for granted? I don't recall the Social Chapter even being discussed during the referendum, and it certainly wasn't on the side of the bus. 

Edited by Humphrey Appleby

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7 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

He didn’t actually say Rivers of Blood.He made a quote from Virgil which got twisted by the media. It’s all on YouTube.  His choice of language was ill -  considered but he was drawing attention to and quoting from his constituents concerns which is actually an MP’s job. We haven’t seen the sort of racial tension he was alluding to, but what we have seen for example are things like Asian paedophile gangs preying on vulnerable white girls in 24 towns and cities and the authorities turning a blind eye because they didn’t want to “upset the multicultural boat “ 

This is the deeper problem, and it was the same with the likes ofJimmy Saville and Cyril Smith , wrong things go on and the political establishment pretend its not happening. 

Powell was sacked from the cabinet for the rivers of blood speech, and later resigned from the Conservative party over membership of what was then the EEC. He politics can be criticised but not his integrity in putting his career on the line for what he thought was right , pity a few of the modern day U-turners and flip-floppers don’t do the same. 

I can remember the furore when Eric Clapton went off on one in support of Powell's speech at a gig in Birmingham, proclaiming 'we should send them all back'.. 

He admits subsequently to being ashamed by those comments.. 

I don't believe Powell did.. 

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2 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

So the businesses for whom it doesn't matter whether they're in the EU or not, should be able to mess it up for the (usually much bigger) ones who are involved? Wonderful way for UK plc to do, erm... business.

 

 That's your judgment. I was imply quoting the results of their survey , nothing more, nothing less.

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5 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

 

Which is why you shouldn't change the status quo if a large percentage are going to be aggrieved. 

 

 A large percentage were going to be aggrieved when John Major tried to get the Maastricht deal through parliament, that's why he had to turn it into a confidence motion  , threaten to call a general election if he lost and threaten to withdraw the whip from of his party that voted against him.

What you should or shouldnt do is neither here nor there , thats what happened.

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4 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

 A large percentage were going to be aggrieved when John Major tried to get the Maastricht deal through parliament, that's why he had to turn it into a confidence motion  , threaten to call a general election if he lost and threaten to withdraw the whip from of his party that voted against him.

That's was just Tory infighting. I don't remember the public ever getting any vote on the Social Chapter, or it being a particularly emotive subject with much of it anyway.

 

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19 minutes ago, YerRopes said:

I can remember the furore when Eric Clapton went off on one in support of Powell's speech at a gig in Birmingham, proclaiming 'we should send them all back'.. 

Of course highly ironic from a man who appropriated blues music... :rolleyes:

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53 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

And how are things going now? :rolleyes:

Nowhere near as bad as we were assured would happen immediately if the vote was to leave and that is despite the biggest event the financial sector has ever known happening this year which is nothing to do with leaving the EU. However the damage caused by the covid precautions will undoubtedly be dumped into the 'Brexit damage' account by some of you remainers for years to come

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1 hour ago, YerRopes said:

I can remember the furore when Eric Clapton went off on one in support of Powell's speech at a gig in Birmingham, proclaiming 'we should send them all back'.. 

He admits subsequently to being ashamed by those comments.. 

I don't believe Powell did.. 

Powell never advocated “ sending them all back “ , he advocated a more moderate approach to immigration, and he was the MP for a constituency that had a particular immigration problem

Far better a representative that speaks up for his constituents that someone like Gordon Brown who was sympathetic to Mrs Gillian Duffy when she spoke about immigration , then called her a bigot behind her back when he thought he was off Camera.. 

I suspect Powell’s real crime was that as a Cabinet member he spoke out in public rather than raising it in cabinet and accepting collective responsibility , but I suppose he must have known he would be sacked.

Actually I once shared an office with someone who was an ardent member of the Communist Party and he told me he admired Powell, not for his politics but for having principles and sticking to them, which a lot of politicians don’t.

Edited by E I Addio
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58 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

 

As for the Social Chapter, people are objecting to have statutory paid holidays which didn't exist for everyone in UK law, amongst many other things that are taken for granted? 

Legislation on statutory paid holidays has been around since the 1930’s and has been progressively  increased ever since, like most terms and conditions of employment. This has been far more due to the influence of the much maligned trades unions than the EU , especially as the statutory minimum in this country exceeds the minimum under the EU Working Time Directive.

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