ray c 2,299 Posted November 18, 2018 47 minutes ago, Skidder1 said: In the final instance it'll come down to a numbers game plus whoever MF believes will increase their averages. As for Shanesie, whilst disappointed to be dropped last season, he was expecting it and is still on very good terms with his local club, Poole. Loyalty is a far nicer word than numbers game !!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gavan 5,049 Posted November 18, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Skidder1 said: In the final instance it'll come down to a numbers game plus whoever MF believes will increase their averages. As for Shanesie, whilst disappointed to be dropped last season, he was expecting it and is still on very good terms with his local club, Poole. Thats why i believe there will be no place for Harris 1 hour ago, ray c said: Loyalty is a far nicer word than numbers game !!! Loyalty is long gone in speedway, promoters move riders on no matter what these days. Felt sorry for Shanes was doing his job and lost his because other riders werent doing theirs. It can be said Poole have made changes which enabled them to win the league but they used 13 riders to get there which is just absurd irrelevant of the reasoning. I would like to see no more than 2 changes a season, unless a rider had a season ending injury. And before im accused of Poole bashing, our own Connor Mountain was sacrificed as well when doing his job so its the same at all clubs Edited November 18, 2018 by Gavan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poolebolton 464 Posted November 18, 2018 31 minutes ago, Gavan said: Thats why i believe there will be no place for Harris Loyalty is long gone in speedway, promoters move riders on no matter what these days. Felt sorry for Shanes was doing his job and lost his because other riders werent doing theirs. It can be said Poole have made changes which enabled them to win the league but they used 13 riders to get there which is just absurd irrelevant of the reasoning. I would like to see no more than 2 changes a season, unless a rider had a season ending injury. And before im accused of Poole bashing, our own Connor Mountain was sacrificed as well when doing his job so its the same at all clubs Need squads. 13 I would agree Is a lot of riders. But you look in Poland and Sweden and the squads are about 10-15 riders. Have squads and well who would not have to worry about it to the same extent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ray c 2,299 Posted November 18, 2018 (edited) 29 minutes ago, poolebolton said: Need squads. 13 I would agree Is a lot of riders. But you look in Poland and Sweden and the squads are about 10-15 riders. Have squads and well who would not have to worry about it to the same extent. So does a rider who not in the team double up ?or does he not earn any money. ? Edited November 18, 2018 by ray c 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poolebolton 464 Posted November 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, ray c said: So does a rider who not in the team double up ?or does he not earn any money. ? That’s what happens in Poland. Can’t do much about it. But now with fixed race days should be better! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A ORLOV 8,628 Posted November 18, 2018 5 minutes ago, poolebolton said: That’s what happens in Poland. Can’t do much about it. But now with fixed race days should be better! But it seems most riders in Poland get a signing on fee at the start of their contract, which quite often is each year, so they get money if in the squad even if they do not ride. I cannot see that working with our tight Promoters. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Starman2006 2,353 Posted November 18, 2018 3 hours ago, A ORLOV said: But it seems most riders in Poland get a signing on fee at the start of their contract, which quite often is each year, so they get money if in the squad even if they do not ride. I cannot see that working with our tight Promoters. ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phil The Ace 2,847 Posted November 19, 2018 9 hours ago, A ORLOV said: But it seems most riders in Poland get a signing on fee at the start of their contract, which quite often is each year, so they get money if in the squad even if they do not ride. I cannot see that working with our tight Promoters. All riders get a signing on fee. But only around 2k I imagine Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Smith 5,645 Posted November 19, 2018 There is only one way to get squad systems to work and that's by Premiership clubs having a Championship tie in. At the end of the 5 year plan when they hope to end doubling up, this is how it would work:- Belle Vue - Workington Ipswich - Glasgow King's Lynn - Scunthorpe Peterborough - Leicester Poole - Sheffield Swindon - Somerset Wolverhampton - Edinburgh As an example for Poole, if an injury happens to their No1, they'd use the highest averaged rider available from Sheffield, they'd slot in at No7 and everyone else in the team moves up a position. If there's 2 injuries, the 2 highest averaged Sheffield rider's go at No6 and No7 and everyone else in the Poole team moves up a position and so on and so on. The only time a guest can be used is if there are to many injuries to the Championship club. Then a guest can be sort from other clubs that are not tied into a Premiership club. For me, it's the only way of getting squad systems to work and also be viable to rider's too. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ray c 2,299 Posted November 19, 2018 5 hours ago, Daniel Smith said: There is only one way to get squad systems to work and that's by Premiership clubs having a Championship tie in. At the end of the 5 year plan when they hope to end doubling up, this is how it would work:- Belle Vue - Workington Ipswich - Glasgow King's Lynn - Scunthorpe Peterborough - Leicester Poole - Sheffield Swindon - Somerset Wolverhampton - Edinburgh As an example for Poole, if an injury happens to their No1, they'd use the highest averaged rider available from Sheffield, they'd slot in at No7 and everyone else in the team moves up a position. If there's 2 injuries, the 2 highest averaged Sheffield rider's go at No6 and No7 and everyone else in the Poole team moves up a position and so on and so on. The only time a guest can be used is if there are to many injuries to the Championship club. Then a guest can be sort from other clubs that are not tied into a Premiership club. For me, it's the only way of getting squad systems to work and also be viable to rider's too. I like that idea Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A ORLOV 8,628 Posted November 19, 2018 8 hours ago, Phil The Ace said: All riders get a signing on fee. But only around 2k I imagine Many in Poland get a lot more than that for signing. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LesR 139 Posted November 19, 2018 6 hours ago, Daniel Smith said: There is only one way to get squad systems to work and that's by Premiership clubs having a Championship tie in. At the end of the 5 year plan when they hope to end doubling up, this is how it would work:- Belle Vue - Workington Ipswich - Glasgow King's Lynn - Scunthorpe Peterborough - Leicester Poole - Sheffield Swindon - Somerset Wolverhampton - Edinburgh As an example for Poole, if an injury happens to their No1, they'd use the highest averaged rider available from Sheffield, they'd slot in at No7 and everyone else in the team moves up a position. If there's 2 injuries, the 2 highest averaged Sheffield rider's go at No6 and No7 and everyone else in the Poole team moves up a position and so on and so on. The only time a guest can be used is if there are to many injuries to the Championship club. Then a guest can be sort from other clubs that are not tied into a Premiership club. For me, it's the only way of getting squad systems to work and also be viable to rider's too. This is similar to the 70's when first division clubs had tie ups with second division clubs. For instance Exeter had Canterbury and Steve Koppe, Les Rumsey and Bob Spelta were numbers 8,9 and 10. Any absences or injuries to second strings and reserves were covered by these riders. I think it was guest or r/r for heat leaders. Seemed to work very well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
INCOGNITO 357 Posted November 19, 2018 18 hours ago, A ORLOV said: But it seems most riders in Poland get a signing on fee at the start of their contract, which quite often is each year, so they get money if in the squad even if they do not ride. I cannot see that working with our tight Promoters. 9 hours ago, Phil The Ace said: All riders get a signing on fee. But only around 2k I imagine If you went to squad systems here then yes riders would want signing on fees but most would want a guarantee of how many meetings there are assured of having too so they wouldn't be there just for injuries 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A ORLOV 8,628 Posted November 19, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, INCOGNITO said: If you went to squad systems here then yes riders would want signing on fees but most would want a guarantee of how many meetings there are assured of having too so they wouldn't be there just for injuries Which unless payments are confirmed by sponsors I cannot see a squad system being affordable or working apart from the odd top rider from Poland or Denmark who wants and is willing to share a place for x number of meetings, but then he might want to be free to chose to ride for other clubs when not being used. I think I recall that Matt was sounding out the idea of a squad system with Chris Holder and Darcy Ward sharing the number one position at Poole a couple few years ago. Edited November 19, 2018 by A ORLOV Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supersub 79 Posted November 19, 2018 How about for 2019 Morris 6.91 Woryna 6.30 Kurtz 6.75 Klindt 6.61 Harris 6.91 (2.5% reduction) Jacobson 5.04 Nielson 3.58 (2.5% reduction) 42.10 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites