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mickthemuppet

Fixed night farce-how much longer

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On ‎6‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 10:47 AM, Skidder1 said:

Absolutely. Couldn't agree more.

The previously agreed (with the FIM) Mon/Thurs for the Premiership was primarily to give priority to the senior UK racing on those nights, by avoiding the majority of other European league fixtures ie Sweden Tuesday; Denmark Weds/Fri; Poland Fri/Sat/Sun.

An added benefit would be a reduced reliance on guests for missing doubling up/down riders.

Another side benefit might have been to attract more of the 'top' riders - but because some clubs couldn't afford them the BSPA chose to introduce the only 'one over the 8' rule'!

 

As for 2019, who knows?! With the likes of Belle Vue and Rye House in particular suffering huge downturns in attendance and undoubtedly losing money hand over fist but with TV currently requiring a 'top' league goodness knows what the league set up will be? Maybe one league of 4-5 rider teams?!

Most fans have been calling for fixed race nights for years ! Would Belle Vue or Rye House be any better off if the fixed race nights were Monday and Thursday, probably not. Unfortunately you can't have fixed race nights and weekend speedway unless we want to go back to the previous situation of three guests in every meeting to cover for riders riding in the lower league which fans don't want. The only answer is one big league which it seems some fans and the broadcasters don't want

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We'll just have to dream on until the next Big Decision Making Conference takes place and try to hope that the Promoters all take and wear their Thinking Caps. They certainly didn't pack them last time. They won't be having a drink in the Last Chance Saloon, because it has closed down due to lack of patrons. Hmmm. 

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Stick with it. And in time if the product is right then people will get used to Monday’s and wednesdays. As for the Denmark thing. It’s much easier to say to somebody that a danish rider is required to ride in his home country than it is to explain that a 2nd tier team has 1st choice over a rider. This isn’t as broke as people are making out. It’s just speedway is poorly marketed. Look at the son for example. While we are all going crazy on the edge of our seats nobody knows we even exist. That’s why we have poor attendances because nobody knows, and those that do see 18 pounds per adult and that’s a sum of money you have to consider before spending. If this fixed race night thing and new branding of the league thing was done right then the right people would be spoken to to get news paper inches. Goes for this national side too. While there are loads of positives I don’t see any awareness in terms of the outside world. If there was then Bellevue’s gates would double after witnessing the last few tv meetings there

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It doesn't matter what you do or how good the product is you simply won't get the crowd on a Monday that you would on a Friday, Saturday or Sunday. People have a limited amount of money to spend on sport, entertainment or leisure activities and most of it is spent at the weekend. It's common sense that people are more likely to go out when they have no work or school for their children the next day.

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How ironic two clubs that have spent big money but both are having poor attendances recently .......Belle vue and Glasgow :neutral:

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40 minutes ago, Aces51 said:

It doesn't matter what you do or how good the product is you simply won't get the crowd on a Monday that you would on a Friday, Saturday or Sunday. People have a limited amount of money to spend on sport, entertainment or leisure activities and most of it is spent at the weekend. It's common sense that people are more likely to go out when they have no work or school for their children the next day.

And the simple fact is that Britain is not getting priority on Friday, Saturday and Sunday back any time soon, so unless you want to go without the riders involved in Polish leagues and FIM events, you can't race on those days...

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I think the fixed race night requires at least another season before we throw in the towel. Maybe add in an extra day?

Monday, Thursday and Friday. Each club has to run a minimum of 4 fixtures on each of those days so it give every club the opportunity to figure out what is the best night for racing in 2020.

Would this also work from 2019?

All teams in the Premiership have to be assembled by 1st March. After then, all Premiership clubs have to sign 3 National League riders as squad members. If 1 team member is missing an NL rider comes in at reserve and the other rider's move up a position. If 2 rider's are missing a guest is allowed for the highest average rider and NL squad member. If 3 rider's are missing, a guest is allowed for the highest average rider and 2 NL squad member etc etc. The only way to avoid using NL rider's is to redeclared with a new rider for injured or sack team members.

It may be totally nonsensical, I don't know. Certainly would hand an advantage to clubs running NL side's. I just feel it would be better to run meetings with 7 rider's and without R/R as it can drag meetings out.

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49 minutes ago, Aces51 said:

It doesn't matter what you do or how good the product is you simply won't get the crowd on a Monday that you would on a Friday, Saturday or Sunday. People have a limited amount of money to spend on sport, entertainment or leisure activities and most of it is spent at the weekend. It's common sense that people are more likely to go out when they have no work or school for their children the next day.

Its an odd one. In the late 60's I was a regular at Reading who ran on a Monday. They averaged 6000+ in those days. Also went to Romford on Thursdays who averaged about 5000. Not much difference, people worked the next day and kids went to school. Today I can walk down our High Street Mondays to Thursdays evenings and all the pubs and restaurants  are empty, and the place is like a ghost town. I don't think its just about money as our town is fairly affluent, it seems that people just don't want to go out midweek these days. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, HertsRacer said:

Its an odd one. In the late 60's I was a regular at Reading who ran on a Monday. They averaged 6000+ in those days. Also went to Romford on Thursdays who averaged about 5000. Not much difference, people worked the next day and kids went to school. Today I can walk down our High Street Mondays to Thursdays evenings and all the pubs and restaurants  are empty, and the place is like a ghost town. I don't think its just about money as our town is fairly affluent, it seems that people just don't want to go out midweek these days. 

And have fallen out of love with motorcycle racing and see no reason to patronise delapadated  arenas (BV excepted)

Inf: more than 30 million people play computer games.

Edited by GWC

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Posted (edited)

 

1 hour ago, HertsRacer said:

Its an odd one. In the late 60's I was a regular at Reading who ran on a Monday. They averaged 6000+ in those days. Also went to Romford on Thursdays who averaged about 5000. Not much difference, people worked the next day and kids went to school. Today I can walk down our High Street Mondays to Thursdays evenings and all the pubs and restaurants  are empty, and the place is like a ghost town. I don't think its just about money as our town is fairly affluent, it seems that people just don't want to go out midweek these days. 

I have to agree. When I was a kid I regularly went to west ham and white city on a school night. The majority of the nation are turning into couch potatoes. I blame the digital age!

Edited by cityrebel
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30 minutes ago, cityrebel said:

 

I have to agree. When I was a kid I regularly went to west ham and white city on a school night. The majority of the nation are turning into couch potatoes. I blame the digital age!

But they will go watch their fav footy team!! Tch

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Football is a religion to most fans, they would turn up if kick off was at 3am in the morning!

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10 hours ago, HenryW said:

And the simple fact is that Britain is not getting priority on Friday, Saturday and Sunday back any time soon, so unless you want to go without the riders involved in Polish leagues and FIM events, you can't race on those days...

The reality check is that if we hope for speedway to survive in the UK in a league racing structure , we have no option except to go that way. Do without riders involved in the Polish leagues ( whoever they are ) and hard sell weekend racing all over the country. That is the only idea that will work, as the first step to building up crowds and interest in the sport. The world has moved on and speedway has not,

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On 5/22/2018 at 4:09 PM, mikebv said:

Spot on. ..

And some will say "we have had guests for donkeys years"...

And indeed we have, however...

The days of turning up at a track, without any prior knowledge, and being peed off to find out PC wasn't there and that another teams' best rider replaced him have long, long gone...

Sweden and Poland run fixed nights and don't use guests....

Their Championships therefore have credibility...

We run the same system and still have guests...

Meaning our Championships don't have credibilty..

It's interesting we didn't use one fixed night like Sweden. So as, I presume, to facilitate the use of guests...

And then our version of 'two fixed nights' is actually three, and that all fixtures are arranged, it would appear, to again, facilitate guest replacements, unlike Poland, who with their three nights still don't use guests..

What you got away with in years gone by, doesn't mean in this age of 'instant news' you can still get away with it today...

When we found out PC wasn't there after we had paid our hard earned to get in, we often moaned to each other, but it was to the 10 or so people around you....

Nowadays you know BV are missing riders days in advance and instead of moaning to ten people, literally thousands on various forums get to read it...

And then make their decision to attend the fixture...

With many, 100% understandably, deciding against it..

If you don't run any Sport with credibility and integrity, you simply cannot complain when you struggle to generate decent crowds every week.

And when you add on that winning that Sports Championship's mean very little (by the very way they are won), and you have real problems I would suggest..

 

Some very good points made and the best one

If you don’t run any sport with credibility and intergrity, you simply cannot complain when you struggle to generate decent crowds every week.

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Fixed race nights appear to have had, at best, no affect on attendances and at worst (as I predicted) a devastating negative affect on attendances.

Reducing the number of riders missing due to doubling up doesn't seem to have brought the crowds back, which is a surprise given some of the compelling arguments against 'select teams' from the stay away 'fans'.

The only foreign star who appears to have been tempted back is Danish which is ironic as the Danes race on a Wednesday.

Fixed race nights has facilitated the d/up system, obviously leading to more riders taking advantage of the system, while giving the Tommy Cooperesque illusion (only a simpleton was fooled by TC's brand of magic) that there would be a shortage of riders if the d/up system wasn't available. That illusion also appears to make the move towards a single professional league a non starter which is the real answer going forward.

So what next?

I doubt the idiots will take the correct decision and fully dispense with fixed nights (never mind one league) therefore a solution which includes fixed nights is more likely to be considered.

Apparently the two nights available to UK were Monday and Thursday. The idiots decided to pick Monday to go with (wait for it....) Wednesday?? It hasn't worked, particularly for the teams forced to race on Monday, so next season (if they must stick with fixed nights) swap the disastrous Monday with Thursday and reintroduce (and add further) d/up restrictions to keep the guests to a minimum.

No other team is daft enough to want to race on a Monday so I can't see a major problem with wolves doing something similar to what Swindon have done this season, if it helps.

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