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So where did it all go wrong?

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8 hours ago, SCB said:

I only had 6 points so kept to generic things. I’d also like a rule that said every returning rider had an x% discount on their average each season. 3% a year. Maybe not a huge amount in year 1 but by year 3 that’s quite a bit, someone like Freddie Lindgren had he not missed a season would be on a 39% reduction now.

 

regarding my old people comments, maybe they were a bit harsh but they’re not untrue are they? Why try and keep old people who will die, statistically in the next 10 years? And you’re not going to attract young people while you insentivise old people. I honestly think the best thing for speedway will be in 10-15 years time when the currently fan base is dead. It will need to start again with a bottom up approach. It can go for loud, dirty, horrible, tattoos like Woffys that you ban wouldn’t like. Rather than this “it’s really lovely” approach is takes now.

They weren't harsh, they were grossly insulting - and yes, they are untrue.

They are also typical of someone who rarely actually attends speedway because  you don't seem to realise just how much the sport needs its older clientele. As someone who does go and goes regularly across the country, without them speedway would be finished. For right or wrong, they represent a substantial part of speedway's attendances and alienating them without ensuring that new supporters are being attracted in their thousands is, unquestionably, more than stupid. 

Take my friend Kirky Lane. Belle Vue season ticket holder, attended at least 70 matches across Britain last season. Pensioner. 

I also don't believe that to attract new, younger fans you need necessarily get rid of the older ones. From experience, the older ones are just interested in the speedway. They don't care what music you play or what happens in the interval. They also wouldn't care if you billed it as an extreme sport. Indeed, many of them would embrace change because they know only too well that the sport needs new blood on the terraces.

Once again, I will point to Isle of Wight. One of their main priorities is attracting youngsters and they put in an awful lot of time and effort in doing so. In the process, they do everything they can to retain their existing fan base and one of the reasons for their success is that they view speedway as a family sport. In other words, it is for all ages.

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9 hours ago, rmc said:

It is fascinating to note that offensive comments by scb can be considered part of an "excellent post". Whatever sense he might make in his other points is devalued by his ignorant use of ageism.

People have a right to enjoy speedway irrespective of race, gender, sexual orientation or AGE. Yes the sport needs a younger age group following it but is that really to be achieved by sneering at the elderly who do attend meetings?

Where do we stop in SCB's nasty little world, an age limit on attendance and proof required of being under what arbitrary age limit he considers 'old'? 

I have to admit though that he is in fact doing me a favour, along with other posters of his nature. For a few years it hasn't been possible for me to attend more than a handful of meetings. Thankfully my circumstances have changed and with it came the joy of being able to start going to meetings regularly again. Then I read things like "Don't worry about the old, they'll die soon" make me realise that I have other interests to spend my time and cash on. After 46 years I'll make that one less oldie to be despised and sneered at in future. 

I agree with all of your comments here Rob but the last paragraph does you little credit.

Basically, what you are saying is that you won't go because of one person's attitude towards the older fan - a person that very rarely even attends meetings.

Bluntly, that's a childish reaction because, as someone who does go, I can assure you that no older fans are 'despised and sneered at'. Quite the opposite, in fact.

The view that older fans are all chair bound with woolly hats and flasks and hate any change or innovation is complete stereotypical nonsense and the overwhelming majority are absolutely nothing like that at all. 

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I class myself as retired and don’t really take any offence from SCB,s post who is just basically putting across his point of view, something we all do.

The sport in this country needs to take a major look at itself and the SCB are just a toy for the BSPA, s latest whim and do their bidding, that point was obvious from the Rathbone appeal decision.

Its abundantly clear those in power on the BSPA don’t have either the ability or desire to sort the problems out and are just concerned with their own clubs.  I disagree with SCB that the rules are OK, they aren’t (they are a complete crock of shyte) but he is right to highlight Lakesides use of their 2018 reserves on old averages which is totally wrong when they have 2017 Premiership averages which can properly be converted.

Averages have always played a major part of UK speedway and quite why riders cannot have properly adjusted averages which shows their averages for the league they ride in and a converted one for each of the others is beyond me in this age where it’s all done on spreadsheets.

Riders who are new to the UK or don’t possess a current average should be assessed at a level which means they don’t give their new team a distinct advantage over others, this farce of riders coming in on averages well below what their ability deserves has been abused for decades and it’s still going on.

i still insist the basic problem is clubs pay out to riders more than they can afford and until they force riders to be realistic I don’t see it improving, if riders cannot commit 100% to their British teams they they shouldn’t be allowed to double up.

 

 

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20 hours ago, Halifaxtiger said:

They get asked :D

So if they talk funny, like with a Brummie or Geordie accent they're telling lies? ;)

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2 minutes ago, Gemini said:

So if they talk funny, like with a Brummie or Geordie accent they're telling lies? ;)

Or refugees from the mainland :lol:

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6 minutes ago, moxey63 said:

Not even on Community Service.

Could be a good deterrent that..

"Commit a crime young man and you will spend the next 6 months going to Speedway"

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On 16/12/2017 at 2:28 PM, PHILIPRISING said:

IF you were a teenager why would you go to speedway?

Course they would..

Every teen wants a night out once a week socialising with their Dad and Granddad!

Don't they? 

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2 hours ago, Baldyman said:

That answer is pretty simple..I wouldn't.

Exactly, because the sport is promoted to your nan. They play music for you nan. They interview dull ex-riders with no charisma from your nans era, the presenter is the same age as your nan and they incentive your nan to attend by letting her in for less.

But if you dare suggest these thing are wrong you may are treated as if you have just said, “all old people should be rounded up and shot”.

They do nothing for young people but you suggest this has to change and the old people come out with their pitch forks. They’re being selfish, the sport is going to die with them but they don’t care because obviously they’ll be dead so why would they care that the sport doesn’t exist in the U.K. any more when they’re gone?

Cue more pitch forks because I’ve dared to suggest again that old people is not a good target audience. Other than Saga what company targets old people? Speedway does it, speedway obviously knows best.

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A load of us at ipswich are trying to drag it forward with our loud obnoxious supporting...not sure all the oldies dislike it..but one did complian we were too noisy and putting her off her knitting.  

I asked my other half's 14 year old if he wanted to come to a match once....he said...nah its full of old people...and boring.   Also....why do you go..you are far to cool for that.

Edited by Baldyman
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1 hour ago, SCB said:

Exactly, because the sport is promoted to your nan. They play music for you nan. They interview dull ex-riders with no charisma from your nans era, the presenter is the same age as your nan and they incentive your nan to attend by letting her in for less.

But if you dare suggest these thing are wrong you may are treated as if you have just said, “all old people should be rounded up and shot”.

They do nothing for young people but you suggest this has to change and the old people come out with their pitch forks. They’re being selfish, the sport is going to die with them but they don’t care because obviously they’ll be dead so why would they care that the sport doesn’t exist in the U.K. any more when they’re gone?

Cue more pitch forks because I’ve dared to suggest again that old people is not a good target audience. Other than Saga what company targets old people? Speedway does it, speedway obviously knows best.

I'm an oldie but cannot fault your argument above.

 

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1 hour ago, SCB said:

Exactly, because the sport is promoted to your nan. They play music for you nan. They interview dull ex-riders with no charisma from your nans era, the presenter is the same age as your nan and they incentive your nan to attend by letting her in for less.

But if you dare suggest these thing are wrong you may are treated as if you have just said, “all old people should be rounded up and shot”.

They do nothing for young people but you suggest this has to change and the old people come out with their pitch forks. They’re being selfish, the sport is going to die with them but they don’t care because obviously they’ll be dead so why would they care that the sport doesn’t exist in the U.K. any more when they’re gone?

Cue more pitch forks because I’ve dared to suggest again that old people is not a good target audience. Other than Saga what company targets old people? Speedway does it, speedway obviously knows best.

I think my problem is that you don't go to meetings so don't have a clue what the music is like, what the interviews are like or what the presentation is like. 

How can you come to an informed opinion about what goes on at speedway meetings if you are never there ? 

I'd say your view is ignorant, out of date and mostly inaccurate.

It is nonsense to suggest that speedway's target audience are those of pensionable age. A concessionary rate applies right across the leisure industry - from stately homes to bowling alleys, from cinemas to sport. I think there is a genuine case to suggest that that should be reviewed but to imply that speedway does those of pensionable age a special favour because that is its targeted audience is rubbish.  

I am unaware of a speedway track that does not offer a concessionary rate to children and many offer family tickets at discounted rate. Isle of Wight, for example, allow under 16's in free and deliberately have attractions in addition to the speedway for them.  Their focus - and they are most certainly not alone - is on children and families.

Craig Cook's night at NSS on Wednesday was attended by those of all ages. We had a top class compere in Natalie Quirk, excellent recordings and funny, personable and honest (occasionally brutally so) answers from Cookie. It was a sell out (albeit that it was free).  Further, I can remember Arthur Browning bringing the house down at Scunny a couple of years ago when being interviewed by Rob Godfrey (no slouch in being drolly funny himself).

Some of the presentation (Birmingham springs to mind, and in an awful coincidence when I was at Leicester they had Peter York) is awful. Some of the music equally so (Plymouth certainly used to be terrible). But to suggest that they are all - or even the majority - like that is simply untrue. Belle Vue, in particular, have hit high standards for entertainment and professionalism.

My view is that speedway does need to attract a younger audience but, at the same time, it needs to keep its current fan base very much on board. In my experience, most of those I know who are of pensionable age share that view and embrace change, not violently resist it.

 

.

 

 

 

Edited by Halifaxtiger
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it's been pretty simple each year the standard has dropped so have the  crowds ...sadly you still have high % of fans ( lets have 7 local lads in the side who will wave to crowd ) who still fail to  see this and  think by getting rid of the top riders and having a weaker product it  will  somehow l bring back the  crowds back and save speedway . 

As long as mind set stays that way then speedway will die .

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1 hour ago, Baldyman said:

A load of us at ipswich are trying to drag it forward with our loud obnoxious supporting...not sure all the oldies dislike it..but one did complian we were too noisy and putting her off her knitting.  

I asked my other half's 14 year old if he wanted to come to a match once....he said...nah its full of old people...and boring.   Also....why do you go..you are far to cool for that.

I have only sat with you once but you were brilliant. My mate from Mildenhall who attends Ipswich who is a pensioner shares that view. 

Speedway's problem isn't that targets old people, but that they are the majority of its support (and by old people I mean those over 40, not those over 70).

It has to find a way to attract younger fans without alienating its current fan base. 

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