Jump to content
British Speedway Forum

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, Gavan said:

I find this incredible that some Poole fans can be that daft not to see facts!

2017 Brady Kurtz was not as good as Nick Morris in the top flight. There is no discussion on this its fact

2018 Brady Kurtz has the potential to be as good if not better than Morris is over here.

You cant compare what they do abroad unless your Steve Shovlar who is saying Brady is better in Poland but yet thinks it doesnt matter that Tungate beat Kurtz in the Aussie champs!

If your team building you may well have Kurtz as his average is nearly a point lower and his will go up you would think and Morris may stay the same.

I agree Brady may go on to better things than Morris but at the moment IN THE UK Morris is simply better than Kurtz.......you cant argue that.

Yet the same duo will still claim Kurtz is better.  As comical as it is. 

1 hour ago, BurntFaceMan said:

I actually couldn't care less. It's only when you see Gavan and Steve banging on about who the better rider is that I can't help but wind them up.

At least we are all clear that Morris is the better of the 2 in the UK.  Glad that's sorted. :t:

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, stevebrum said:

Yet the same duo will still claim Kurtz is better.  As comical as it is. 

At least we are all clear that Morris is the better of the 2 in the UK.  Glad that's sorted. :t:

But your view point along with Gavans is flawed.

Who is the better rider? Zagar or Morris? Simple question.  Anyone who knows anything about speedway knows that Zagar is. Yet his average is lower than Morris. He can come into the BV team on an eight. So do you really think Morris is a better rider than Zagar because his average is higher? Or for that matter that Kurtz is currently better than Zagar?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said:

But your view point along with Gavans is flawed.

Who is the better rider? Zagar or Morris? Simple question.  Anyone who knows anything about speedway knows that Zagar is. Yet his average is lower than Morris. He can come into the BV team on an eight. So do you really think Morris is a better rider than Zagar because his average is higher? Or for that matter that Kurtz is currently better than Zagar?

Zagar had an average from the old format of only riding heat leaders,  the same formula that Lindgren achieved low 6 on.

I agree Zagar is the better rider and is World Class. That's why I didn't compare Chris Holder to Morris. There are natural flaws. 

You are trying to compare a 23 year old with more top flight experience with one who is 21 and only has 2 years experience. Yet you would argue the younger with less experience and a lower average (naturally for both) is already the better rider when at this stage of his career in the UK he is isn't. It's fairly simple really. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, stevebrum said:

Zagar had an average from the old format of only riding heat leaders,  the same formula that Lindgren achieved low 6 on.

I agree Zagar is the better rider and is World Class. That's why I didn't compare Chris Holder to Morris. There are natural flaws. 

You are trying to compare a 23 year old with more top flight experience with one who is 21 and only has 2 years experience. Yet you would argue the younger with less experience and a lower average (naturally for both) is already the better rider when at this stage of his career in the UK he is isn't. It's fairly simple really. 

 

 

OK. Compare their averages after two seasons. Morris at the end of his second season was 5.90. Kurtz at the same stage of his British career was 8.08. Now you argue that his average now is higher than Kurtz so he is the better rider, but there is much more to take into consideration.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said:

OK. Compare their averages after two seasons. Morris at the end of his second season was 5.90. Kurtz at the same stage of his British career was 8.08. Now you argue that his average now is higher than Kurtz so he is the better rider, but there is much more to take into consideration.

Two different questions. Who is better and who was better at a certain age are very different.

At the moment, Morris is better than Kurtz in the UK. Indisputable. 

That may change next season, time will tell.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said:

OK. Compare their averages after two seasons. Morris at the end of his second season was 5.90. Kurtz at the same stage of his British career was 8.08. Now you argue that his average now is higher than Kurtz so he is the better rider, but there is much more to take into consideration.

But that is flawed as the years when Brady was riding were against lower riders, most of the top riders had left the UK for the continent.  Next .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said:

OK. Compare their averages after two seasons. Morris at the end of his second season was 5.90. Kurtz at the same stage of his British career was 8.08. Now you argue that his average now is higher than Kurtz so he is the better rider, but there is much more to take into consideration.

why on earth are you going off on some weird tangent to try and argue against a fact!

WHOSE AVERAGE IS BETTER IN THE UK???????

Nobody is saying Kurtz might not average 9 this season and do better than Morris

Nobody is disputing Kurtz does better abroad.

But until he averages the same as Morris or better in the UK then over here he simply is inferior...........end of discussion.

And yes Zagar is better than Morris........but in 2016 the format was different..plus if he averaged lower then Nick then no he isnt as good over here. Surely its not to hard to understand

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, stevebrum said:

Assumed Iversen.

We do know.  Ivan won 6 world titles when the opposition were probably stronger. 

Ivan was totally professional throughout his career. 

Darcy was indeed naturally gifted but lacked the professionalism.

Did not realise he rode for King Lynn in 2017 as number one

, cant remember him scoring much

Edited by hrhbig
missed comment

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Steve Shovlar said:

Guess its down to lifestyle? A nice evening meal out to a good standard restaurant will cost around £2-240 for 2 of us with wine. So 160 a couple seems ok providing the quality is there. 

I was in Padstow recently with a client and lunch cost £180 at Rick Steins restaurant. I guess some people on here think a Harvester or Beefeater is quality eating out!

I went to his place in Falmouth slightly lower key and better suited to my budget!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have been to his bistro in Padstow which is lower key and more relaxed dining. Very nice as well. Not tried the one in Sandbanks, frequented by Harry Redknapp, Graeme Souness etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Steve Shovlar said:

Guess its down to lifestyle? A nice evening meal out to a good standard restaurant will cost around £2-240 for 2 of us with wine. So 160 a couple seems ok providing the quality is there. 

I was in Padstow recently with a client and lunch cost £180 at Rick Steins restaurant. I guess some people on here think a Harvester or Beefeater is quality eating out!

Where are you getting the fine dining bit from Steve? So far they've not told us a thing. For all we know it could be fish and chips with James Shanes!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Gavan said:

why on earth are you going off on some weird tangent to try and argue against a fact!

WHOSE AVERAGE IS BETTER IN THE UK???????

Nobody is saying Kurtz might not average 9 this season and do better than Morris

Nobody is disputing Kurtz does better abroad.

But until he averages the same as Morris or better in the UK then over here he simply is inferior...........end of discussion.

And yes Zagar is better than Morris........but in 2016 the format was different..plus if he averaged lower then Nick then no he isnt as good over here. Surely its not to hard to understand

 

 

But you've been saying the entire time that Morris was the better rider in the UK, not that he was the higher averaged rider in the UK. Kurtz is the better rider, but Nick scored better on average last season.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, BurntFaceMan said:

But you've been saying the entire time that Morris was the better rider in the UK, not that he was the higher averaged rider in the UK. Kurtz is the better rider, but Nick scored better on average last season.

????

so Kurtz in the UK is better than Morris yet Morris averaged almost a point more!!!

please come on get real.....you may think Kurtz is better rider which is a valid opinion.........................but last year in the uk Morris was better.

Your making zero sense

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, BurntFaceMan said:

But you've been saying the entire time that Morris was the better rider in the UK, not that he was the higher averaged rider in the UK. Kurtz is the better rider, but Nick scored better on average last season.

Morris was the better rider in the UK last season. There isn't even an argument to say he wasn't.

When you delve a little the difference was even bigger.

Kurtz

Home Average 8.36 8.80 (with bp)
Away Average 7.58 8.00 (with bp)

Morris

Home Average 8.94 (9.50 with bp)
Away Average 8.61 (9.33 with bp)

Morris is convincingly better than Kurtz on away tracks where he posted an average only slightly below his home one.

Another significant factor is Kurtz's figures are inflated from riding 11 home meetings to only 8 away. Morris on the other hand has 13 home meetings and 14 away. Reality is the gap is bigger than the on paper figures show.

 

Edited by BWitcher
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, BurntFaceMan said:

But you've been saying the entire time that Morris was the better rider in the UK, not that he was the higher averaged rider in the UK. Kurtz is the better rider, but Nick scored better on average last season.

And when meeting Kurtz in heats last season, consistently beat him. Not conjecture - fact!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

×

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. Privacy Policy