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martinmauger

Double Headers With Same Team

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Double headers are often a necessary evil in speedway but It occured to me for a double header v the same opponents, couldn't just one match be staged and the scores count for both meetings, i.e League & KOC, etc.  I am not particularly referring to last nite's Worky v Lakey postponement(s) but double headers in general.  I seem to recall a few years ago in at least one meeting the score counted for 2 competitions with full, and prior agreement of both team mangements, and presumably the BSPA & SCB.   Double headers are almost inevetable but the cost of bascially staging 2 meetings with effectively one income, but with just say 1 1/2 x usual admission, though with one set of travel costs, must financially crippling especially at this time of year....

Edited by martinmauger
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32 minutes ago, martinmauger said:

Double headers are often a necessary evil in speedway but It occured to me for a double header v the same opponents, couldn't just one match be staged and the scores count for both meetings, i.e League & KOC, etc.  I am not particularly referring to last nite's Worky v Lakey postponement(s) but double headers in general.  I seem to recall a few years ago in at least one meeting the score counted for 2 competitions with full, and prior agreement of both team mangements, and presumably the BSPA & SCB.   Double headers are almost inevetable but the cost of bascially staging 2 meetings with effectively one income, but with just say 1 1/2 x usual admission, though with one set of travel costs, must financially crippling especially at this time of year....

Recall Oxford during their last Championship winning season (2001) riding at Ipswich in a 'double' header'...one was a league match in which, if I remember we drew therefore securing the championship (much to the annoyance of SKY whose cameras weren't present!) and a semi-final Knock Out Cup tie which resulted in a two point defeat and because of a poor home leg we weren't able to progress to the final. Talk about two high pressure fixtures back to back!

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The two doubleheaders at King's Lynn this year ( both against the same weak opponents ) turned me off so much that I did not go again. No interest in such a thing whatsoever and from what I was told a goodly number of others thought and acted the same as well.

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Becoming very sceptical in my old age,  I too have questioned the attraction of running double headers against the same team.  

When the importance of league racing is used solely as qualification of those end-of-season 4 team tournament , what difference would it make to run one match with double points...   No, its not ideal, but the fans wont get bored watching the same teams racing,  the fans wont get ripped off paying extra, and the promoters wont have to gamble on making enough not to lose out.   

With so much wrong with this sport,  this is a extra obstacle that nobody wants.    If both promoters agree to play for double points then why not....

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2 hours ago, g13webb said:

Becoming very sceptical in my old age,  I too have questioned the attraction of running double headers against the same team.  

When the importance of league racing is used solely as qualification of those end-of-season 4 team tournament , what difference would it make to run one match with double points...   No, its not ideal, but the fans wont get bored watching the same teams racing,  the fans wont get ripped off paying extra, and the promoters wont have to gamble on making enough not to lose out.   

With so much wrong with this sport,  this is a extra obstacle that nobody wants.    If both promoters agree to play for double points then why not....

Taken to its Nth degree what you're suggesting is a once home and once away league campaign.

Back in the day I used to look forward to a double header, a chance to see 2 Speedway meetings at a knock down price, this was back in the day when it was affordable... And it wasn't the same team back to back and when they could race 2 meetings without constant delays.

I do seem to remember a "double header" taking place where just the 1 match was ridden and it counted for both competitions, can't remember who or when though, it must have been pretty recently as this never happened back in the day

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5 hours ago, iainb said:

Taken to its Nth degree what you're suggesting is a once home and once away league campaign.

Back in the day I used to look forward to a double header, a chance to see 2 Speedway meetings at a knock down price, this was back in the day when it was affordable... And it wasn't the same team back to back and when they could race 2 meetings without constant delays.

I do seem to remember a "double header" taking place where just the 1 match was ridden and it counted for both competitions, can't remember who or when though, it must have been pretty recently as this never happened back in the day

No not at all,   my comments were in reply to the  suggestion of a double header against the same team.    I too remember going to double headers against different teams and it was a much sort after meeting.  When there are 3 teams there were always plenty of riders  for guesting should anyone  get hurt.     I remember last year against Wolves we only had 4 riders for the second match, and what a farce that was...    In a situation like that,  a one match double points would have been far more sensible..

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On 10/21/2018 at 12:01 PM, martinmauger said:

Double headers are often a necessary evil in speedway but It occured to me for a double header v the same opponents, couldn't just one match be staged and the scores count for both meetings, i.e League & KOC, etc.  I am not particularly referring to last nite's Worky v Lakey postponement(s) but double headers in general.  I seem to recall a few years ago in at least one meeting the score counted for 2 competitions with full, and prior agreement of both team mangements, and presumably the BSPA & SCB.   Double headers are almost inevetable but the cost of bascially staging 2 meetings with effectively one income, but with just say 1 1/2 x usual admission, though with one set of travel costs, must financially crippling especially at this time of year....

In 1976 the Ipswich Vs Wimbledon Spring Gold Cup Final 2nd Leg also counted as the Gulf British League match. I think this was due solely as both teams normally rode on Thursday nights. Wimbledon home matches against Ipswich were always held when I used to attend Plough Lane on a Bank Holiday Monday.

 

Maybe the Workington Vs Lakeside Challenge Shield Final and SGB Championship match count as one fixture, and the Play-Off (if Lakeside qualify) as a separate match then all three matches can be concluded in one simple double header.

Edited by Robbie B

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Double headers used to work... I remember being at the Cov v Hull & Cov v Leicester in 1979(?) The place was heaving!

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2 hours ago, iainb said:

Double headers used to work... I remember being at the Cov v Hull & Cov v Leicester in 1979(?) The place was heaving!

Not the best example. The first match decided which of the 2 competing sides won the league title that season, a bit like it being a one off play off final .  The Leicester match was a Midland Cup tie, which I don't believe was a major draw.  As a stand alone therefore  the Hull match would no doubt have pulled the same crowd, on its own with the second match being little more than an end of season challenge of little interest. .

That said I have no issues with such fixtures and attended the double header at Sheffield last year (Edinburgh and Ipswich) (and a 400 mile round trip)  which was brilliantly run and great VFM, much to the chagrin of the usual dissenters, who never had any intention of attending and wished it had been a failure to extend their moan fest. Considering the Ipswich fixture had only been rained off 4 days earlier the production of a totally new programme hadn't gone unnoticed either. .  

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I suppose my point is, if one of the 2 matches is a crowd puller you've mitigated your losses on the other... To run 2 against the same team is asking for disaster

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4 hours ago, Robbie B said:

Maybe the Workington Vs Lakeside Challenge Shield Final and SGB Championship match count as one fixture, and the Play-Off (if Lakeside qualify) as a separate match then all three matches can be concluded in one simple double header.

The league match has to be separate as there are different rules - eg a TS is available

The shield and play off final could however be combined (in theory)

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9 minutes ago, dontforgetthefueltapsbruv said:

The league match has to be separate as there are different rules - eg a TS is available

Rules are made to be Bro... er, changed at the last minute

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7 hours ago, iainb said:

Double headers used to work... I remember being at the Cov v Hull & Cov v Leicester in 1979(?) The place was heaving!

I was there too!

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I have nothing against doubleheaders, only when it is a match against the same team twice on the night. That is a complete turn-off for me.

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On 10/23/2018 at 5:28 PM, steve roberts said:

I was there too!

And me: big event, huge crowd :D, but the wrong result (Cov v Hull) :cry: wish it was available; on DVD.  Leicester were on 2nd but many in the crowd had left by then, or retired to the bars, not me I watched the 2nd match while crying into champagne I shared with Bees fans - I was 'no but a lad' and too young to drink  :drink:.  What I'll always remember though is the sporting nature of Bees fans that nite, Hull had realistically already chucked the league away mid-season due to the infamous no-shows at Wimbledon (3) and Swindon (1) and were unsurprisingly spanked that nite.  But Bees' fans were great, no idiotic jeering, where I was anyway on the back straight, just "hard luck lads, want some champagne ?!  Here, have some more"  :drink:.  Flippin' brilliant nite.  But the wrong result for the 1st match....

Edited by martinmauger
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