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4 minutes ago, mikebv said:

Wow. Really?

I presume Charles must be the '30k' rider he descibes given his level.. (?)

And 30k is still a staggering amount to outlay to compete in competitions that will often have a good deal less than 1000 people watching, (never mind paying out 'far more' as you suggest)...

If you DU you will be racing around 70 to 80 times a season so a grand a night would be pretty much the minimum on average you would need I would think to make an outlay like that worth your while...

And you can also see why DU (and guesting as well), needs to be available as you can't see either league being sufficient in isolation over here, to justify that amount of money being spent (unless you have overseas contracts)..

I presume that kit will then get sold on at the end of the season to help finance the purchase of new for the following year? If so that will offset some individuals costs obviously, but even so there must still be collectively an astonishing amount of money overall being spent each year..

All to seemingly win an ultimate race to the bottom when you look at the attendance levels, track closures over the past few years, vast sums of money put in by some promoters to stay open, and general interest in the sport over here..

Surely reducing these costs (by significant numbers) to compete, must be the largest priority to assist the sports future?

I will give you a example, this year I'm helping Drew Kemp out (felt he was my best option for up & coming young English rider) I have put in the best part of £20.000 & not even scratched the surface as far as all his equipment being at the level it needs to be.

For example 1 new Blixt carb off Joe Hughes £800, that gives you a idea just how much outlay is needed   

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1 hour ago, sommelier said:

I will give you a example, this year I'm helping Drew Kemp out (felt he was my best option for up & coming young English rider) I have put in the best part of £20.000 & not even scratched the surface as far as all his equipment being at the level it needs to be.

For example 1 new Blixt carb off Joe Hughes £800, that gives you a idea just how much outlay is needed   

Thanks for that information. Any chance you can give some examples. I had no idea that costs were like this.

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10 minutes ago, Richard Weston said:

Thanks for that information. Any chance you can give some examples. I had no idea that costs were like this.

if you go on to Joe Hughes web site, it will give you a idea just how expensive items are.

I do a lot of Polish league meetings, the likes of Bartosz Smektala even at his age, the team & equipment he has is just mind blowing!!

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Costs are high at any level. During the winter I built my son a brand new 250 bike every part unused and cost in excess of 7k. Gm engine was over 4K and proceed to destroy itself after 25 laps. Only way to reduce cost is to get lower prices from suppliers, that won’t happen though as the demand isn’t great 

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15 minutes ago, sommelier said:

if you go on to Joe Hughes web site, it will give you a idea just how expensive items are.

I do a lot of Polish league meetings, the likes of Bartosz Smektala even at his age, the team & equipment he has is just mind blowing!!

I will do. Thank. you.

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13 minutes ago, phillwhitewasmad said:

Costs are high at any level. During the winter I built my son a brand new 250 bike every part unused and cost in excess of 7k. Gm engine was over 4K and proceed to destroy itself after 25 laps. Only way to reduce cost is to get lower prices from suppliers, that won’t happen though as the demand isn’t great 

Thank you. I am astonished. I knew it was expensive but these figures are much higher than I could have ever dreamt.

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13 minutes ago, phillwhitewasmad said:

Costs are high at any level. During the winter I built my son a brand new 250 bike every part unused and cost in excess of 7k. Gm engine was over 4K and proceed to destroy itself after 25 laps. Only way to reduce cost is to get lower prices from suppliers, that won’t happen though as the demand isn’t great 

I honestly feel for you spending the amount you have & then having the engine let go

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2 hours ago, sommelier said:

if you go on to Joe Hughes web site, it will give you a idea just how expensive items are.

I do a lot of Polish league meetings, the likes of Bartosz Smektala even at his age, the team & equipment he has is just mind blowing!!

Just had a look £792.00 for a carb, £343.00 for a wheel, £18.00 for oil plug.....:o

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Even a "specialised" for speedway spark plug is not cheap.

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4 hours ago, sommelier said:

 

For example 1 new Blixt carb off Joe Hughes £800, that gives you a idea just how much outlay is needed   

WE. at Scunthorpe, & a few other clubs have similar, a S.T.I.N.G. Fund http://scunthorpe-speedway.com/?page_id=3123 which helps riders in their hour of need.

A few years ago, 1 of our top riders, Magnus Karlssen, who was good friends with the organisers, needed the latest Blixt carb, to "keep up" with others, & was given, from memory, £650 to buy a new one, even back then around 2009-2010.  

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3 hours ago, phillwhitewasmad said:

Costs are high at any level. During the winter I built my son a brand new 250 bike every part unused and cost in excess of 7k. Gm engine was over 4K and proceed to destroy itself after 25 laps. Only way to reduce cost is to get lower prices from suppliers, that won’t happen though as the demand isn’t great 

Yet, strangely, petrol & diesel is now around £1 & £1.05 respectively around our area at supermarkets compared to about £1.15 & £1.20 back in March yet vehicle usage is a lot less. 

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These numbers do really suggest the time has to be right for 'one make' standardised engine leagues doesnt it?

The generosity of the sponsors is incredible but wouldn't all this sponsorship going to the clubs rather than individual riders help the sport overall in the UK?

Seven riders all bringing in an average £70k between them would get a good few standard machines and leave money for spare parts and a mechanic to collectively look after them. And maybe enough to rent a club van to take all machines to the race meets?

Riders could then be salaried, with payments reflecting their position in the team, but with the obvious lack of money being needed to pay for their kit which must make up a significant part of their remuneration package now..

All bikes to have their own passport showing photos, serial numbers etc. And any changes needing authorisation from the governing body, all logged, all with visual evidence and all signed off each meeting by the machine examiner that it all tallies with their records..

Similar to the way F1 shoehorns an individual sport into a team framework. With drivers often paying for their ride by bringing in team sponsorship and then they get paid a 'wage' to drive, and any changes to engines etc must get authorisation..

At the moment it does seem to be a race to no where given one rider will buy one top of the range piece of kit, so the others will also buy it to keep up, meaning nobody has actually moved forward,  but in fact are all actually back to square one.

The only thing therefore moving forwards are the costs collectively across the board, with seemingly no extra punters coming through the door to pay for them..

There must be hundreds of thousands of pounds given to individual riders in the UK by generous backers each year, so maybe it could deliver a better long term return for the sport, and obviously the riders, if it was used more collectively to pay the sports race meet costs and be used for marketing the sport nationally?

Edited by mikebv
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29 minutes ago, mikebv said:

These numbers do really suggest the time has to be right for 'one make' standardised engine leagues doesnt it?

The generosity of the sponsors is incredible but wouldn't all this sponsorship going to the clubs rather than individual riders help the sport overall in the UK?

Seven riders all bringing in an average £70k between them would get a good few standard machines and leave money for spare parts and a mechanic to collectively look after them. And maybe enough to rent a club van to take all machines to the race meets?

Riders could then be salaried, with payments reflecting their position in the team, but with the obvious lack of money being needed to pay for their kit which must make up a significant part of their remuneration package now..

All bikes to have their own passport showing photos, serial numbers etc. And any changes needing authorisation from the governing body, all logged, all with visual evidence and all signed off each meeting by the machine examiner that it all tallies with their records..

Similar to the way F1 shoehorns an individual sport into a team framework. With drivers often paying for their ride by bringing in team sponsorship and then they get paid a 'wage' to drive, and any changes to engines etc must get authorisation..

At the moment it does seem to be a race to no where given one rider will buy one top of the range piece of kit, so the others will also buy it to keep up, meaning nobody has actually moved forward,  but in fact are all actually back to square one.

The only thing therefore moving forwards are the costs collectively across the board, with seemingly no extra punters coming through the door to pay for them..

There must be hundreds of thousands of pounds given to individual riders in the UK by generous backers each year, so maybe it could deliver a better long term return for the sport, and obviously the riders, if it was used more collectively to pay the sports race meet costs and be used for marketing the sport nationally?

But GM engine is basically standard, example Peter Johns only builds one type of engine & that's GP standard for around £5.500 & lets be honest in motor sports that's very cheap. 

Maybe it could be bought even cheaper in Poland of say Ash-Tech or Ryszard Kowalski as based in Poland, labour & overheads much lower  

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So help a rider out to make his way in the sport or put it into a money pit of the club...though can see it might (?) make the difference between the club surviving or not if a large amount of sponsorship is paid.

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