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Phil The Ace

Fixed race nights... early indications!!!

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Daniel Smith said:

Bring in fixed race night's Monday, Thursday & Friday.

Premiership takes rider priority over Championship fixtures.

Rider's racing in Polish Ekstraliga on Friday fixtures are granted a facility.

Monday - Wolverhampton 

Thursday - King's Lynn, Poole (Swindon)

Friday - Belle Vue, Somerset, Leicester (Rye House)

Questions remain over Rye House and Swindon's future. Other clubs may want to step up.

If neither come to tapes in 2019 it will be 1 big league, home and away twice, no cup matches. The fixed race night's can still come into play as weekend fixtures are getting less in the Championship. 

No 'facilities' for anything...

All that has ever done is create an opportunity to cut corners, fudge issues, deliver sharp practice, and always play the 'aah but this is Speedway' get out of jail card, that allows nonsense decisions to happen under an alleged concept of a professionally administrated sport..

Sod the rest of the World. .

Look after No1...

I don't seek permission off my competitors when I can open my business..

If I did they would want me to open from 11pm to 6am whilst they all opened 6am to 11pm...

Simply run whatever night gives you the best crowd. .

Publish a fixture list well in front of the rest of the European Leagues, (before the end of this season?), avoiding all 2019 FIM meetings....

And inform the riders of the fixtures before this season ends..

Tell the riders that when they sign up that they must ride in 100% of the meetings and any messing around, for example,  being injured over here whilst riding elsewhere, will see them with a 12 month ban..

If DU is a 'necessary evil' then no fixtures should ever take place that means any rider needs to be in two places at once....

Run seven man teams, six man teams, five man teams etc etc. (Delete as applicable), Just as long as enough riders of a similar ability level take to the track most heats in every meeting..

Run one league, two leagues, three leagues, four leagues etc etc (Delete as applicable). Just as long as the League itself has credibilty and integrity, therefore meaning there is some actual value in actually winning the damn thing..

And maybe even bring in a salary cap with punitive action if any team flouts it...

Charge max £15 for adults in the 'top league' and kids in for free..

Budget for 1200 punters (on your best night for Speedway surely possible?) meaning you take circa £14.4k after VAT on admission. Any programme profit, car park, bar take (if applicable) etc is extra, as is any sponsorship..

That £14.4k would deliver around £10k to pay riders for the home and away meeting if costs were around £4.4k..

'IF' the numbers add up then simply build your teams with riders willing to ride at least twice a week for this money, how many actual riders per team to be determined by your £5k a night budget not by "we have to have seven because......"

In short, run at whatever standard is affordable to deliver a realistic price point of admission, on nights you can attract your most income, and ensure what you put out in front of the fans has the credibility and integrity expected of a bona fide Sporting Championship..

Must be worth a try surely? 

For once....

 

Edited by mikebv
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1 hour ago, Daniel Smith said:

Bring in fixed race night's Monday, Thursday & Friday.

Premiership takes rider priority over Championship fixtures.

Rider's racing in Polish Ekstraliga on Friday fixtures are granted a facility.

Monday - Wolverhampton 

Thursday - King's Lynn, Poole (Swindon)

Friday - Belle Vue, Somerset, Leicester (Rye House)

Questions remain over Rye House and Swindon's future. Other clubs may want to step up.

If neither come to tapes in 2019 it will be 1 big league, home and away twice, no cup matches. The fixed race night's can still come into play as weekend fixtures are getting less in the Championship. 

What if the Championship clubs say no thanks to 1 big league - whether there is 5 6 7 or 8 left sort yourselves out.....

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2 minutes ago, dontforgetthefueltapsbruv said:

What if the Championship clubs say no thanks to 1 big league - whether there is 5 6 7 or 8 left sort yourselves out.....

Won't happen..

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50 minutes ago, mikebv said:

No 'facilities' for anything...

All that has ever done is create an oportunity to cut corners, fudge issues, deliver sharp practice, and always play the 'aah but this is Speedway' get out of jail card, that allows nonsense decisions to happen under an alleged concept of a professionally administrated sport..

Sod the rest of the World. .

Look after No1...

I don't seek permission off my competitors when I can open my business..

If I did they would want me to open from 11pm to 6am whilst they all opened 6am to 11pm...

Simply run whatever night gives you the best crowd. .

Publish a fixture list well in front of the rest of the European Leagues, (before the end of this season?), avoiding all 2019 FIM meetings....

And inform the riders of the fixtures before this season ends..

Tell the riders that when they sign up that they must ride in 100% of the meetings and any messing around, for example,  being injured over here whilst riding elsewhere, will see them with a 12 month ban..

If DU is a 'necessary evil' then no fixtures should ever take place that means any rider needs to be in two places at once....

Run seven man teams, six man teams, five man teams etc etc. (Delete as applicable), Just as long as enough riders of a similar ability level take to the track most heats in every meeting..

Run one league, two leagues, three leagues, four leagues etc etc (Delete as applicable). Just as long as the League itself has credibilty and integrity, therefore meaning there is some actual value in actually winning the damn thing..

And maybe even bring in a salary cap with punitive action if any team flouts it...

Charge max £15 for adults in the 'top league' and kids in for free..

Budget for 1200 punters (on your best night for Speedway surely possible?) meaning you take circa £14.4k after VAT on admission. Any programme profit, car park, bar take (if applicable) etc is extra, as is any sponsorship..

That £14.4k would deliver around £10k to pay riders for the home and away meeting if costs were around £4.4k..

'IF' the numbers add up then simply build your teams with riders willing to ride at least twice a week for this money, how many actual riders per team to be determined by your £5k a night budget not by "we have to have seven because......"

In short, run at whatever standard is affordable to deliver a realistic price point of admission, on nights you can attract your most income, and ensure what you put out in front of the fans has the credibility and integrity expected of a bona fide Sporting Championship..

Must be worth a try surely? 

For once....

 

Great post. Straight from "The Donald" playbook, Make British Speedway Great Again.

Time to think not only of us first, but only us.

 

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1 hour ago, mikebv said:

No 'facilities' for anything...

All that has ever done is create an oportunity to cut corners, fudge issues, deliver sharp practice, and always play the 'aah but this is Speedway' get out of jail card, that allows nonsense decisions to happen under an alleged concept of a professionally administrated sport..

Sod the rest of the World. .

Look after No1...

I don't seek permission off my competitors when I can open my business..

If I did they would want me to open from 11pm to 6am whilst they all opened 6am to 11pm...

Simply run whatever night gives you the best crowd. .

Publish a fixture list well in front of the rest of the European Leagues, (before the end of this season?), avoiding all 2019 FIM meetings....

And inform the riders of the fixtures before this season ends..

Tell the riders that when they sign up that they must ride in 100% of the meetings and any messing around, for example,  being injured over here whilst riding elsewhere, will see them with a 12 month ban..

If DU is a 'necessary evil' then no fixtures should ever take place that means any rider needs to be in two places at once....

Run seven man teams, six man teams, five man teams etc etc. (Delete as applicable), Just as long as enough riders of a similar ability level take to the track most heats in every meeting..

Run one league, two leagues, three leagues, four leagues etc etc (Delete as applicable). Just as long as the League itself has credibilty and integrity, therefore meaning there is some actual value in actually winning the damn thing..

And maybe even bring in a salary cap with punitive action if any team flouts it...

Charge max £15 for adults in the 'top league' and kids in for free..

Budget for 1200 punters (on your best night for Speedway surely possible?) meaning you take circa £14.4k after VAT on admission. Any programme profit, car park, bar take (if applicable) etc is extra, as is any sponsorship..

That £14.4k would deliver around £10k to pay riders for the home and away meeting if costs were around £4.4k..

'IF' the numbers add up then simply build your teams with riders willing to ride at least twice a week for this money, how many actual riders per team to be determined by your £5k a night budget not by "we have to have seven because......"

In short, run at whatever standard is affordable to deliver a realistic price point of admission, on nights you can attract your most income, and ensure what you put out in front of the fans has the credibility and integrity expected of a bona fide Sporting Championship..

Must be worth a try surely? 

For once....

 

So, you basically saying f-off FIM nobody is taking priority over British Speedway?

With Sweden given priority on Tuesday, Denmark Wednesday and Poland Friday, Saturday and Sunday how is your little plan gonna stand up???

Where do you stand with Robert Lambert and Dan Bewley likely to get Ekstraliga contracts next season? You want them banned right???

You want rid of Brady Kurtz, Jack Holder, Max Frick, etc just because they have Ekstraliga jobs.

You'd ban rider's for signing with Polish Liga 1 and 2 teams??

The FIM have implemented priority race days for a reason, British Speedway doesn't get any for weekend days so we have to work with what we've got. 

We're not in a position or have enough rider's available to force total 100% commitment to UK fixtures except for Monday and Thursday fixtures. 

You throw in a 100% commitment rule there will be far more teams fold than continuing with fixed race night's. 

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9 hours ago, dontforgetthefueltapsbruv said:

What if the Championship clubs say no thanks to 1 big league - whether there is 5 6 7 or 8 left sort yourselves out.....

Therein lies another problem in itself.

Genuine question, as I don't really follow the Chanpionship anymore - what is the general view on crowds like? And are teams believed to be making profit (or at least breaking even) or are they running at a loss?

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27 minutes ago, Najjer said:

Therein lies another problem in itself.

Genuine question, as I don't really follow the Chanpionship anymore - what is the general view on crowds like? And are teams believed to be making profit (or at least breaking even) or are they running at a loss?

A number only getting crowds of 3-500 

For them 1 big league would likely cost more and therefore I cant see them going for it

My team Ipswich I estimate 11-1200 is the norm so we may be in a better position than most but I can see us showing loyalty to the Championship needs when it comes to any crunch moment

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6 hours ago, mikebv said:

I liken British Speedways problems to the British Superbikes series' predicament in the early nineties....

When Carl Fogarty was in his pomp and Sky fell in love with the World Superbikes series, giving it the massive exposure which resulted in 'Foggy' becoming a well known sportsman across all mainstream sport followers. BSB didnt try and compete.

How could it? WSB had the best riders, BSB had the next level down. But instead of trying to match the WSB they ensured they delivered a great weekend of racing with the calibre of rider that they had which then grew their own 'brand'...

They also realised that inevitably their best would eventually go off to seek fame and fortune in the WSB or Moto GP and test themselves in the 'higher standard' of racing.

Therefore BSB invested in plenty of track time over their race weekends for the next generation of riders. With standard 'out of the box' one make Championships included to keep costs down and attract 'entry level' riders in..

The result? Thousands still attend their race weekends and plenty of British lads have made succesful careers racing at no more than a 'domestic' level..

If the likes of Dan and Robert can earn vast amounts elsewhere and improve quicker by racing against the Worlds best then good luck to them. 100% let them ride in the 'WSB' that is Poland..

However any rider wanting to ride in the 'BSB' of British Speedway needs to understand that British Speedway, and that alone, is his priority..

British Speedway has two options...

Run itself like a 'proper team sport' on days and nights it's fan base can attend,  paying for itself from an income delivered via a price point the fan base sees as value for money, and be as radical in delivering this as they need to be..

Or...

Carry on doing what it always has....

And we know how tremendously successful that has been...

The current model simply does not work and is miles away from what they need..

And as is blatantly obvious. The sport is down to the bare bones of its fan base..

Opening Friday and Saturday nights, and Sunday days, are a one million percent fundamental necessity for any business running in the entertainment sector, which is unsurprisingly why Poland (and Motor Racing in general) choose them! 

(How strange?!)....:rolleyes:

Simple choice... 

Find a way to use the weekends more, and let all tracks run on nights they know will get their biggest income...

Or....

Carry on cobbling together Mickey Mouse Team Speedway meetings in front of an ever reducing fan base, running the meetings on days/nights to suit the riders but not their customers, at a far too high a price point for those customers to recognise it as value for money.

I would humbly suggest that if they keep doing the latter, it can really only end one way..

Regardless of opinion, that just isn't possible and against FIM rule. Simple as that.

British Speedway cannot force any rider to prioritise. Get called up by Swedish, Danish, Polish leagues on their race day's British clubs have no choice but to release the rider.

You can't just make up some nonsensical idea and disregard regulations. 

All that will happen is rider's will sign British contracts, get race sharp, sign secret contracts abroad and when the seasons kick off abroad in May throw British Speedway into a frenzy.

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6 hours ago, Najjer said:

Therein lies another problem in itself.

Genuine question, as I don't really follow the Chanpionship anymore - what is the general view on crowds like? And are teams believed to be making profit (or at least breaking even) or are they running at a loss?

It’s really not a one league problem tho. You only have to see the pleading reports from Championship and NL promoters to know that no one league is in a better shape.

the problem is the standard is dropping in the top flight but generally stronger in the lower league than years gone by yet prices are ridiculous for both tiers. Championship is overpriced imho.

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37 minutes ago, stevebrum said:

It’s really not a one league problem tho. You only have to see the pleading reports from Championship and NL promoters to know that no one league is in a better shape.

the problem is the standard is dropping in the top flight but generally stronger in the lower league than years gone by yet prices are ridiculous for both tiers. Championship is overpriced imho.

I quite agree, and that was why I was wondering how the Championship crowds were. Rumours of 300-500 is frankly shocking.

Using Somerset as an example, it was £15 in the 2nd division and now £17 on the top division. So is the top division under priced or the 2nd division over priced as there is still a considerable gap in standard between them.

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4 minutes ago, Najjer said:

I quite agree, and that was why I was wondering how the Championship crowds were. Rumours of 300-500 is frankly shocking.

Using Somerset as an example, it was £15 in the 2nd division and now £17 on the top division. So is the top division under priced or the 2nd division over priced as there is still a considerable gap in standard between them.

It’s always been the middle tier that is the most selfish of the leagues.

All leagues want only what’s best for themselves, that’s why the sport is in such a precarious state, and been heading that way for many a year now.

How they arrest the issue is anyone’s guess but no one league is to blame. Whatever IS done should ensure it’s suits all parties.

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7 minutes ago, Najjer said:

I quite agree, and that was why I was wondering how the Championship crowds were. Rumours of 300-500 is frankly shocking.

Using Somerset as an example, it was £15 in the 2nd division and now £17 on the top division. So is the top division under priced or the 2nd division over priced as there is still a considerable gap in standard between them.

£18.50 at gate,or £17.50+.50p booking fee at Armadale,certainly curtailed my visits as a regular neutral visitor,but if that what it takes to survive in Championship there is no way they would want to move up IMO .

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I think there are some good ideas on this thread, especially Daniel Smith. There needs to be a top league and a second league, but the fixed race night has to include a Friday. Belle Vue and Somerset would be more viable on that night. Rye House and Leicester are never top league circuits, they don’t have the support, whilst Ipswich and Glasgow certainly do. Ipswich on a Thursday and Glasgow on a Friday would work. The fundamental problem though is a lack of UK riders to fill the teams, we need to generate more of them so we are less reliant on riders who will have competing continental fixtures, even the mid range ones. Watering down to one big league only means more and more teams racing to crowds of 500 as their support dwindles due to the lesser and lesser quality on show. 

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Posted (edited)
On ‎6‎/‎29‎/‎2018 at 4:00 AM, mikebv said:

I liken British Speedways problems to the British Superbikes series' predicament in the early nineties....

When Carl Fogarty was in his pomp and Sky fell in love with the World Superbikes series, giving it the massive exposure which resulted in 'Foggy' becoming a well known sportsman across all mainstream sport followers. BSB didnt try and compete.

How could it? WSB had the best riders, BSB had the next level down. But instead of trying to match the WSB they ensured they delivered a great weekend of racing with the calibre of rider that they had which then grew their own 'brand'...

They also realised that inevitably their best would eventually go off to seek fame and fortune in the WSB or Moto GP and test themselves in the 'higher standard' of racing.

Therefore BSB invested in plenty of track time over their race weekends for the next generation of riders. With standard 'out of the box' one make Championships included to keep costs down and attract 'entry level' riders in..

The result? Thousands still attend their race weekends and plenty of British lads have made succesful careers racing at no more than a 'domestic' level..

If the likes of Dan and Robert can earn vast amounts elsewhere and improve quicker by racing against the Worlds best then good luck to them. 100% let them ride in the 'WSB' that is Poland..

However any rider wanting to ride in the 'BSB' of British Speedway needs to understand that British Speedway, and that alone, is his priority..

British Speedway has two options...

Run itself like a 'proper team sport' on days and nights it's fan base can attend,  paying for itself from an income delivered via a price point the fan base sees as value for money, and be as radical in delivering this as they need to be..

Or...

Carry on doing what it always has....

And we know how tremendously successful that has been...

The current model simply does not work and is miles away from what they need..

And as is blatantly obvious. The sport is down to the bare bones of its fan base..

Opening Friday and Saturday nights, and Sunday days, are a one million percent fundamental necessity for any business running in the entertainment sector, which is unsurprisingly why Poland (and Motor Racing in general) choose them! 

(How strange?!)....:rolleyes:

Simple choice... 

Find a way to use the weekends more, and let all tracks run on nights they know will get their biggest income...

Or....

Carry on cobbling together Mickey Mouse Team Speedway meetings in front of an ever reducing fan base, running the meetings on days/nights to suit the riders but not their customers, at a far too high a price point for those customers to recognise it as value for money.

I would humbly suggest that if they keep doing the latter, it can really only end one way..

im not saying all these are the right ideas but we should be looking into them but as we keep seeing the usual same responses " you cant do this, you cant do that, the riders need to earn a living, bla bla bla " the sport is almost rock bottom so really nothing is off limits and only this poster and j chapman seem to be offering any real ideas the rest just sound like a speedway AGM where tinkering with small things are seen a major restructuring, speedway "as we know it" in Britain is all but dead so nothing should be dismissed no matter who it upsets, everything  riders, tracks, bikes, finances, presentation, league structure and even looking into some of the people who work within speedway, are they the right people ? the whole lot should be discussed and acted on in an AGM  straight after the last match of the season    

Edited by THE DEAN MACHINE
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