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racers and royals

German GP Teterow Saturday September 22nd

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1 hour ago, adonis said:

there you go again using world titles as a yard stick , and as for first turns  what have you been watching because you have completely missed  the master first turn bully  Doyle , 

You'll struggle to find any mention of the World Titles making him the best British rider in my post. Best British rider is what I said and what I meant, irrespective of World titles although you don't get them by being lucky in a GP series.

Woffinden is a much better first turn rider, Doyle is very hard and usually comes out of it well when it is 50/50, Woffinden has the skill to come out of it well when behind whether that's his bad gate or the track. I rate Doyle very highly when it comes to determination and hard riding and like watching him ride but he's a little behind a couple of the other top guys when it comes to skill in my opinion.

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9 minutes ago, Vince said:

You'll struggle to find any mention of the World Titles making him the best British rider in my post. Best British rider is what I said and what I meant, irrespective of World titles although you don't get them by being lucky in a GP series.

Woffinden is a much better first turn rider, Doyle is very hard and usually comes out of it well when it is 50/50, Woffinden has the skill to come out of it well when behind whether that's his bad gate or the track. I rate Doyle very highly when it comes to determination and hard riding and like watching him ride but he's a little behind a couple of the other top guys when it comes to skill in my opinion.

So you do, actually think Woffinden is the best british rider ever ................ well  leave it that then

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3 minutes ago, adonis said:

So you do, actually think Woffinden is the best british rider ever ................ well  leave it that then

Is he the most exciting? Probably not, that would be Loram or PC or Morton or Lee

Is the most naturally gifted rider? Again probably not

Does he work hard, train hard, mentally prepare himself the right way? 100%

Does he give 100% dedication to being the best he can be? Absolutely

 

And yes of course we can in some way use world titles as a yardstick be foolish not to.

I cant stand Havvy never have done but those who say he was lucky must realise that in 1992 he was the most dominating rider of the year.......do i think he is as good as say Lee, Collins, or Loram, all one time winners then no i dont.

Would the achivements of Havvy rank above Carter and Morton and Jessup then in my opinion yes they would.

Who was better to watch and had more ability, Jimmy White or Steve Davis?  Jimmy White did..........but Steve Davis won far more

My list of the top ten english riders ive seen ride would be as follows:

1. WOFFINDEN

2. PETER COLLINS

3. MICHAEL LEE

4. MARK LORAM

5. GARY HAVELOCK

6.KENNY CARTER

7. DAVE JESSUP

8. SIMON WIGG

9. KELVIN TATUM

10. CHRIS MORTON, JOE SCREEN & SCOTT NICHOLLS (all purely on being talented motorcyclists and in Nicholls case 7 times British Champ)

 

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2 hours ago, iris123 said:

Totally wrong about wildcards.Think riders were even given byes into the actual world finals.And some riders only had to do 1 or 2 rounds whilst others 4,5 or6

I don't recall riders given byes into the final? not saying you are wrong, just don't remember that

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2 hours ago, mickthemuppet said:

Why not have a Grand Prix like we have and an individual World Champion like we used to have . Then everybody would be happy. 

Darts have both

I think you are misunderstanding things a little; there is no "Grand Prix" system. There is a single knockout tournament called the "World Grand Prix" that is a PDC major alongside the World Championship and the World Matchplay.

Steve

Edited by chunky

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4 minutes ago, ColinMills said:

I don't recall riders given byes into the final? not saying you are wrong, just don't remember that

It was never applied consistently, but it did happen on occasion.

Steve

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1 hour ago, iris123 said:

Well how did the Polish riders qualify for the 1973 final?Swedish riders did have qualifiers for some of their finals,but how many meetings did they ride?Whereas how many meetings did some of the continental riders do or some British(Australian/NZ)riders do when the final wasn’t at Wembley

Plus I was answering a post that said there were no wc’s and you have confirmed there were,no matter how short the period was

You've also confirmed that the wild cards were virtually non existent, possibly at most 4 or 5 in over 40 years when compared to the numbers in the GP's. 

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1 minute ago, Aces51 said:

You've also confirmed that the wild cards were virtually non existent, possibly at most 4 or 5 in over 40 years when compared to the numbers in the GP's. 

It doesn’t matter.Someone was arguing wild cards didn’t exist.Both you and I know they did

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15 hours ago, JCookie said:

Fair play, not a fan of Woffinden but he's streets ahead of anyone else this year. Just a shame to see him so nonchalant about winning it, he's virtually guaranteed yet another world title and he seems like he couldn't care less.

He cares immensely he also knows there is still work to be done you don't count your chickens

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6 minutes ago, shadowfax said:

He cares immensely he also knows there is still work to be done you don't count your chickens

think you will see his proper reaction once its mathematically safe

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15 hours ago, JCookie said:

Fair play, not a fan of Woffinden but he's streets ahead of anyone else this year. Just a shame to see him so nonchalant about winning it, he's virtually guaranteed yet another world title and he seems like he couldn't care less.

Perfect attitude.    Not won it yet, don't get too intense, keep calm and relaxed under pressure.    

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Easily the best British rider ever,.watch heat 15 from last night ,pure class, bike control, racing brain, he has it all.

Chopper

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17 minutes ago, ColinMills said:

think you will see his proper reaction once its mathematically safe

absolutely

It would need Zmarzlik to be getting 18 or 19 points, which he has managed twice and for Tai to get less than 10 which has happened once.

It should be all Tai's but an injury early on like Cook or Vaculik last night and then its open.

Cant believe someone said he doesnt care. He must be confident but he needs to have his mind right so his way is to seem that what will be will be......of course he cares

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20 minutes ago, chopper said:

Easily the best British rider ever,.watch heat 15 from last night ,pure class, bike control, racing brain, he has it all.

Chopper

I don't think you can base an opinion on who was the best British rider ever on just one heat. I am sure riders like Tom Farndon, Eric Langton, Peter Craven, Peter Collins, Michael Lee, Mark Loram also rode individual heats that showed the same qualities. Perhaps it's more a matter of long term consistency that makes a rider the best. I'm not saying Tai isn't the best ever, just that there are a lot of things to consider rather than one heat and there is no doubt that Tai is up there with the best. But THE best, that's a really difficult conclusion to reach about any rider.

Edited by norbold

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3 hours ago, tyler42 said:

On the other hand. It's quite farcical that a rider scores say 5 pts less than another rider over 5 rides, but then scrapes into the semis and ends up on the rostrum. where the other rider bombs out at the semi stage. So you have the ridicules situation, where the rider who has scored the most points is not declared the winner!!  

 

 

 

The same goes with the league title... the team with the most points at the end of the season should be league champions. The current play off system creates interest, but is an awful and false way to decide on league champions. 

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