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23 minutes ago, Fred Flange said:

Reminds me of woofinden looking for a team place at Belle Vue, which one blithering idiot described as a rider just saying what fans want to hear, ha ha!

I still laugh at that claim, happy memories. Wolves glory year. 

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On 6/11/2018 at 9:55 AM, BWitcher said:

Don't be silly, you didn't do that. Numerous experts on this forum say leaving top riders out doesn't effect crowds!

Seriously though, it's a shame British speedway (league) has sunk to the levels it has. We should be enjoying a Lindgren/Woffinden era at Wolves now that would have been right up with Ermolenko/Correy/Karlsson/Max/Lindgren (perm the relevant two).

Yes, names may increase the crowds but by how much? Enough to cover their costs? Will they use their best efforts or bikes or just use Britain as paid practice?

Anyway, ask Rye House fans what they think. They probably won't be alone by the end of this wretched season. I really wish Wolves and their fellow elite good luck in their star-studded four team league. Should be fascinating to see the 'names' back - every week.....

As ever the supporters of clubs like yours live on in dream land where everything has a simple, easy solution that can be summed up as "If only everyone were as perfect as us". 

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Think Harris to Somerset was blocked because he was trying to get out early before Rye had folded. Not that I blame him for trying. Man has to make a living.  

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13 minutes ago, RobMcCaffery said:

Yes, names may increase the crowds but by how much? Enough to cover their costs? Will they use their best efforts or bikes or just use Britain as paid practice?

Anyway, ask Rye House fans what they think. They probably won't be alone by the end of this wretched season. I really wish Wolves and their fellow elite good luck in their star-studded four team league. Should be fascinating to see the 'names' back - every week.....

As ever the supporters of clubs like yours live on in dream land where everything has a simple, easy solution that can be summed up as "If only everyone were as perfect as us". 

You may have noticed this is a thread about Wolverhampton Speedway, so the topics discussed are relevant to Wolverhampton Speedway. If you had bothered to read what I posted I said it's a shame British Speedway has sunk to the levels it has... i.e. it cannot afford Lindgren/Woffinden anymore.

For 20 years plus the league has been consistently weakened and fans have been consistently lost as a result of it every single time.

Weaken the product, leave the price the same. Fans leave.

Weaken the product, put the price up!.. Fans leave.

Oh, we lost money last year.. I know.. let's weaken the product again and stick £1 on the admission... oh no, more fans leave.

It has been a practice doomed to failure and predicted on here for well over ten years now.

We're now at a stage where the damage done to the sport at the top level is so great we're beyond being able to bring back the top names for most, if not all clubs.

A complete revamp is necessary, possibly a larger league with vastly reduced admission prices is very likely the only shot at saving league racing in the UK. Whether that will work is open to conjecture.. but something radical HAS to be done.

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19 minutes ago, RobMcCaffery said:

Yes, names may increase the crowds but by how much? Enough to cover their costs? Will they use their best efforts or bikes or just use Britain as paid practice?

Anyway, ask Rye House fans what they think. They probably won't be alone by the end of this wretched season. I really wish Wolves and their fellow elite good luck in their star-studded four team league. Should be fascinating to see the 'names' back - every week.....

As ever the supporters of clubs like yours live on in dream land where everything has a simple, easy solution that can be summed up as "If only everyone were as perfect as us". 

:rolleyes:

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24 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

You may have noticed this is a thread about Wolverhampton Speedway, so the topics discussed are relevant to Wolverhampton Speedway. If you had bothered to read what I posted I said it's a shame British Speedway has sunk to the levels it has... i.e. it cannot afford Lindgren/Woffinden anymore.

For 20 years plus the league has been consistently weakened and fans have been consistently lost as a result of it every single time.

Weaken the product, leave the price the same. Fans leave.

Weaken the product, put the price up!.. Fans leave.

Oh, we lost money last year.. I know.. let's weaken the product again and stick £1 on the admission... oh no, more fans leave.

It has been a practice doomed to failure and predicted on here for well over ten years now.

We're now at a stage where the damage done to the sport at the top level is so great we're beyond being able to bring back the top names for most, if not all clubs.

A complete revamp is necessary, possibly a larger league with vastly reduced admission prices is very likely the only shot at saving league racing in the UK. Whether that will work is open to conjecture.. but something radical HAS to be done.

 

I’ve never been that bothered about the price or the standard of riders, but I did lose interest when there was no home meeting for three weeks and the next one was against a weak team with two guests and R/R.

First you get used to not going every week, then you start picking and choosing the meetings you go to, and then even for the good matches you think “can I even be bothered with those now”. Eventually you make do with Updates and the TV coverage.

I think that has happened for Grachan too.

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A shorter season with weekly home meetings would encourage me to return. May to September.

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28 minutes ago, DC2 said:

 

I’ve never been that bothered about the price or the standard of riders, but I did lose interest when there was no home meeting for three weeks and the next one was against a weak team with two guests and R/R.

First you get used to not going every week, then you start picking and choosing the meetings you go to, and then even for the good matches you think “can I even be bothered with those now”. Eventually you make do with Updates and the TV coverage.

I think that has happened for Grachan too.

And me...

And a good 'few' others I reckon...

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1 hour ago, DC2 said:

 

I’ve never been that bothered about the price or the standard of riders, but I did lose interest when there was no home meeting for three weeks and the next one was against a weak team with two guests and R/R.

First you get used to not going every week, then you start picking and choosing the meetings you go to, and then even for the good matches you think “can I even be bothered with those now”. Eventually you make do with Updates and the TV coverage.

I think that has happened for Grachan too.

The points you make are only a catalyst of the points I have made.

The increased guests and R/R came about due to the continued weakening of the product and hence the increase of riders doubling up.

Were the teams of a high quality I doubt missing the odd week here and there would have anywhere near as much effect also. 

It's all a vicious spiral. Quite simply, you cannot hope to run a successful business if you continuously cut the quality and increase the price. Year after year after year it was done... and sadly many lackies on this forum year after year after year kept saying it was the solution. 

Edited by BWitcher
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24 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

The points you make are only a catalyst of the points I have made.

The increased guests and R/R came about due to the continued weakening of the product and hence the increase of riders doubling up.

Were the teams of a high quality I doubt missing the odd week here and there would have anywhere near as much effect also. 

It's all a vicious spiral. Quite simply, you cannot hope to run a successful business if you continuously cut the quality and increase the price. Year after year after year it was done... and sadly many lackies on this forum year after year after year kept saying it was the solution. 

 

Not necessarily. More guests are often due to having more foreign riders with international commitments, especially GP riders, so dumbing down with UK riders (even double uppers) can be better, although I would prefer one big league of 16 or 18 teams with no double upping.

 

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1 hour ago, DC2 said:

 

Not necessarily. More guests are often due to having more foreign riders with international commitments, especially GP riders, so dumbing down with UK riders (even double uppers) can be better, although I would prefer one big league of 16 or 18 teams with no double upping.

 

You're clearly living on a different planet if you think dumbing down and having MORE double uppers is better and isn't the cause of more guests.

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1 hour ago, DC2 said:

 

Not necessarily. More guests are often due to having more foreign riders with international commitments, especially GP riders, so dumbing down with UK riders (even double uppers) can be better, although I would prefer one big league of 16 or 18 teams with no double upping.

 

If you discount double uppers there are less than 100 separate riders currently in Premiership and Championship teams. Enough for 13 teams.

The writing is on the wall, and has been for years.

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21 minutes ago, 847084 said:

If you discount double uppers there are less than 100 separate riders currently in Premiership and Championship teams. Enough for 13 teams.

The writing is on the wall, and has been for years.

just aired my thoughts on a way forward on the Poole 2018 Forum.

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24 minutes ago, 847084 said:

If you discount double uppers there are less than 100 separate riders currently in Premiership and Championship teams. Enough for 13 teams.

The writing is on the wall, and has been for years.

Trying to labour this point for several seasons now.

there just aren’t enough riders of suitable quality to fill all team places unless the race format is decreased. The plan to dispense with the mimimum amount of British riders in reserve is also yet another short sighted approach to something that was working yet dispense with it because it didn’t suit all teams.

Put British riders and youngsters FIRST before you make any further plans going forward.

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1 hour ago, BWitcher said:

You're clearly living on a different planet if you think dumbing down and having MORE double uppers is better and isn't the cause of more guests.

 

Chill, BWitcher, have an ice cold Verdelho and read my post again.  :)

 

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