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Steve Shovlar

Belle Vue V Poole SGB Prem. A. 16th April 2018

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1 minute ago, foreverblue said:

I also backed him then at 20/1 but trouble is I have backed him many times since at Cardiff!

Then you shouldnt have. Never try and chase more. He was no price when he became world champ, that was enough for me. The bookies totally overlooked him at Cardiff. They can get it wrong. And when they do like you and me, you jump on it..

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31 minutes ago, lisa-colette said:

Maybe Kyle wanted to stay at Leicester so wasn't like we dropped him for a Pole. We dropped him for another Brit (last season) so you can take that one of your list!

Didnt say you dropped him for a Pole did i?

He isnt riding for Poole this season and MS , who is, will probably do no better.

Yes Kyle might have wanted to stay at Leicester , and who could blame him after the way he was let go last season after all the good stuff he had done for Poole

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4 minutes ago, Starman2006 said:

Who's MS ? Clearly you are not a fan of Kyle's. If he stays injury free he could well finish on a 6 average.. Where's had he not been so unlucky with his injuries and nearly died of Sepsis he would have been banging around the 7 point mark. Who saw him more you or poole fans ?

Where in my post does it not say im a fan of Kyles?

Im agreeing he shouldnt have been dropped last season and i dont see how spanner will do better than Kyle would have done

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Just now, Bald Bloke said:

MS = Spanner :blink:

The only reason Spanner is a better rider because he's had the breaks abroad. Kyle would go abroad to ride in poland, 2nd tier, but he wasnt gurranteed rides, but he went. often  he would go and not get any.

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Just now, Gavan said:

Where in my post does it not say im a fan of Kyles?

Im agreeing he shouldnt have been dropped last season and i dont see how spanner will do better than Kyle would have done

Agreed, the only thing thats held Kyle back is his injuries. Hopefully, this season he will stay clear and regain his confidence. paid 14 the other day is a good starting point..

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8 minutes ago, Starman2006 said:

Thats your opinion, you clearly have a short memory of things and races Chris has produced. But has Kildemand been a world champion. NO.... did you back him at 20/1 when he won the British GP, NO.  I had a good little touch thanks, why, because i really had faith in him and what he could and can do.  Those that have knocked Chris will eat there words, believe me. Had you had to cope with his personal problems his injuries and other problems you would be running for the hills, Well, crawling anyway.. Im pleased you said you will back him as a team member when he returns, clearly, he's not your cup of T.

And I also believe he will have the no 1 race jacket at the end of the season it's all about opinions I'm sorry to say you can't accept other people's opinion . So I think we will leave it there it will be lovely to see kildermand get 12 + tonight ;)

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22 minutes ago, Starman2006 said:

Then you shouldnt have. Never try and chase more. He was no price when he became world champ, that was enough for me. The bookies totally overlooked him at Cardiff. They can get it wrong. And when they do like you and me, you jump on it..

Yes but I always backed him because I wanted him to win anyway just like I did when I back Lindback at Cardiff. Just a bit of fun to me I am not a serious gambler.

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26 minutes ago, Starman2006 said:

Thats your opinion, you clearly have a short memory of things and races Chris has produced. But has Kildemand been a world champion. NO.... did you back him at 20/1 when he won the British GP, NO.  I had a good little touch thanks, why, because i really had faith in him and what he could and can do.  Those that have knocked Chris will eat there words, believe me. Had you had to cope with his personal problems his injuries and other problems you would be running for the hills, Well, crawling anyway.. Im pleased you said you will back him as a team member when he returns, clearly, he's not your cup of T.

Its nothing to do with having a short memory.

Riders eventually regress through age, some sooner than others.

Holder was World Champion 6 years ago so there are now many riders better than him that havent won a world title, Zmarzlik, Dudek being just a couple but there is a long list. Holder was very lucky to get his GP place back so the fact he has been World Champion and Kildemand hasnt is irrelevant. 

He has had plenty of stuff to deal with, personal issues and injuries but i just don think he will ever hit the heights again.

On the other hand will be a good solid heat leader for Poole and will help the other guys. Will he score more than PK? Doubtful

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6 hours ago, BurntFaceMan said:

But where do you draw the line? Newman rode with us for years and unfortunately he wasn't really making any progress. Don't get me wrong, I liked the lad and I was sad to see him go, but surely Brits should need to earn their position just like any other rider? Surely if the position is given to them purely for being British, where is the motivation to excel or push forward? Without that motivation it's just charity.

I know it's hard to be open minded when it comes to Brit's, but I just don't believe in gifting positions purely because they are British. I don't think it motivates them to succeed and I don't think it encourages them to be real sportsman. I do agree that they should be given a chance, but surely a season is a chance? 2 seasons? 3 seasons?

The trouble was that Newman was as often out as in. Consistent team places and progression is what these Brits need to continue to make their way forward at the top level. Kyle had been making progress particularly in reserve however it's when he was moved up that he struggled and often binned at that point.  That's exactly the point they need support for the long term goal. If you plan to just win and short term goals about winning every season then it's unlikely any Brit will be about long enough to move forward. 

The examples of Ellis and Howarth are perfect examples. Both their clubs stood by them despite some patchy form and both are still improving and becoming bona fide top flight riders. It's clear British riders need all the top flight help they can if we are to ever challenge on the big stage again. 

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Belle Vue stood by Cook and Worrall during their formative years because they could see the talent they possessed and are now doing the same with Bewley and Bickley.

It's in the best interests of the club and UK Speedway to put the time and effort into developing British talent but unfortunately some teams prefer to bring in a stream of foreigners and to disregard the need to help young Brits progress.

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4 minutes ago, Aces51 said:

Belle Vue stood by Cook and Worrall during their formative years because they could see the talent they possessed and are now doing the same with Bewley and Bickley.

It's in the best interests of the club and UK Speedway to put the time and effort into developing British talent but unfortunately some teams prefer to bring in a stream of foreigners and to disregard the need to help young Brits progress.

This is a team sport and therefore it is important to put out the strongest 7 riders possible, regardless of nationality.

If British riders are good enough they will get a team berth. If a foriegn rider gets a team spot over a Brit is is because he is a better rider. The top flight in British speedway is not a training ground. British riders don’t have some god given right to get a spot. They have to earn it.

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13 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said:

This is a team sport and therefore it is important to put out the strongest 7 riders possible, regardless of nationality.

If British riders are good enough they will get a team berth. If a foriegn rider gets a team spot over a Brit is is because he is a better rider. The top flight in British speedway is not a training ground. British riders don’t have some god given right to get a spot. They have to earn it.

Totally wrong   how many average foreigners have Poole employed over the years quite a few.You need to look LONGTERM Belle Vue have proved it can be done have faith in the Brits your side on the other hand only employed Brits if they fitted in with the averages Starke, Newman, Howarth,Ellis  all treated shabbily.

Edited by Sidney the robin
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26 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

Totally wrong   how many average foreigners have Poole employed over the years quite a few.You need to look LONGTERM Belle Vue have proved it can be done have faith in the Brits your side on the other hand only employed Brits if they fitted in with the averages Starke, Newman, Howarth,Ellis  all treated shabbily.

How many titles have Belle vue won since the millenium? How many have Poole won?

Its a sport. In it to win it! If other clubs want to bring on thd young Brits good for them. But I would rather have our stuffed trophy cabinet full of league titles. 

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59 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said:

This is a team sport and therefore it is important to put out the strongest 7 riders possible, regardless of nationality.

If British riders are good enough they will get a team berth. If a foriegn rider gets a team spot over a Brit is is because he is a better rider. The top flight in British speedway is not a training ground. British riders don’t have some god given right to get a spot. They have to earn it.

That's just rubbish. As Sidney has rightly pointed out many foreigners have been employed when Brits just as good or better have been available. I understand your philosophy of win at all costs but it is just plain wrong if you want the sport here to prosper. It was no coincidence that the last boom in the 70's coincided with a period when British riders were the best in the world. A successful British team gets the national media interested, which increases crowds. The selfish attitude of we've got a full trophy cabinet does nothing for anybody other than your team and now the novelty has worn off and the running streak faltered your crowds are also suffering.

Edited by Aces51
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