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The White Knight

European Union - In Or Out?

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15 minutes ago, falcace said:

Staying with the the facts, leave voters are likely to have a lower educational attainment. If your interpretation is that it relates to intelligence, that's your business

 What exactly has educational attainment got to do with it. Are you saying that it issues are so complicated you need some sort of qualification to understand it ? If so what level of qualification ? If not , then what has educational qualification got to do with it ?

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58 minutes ago, falcace said:

It's a separate discussion, but I have never had a satisfactory answer to why elections are not held at the weekend? 

The argument was that Thursday was the traditional pay day, after which workers would go out and get wasted and forget to vote. It's of course nonsense in this day and age, but the UK nevertheless still conducts elections in the same way it did back in Victorian times. 

Edited by Humphrey Appleby
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1 hour ago, E I Addio said:

 What exactly has educational attainment got to do with it. Are you saying that it issues are so complicated you need some sort of qualification to understand it ? If so what level of qualification ? If not , then what has educational qualification got to do with it ?

I'd say that people who've gone to university are more likely to meet and more importantly engage with people from diverse culture backgrounds, especially from abroad, and have a different outlook compared to those who haven't travelled so far from where the apple fell. They're probably also more likely to be better travelled beyond the usual British tourist destinations, and probably more likely to work for multinational companies. 

That comes with the territory and is not 'intelligence' per se, but simply having broader experience of different cultures and systems. That in turn opens their eyes to the BS that passes for news in the tabloid media, and they grasp there's different perspectives and they're more willing to question. In fact, looking at different aspects of issues is a hallmark of the British higher education system that has served the country well, although sadly slowly being lost as universities become like Amazon warehouses. 

Edited by Humphrey Appleby

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I would say there is no more culturally diverse environment than factories like Fords before that wound  down a few years and you won’t find many  graduates on the factory floor.

On the other hand some of the most banal , empty , conversations I have had the misfortune to overhear have been travelling up to London by train in the rush hour surrounded by supposedly well educated city workers.

The fact is that you cannot compartmentalise people according to background or education. Its comes back to the point I was making the other day about stupidity. People can be clever and stupid at the same time ( as my father in law used to say “ all brains and no common sense). Equally you find plenty of people with  only a basic education but are very astute . You cannot generalise with people.

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1 hour ago, E I Addio said:

The fact is that you cannot compartmentalise people according to background or education. Its comes back to the point I was making the other day about stupidity. People can be clever and stupid at the same time ( as my father in law used to say “ all brains and no common sense). Equally you find plenty of people with  only a basic education but are very astute . You cannot generalise with people.

As I said, it's not about intelligence per se, but perspective. I have more friends and acquaintances without degrees than the other way around, and many are both skilled and knowledgeable about what they do, including running businesses. 

But with all due respect to them, the majority have lived in the same place all their lives, have not travelled much beyond the usual places, or had to deal much with the day-to-day realities of international trade and services. Many may have worked with foreigners in the UK, but that's a different matter to living or working abroad yourself which provides an entirely different perspective. 

The fact remains that graduates are more likely to have experiences of one or more these things, which is why 75% of graduates support Remain and I suspect it would be well over 90% for graduates under 60.  

Edited by Humphrey Appleby
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22 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

As I said, it's not about intelligence per se, but perspective. I have more friends and acquaintances without degrees than the other way around, and many are both skilled and knowledgeable about what they do, including running businesses. 

But with all due respect to them, the majority have lived in the same place all their lives, have not travelled much beyond the usual places, or had to deal much with the day-to-day realities of international trade and services. Many may have worked with foreigners in the UK, but that's a different matter to living or working abroad yourself which provides an entirely different perspective. 

The fact remains that graduates are more likely to have experiences of one or more these things, which is why 75% of graduates support Remain and I suspect it would be well over 90% for graduates under 60.  

Did your friends and aquaintances without degrees vote leave or remain?

Edited by E I Addio

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12 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

Did your friends and aquaintances without degrees vote leave or remain

I didn't particularly ask them because - believe it or not - I don't generally discuss Brexit in the real world unless people ask me about it. I've seen one or two posting silly Brexit-related stuff, but most of us are from a very pro-Remain area where there is a substantial foreign population and the importance of EU trade is quite well understand. Unlike Swindon, we didn't vote to get rid of our car plant. :rolleyes:

What I can certainly say is that I don't think I know a single graduate who supported Leave. 

Edited by Humphrey Appleby

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4 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

I didn't particularly ask them because - believe it or not - I don't generally discuss Brexit in the real world unless people ask me about it. I've seen one or two posting silly Brexit-related stuff, but most of us are from a very pro-Remain area where there is a substantial foreign population and the importance of EU trade is quite well understand. Unlike Swindon, we didn't vote to get rid of our car plant. :rolleyes:

What I can certainly say is that I don't think I know a single graduate who supported Leave. 

I was going to credit that as a serious post until you brought the silly Swindon point in to it.

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4 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

I was going to credit that as a serious post until you brought the silly Swindon point in to it.

Years of witnessing Wiltshire Constabulary brutality, and Rosco pratting around in Easter Triangles does that to you... :D

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6 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

Years of witnessing Wiltshire Constabulary brutality, and Rosco pratting around in Easter Triangles does that to you... :D

I though brutality in Wiltshire Constabulary was nicking someone for riding his bike without lights. Things must have changed since I was last there !:D

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How much longer is Humphrey going to keep saying it was a mistake to leave the EU. Get over it as we are not going back in thank goodness

The facts are we have left and will never go back. 

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Just now, mickthemuppet said:

How much longer is Humphrey going to keep saying it was a mistake to leave the EU. Get over it as we are not going back in thank goodness

The facts are we have left and will never go back. 

What was Shovlar saying about muppets voting for Brexit...? :D

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12 hours ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

Businesses headed to the EU. More Project Reality...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56592411

Excellent and accurate article. Brexit completely wrecking business. So unnecessary to decimate profitable businesses that were bringing jobs and prosperity to the U.K. 

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13 hours ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

I didn't particularly ask them because - believe it or not - I don't generally discuss Brexit in the real world unless people ask me about it. I've seen one or two posting silly Brexit-related stuff, but most of us are from a very pro-Remain area where there is a substantial foreign population and the importance of EU trade is quite well understand. Unlike Swindon, we didn't vote to get rid of our car plant. :rolleyes:

What I can certainly say is that I don't think I know a single graduate who supported Leave. 

I recall an interview with a University student just after the referendum who said that within her group the vote was split and some didn't even bother voting after saying that they would...who have no doubt graduated now!

Edited by steve roberts

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