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Rob Godfrey interview in Speedway Star

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4 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

No, your post only once again backed up what I was saying. All your post did was clarify how you ranked/differentiated two riders with similar achievements. They only came into the conversation because you saw them winning lots of races.

The more you see a rider win races, the better you are going to think they are. That's just reality.

...and I see that you've  coveniently side-stepped my question to you which is still outstanding. I await with interest.

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3 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

If you see a rider regularly surely that puts you in a stronger position to comment.

When discussing the characteristics of a rider, i.e. ability to gate, make passes etc then yes. 

The overall success of a rider, it makes no difference at all. 

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1 minute ago, BWitcher said:

??? 

That's because he'd already won six World Championships.

So, if Mauger rode his entire career at the level he did in 1984, never won six World titles as a result, never had the 11.74 and other 10 and 11+ point seasons, you claim you would still have ranked him the same?

Same question for Boocock.

No i judged him Ivan more on my memory of watching him ride as a example i was not a fan of Rickardsson.He would not be in my top three riders of all time but  he should be judges better than me think  so but i judge riders on what my memory tells me.

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Just now, steve roberts said:

...and I see that you've  coveniently side-stepped my question to you which is still outstanding. I await with interest.

Answer remains the same, I always forget to dig out the old Backtrack magazines in my fleeting visits to England. 

We need one of these convos when I'm there to jig my memory!

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2 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

No i judged him Ivan more on my memory of watching him ride as a example i was not a fan of Rickardsson.He would not be in my top three riders of all time but  he should be judges better than me think  so but i judge riders on what my memory tells me.

And what was Ivan doing when you were watching him ride? Winning races by any chance?

Again, name me one rider who you judged to be 'world class' who didn't win many races. Must be plenty as winning races had nothing to do with your judgement?

Edited by BWitcher

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25 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

Answer remains the same, I always forget to dig out the old Backtrack magazines in my fleeting visits to England. 

We need one of these convos when I'm there to jig my memory!

...I await with interest but don't leave it too long as the years are catching up with me and reading some of these long winded, round the house threads is only adding to the agonising eventuality!

Edited by steve roberts
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5 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

When discussing the characteristics of a rider, i.e. ability to gate, make passes etc then yes. 

The overall success of a rider, it makes no difference at all. 

So if Steve had the experience of seeing Gordon ride a lot more times than you do you believe he is better aquipped  to comment on Kennett  than you.??? 

Edited by Sidney the robin

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2 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

And what was Ivan doing when you were watching him ride? Winning races by any chance?

Again, name me one rider who you judged to be 'world class' who didn't win many races. Must be plenty as winning races had nothing to do with your judgement?

Not in 1984 he wasn't.

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Just now, Sidney the robin said:

So if Steve had the experience of seeing Gordon ride a lot more times than you do you believe he is better aquipprd to comment than you.??? 

Utterly irrelevant to the conversation.

In answer, in terms of his riding style, how he earned his pts, how exciting you found him as a rider then yes.

His overall success? Makes no difference at all if you saw them or not. Results are all documented.

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5 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

Not in 1984 he wasn't.

In 1984 he was already a six time World Champion who you had spent your life watching win races.

Just the same as in 2005 I still thought Sam Ermolenko was the greatest. Just as in 2014 I still thought he was the greatest when watching him race at Monmore.. because of what he had PREVIOUSLY done.

Had you watched Mauger ride at the level he did in 84 for the rest of his career you wouldn't be classing him as an all time great.. and had Ermolenko rode at the level he did in 2005 for his entire career I wouldn't be classing him as highly either.

Anyway, come on, you keep saying winning races had no impact on your judgement of riders... so name me one.. just one... who you classed as world class who didn't win many races. 

 

Edited by BWitcher

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7 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

Utterly irrelevant to the conversation.

In answer, in terms of his riding style, how he earned his pts, how exciting you found him as a rider then yes.

His overall success? Makes no difference at all if you saw them or not. Results are all documented.

This is the  worst post that you have ever posted are you seriously telling me you can be accurate on a assessment of a rider when you have never seen him ride a astonishing claim.

Edited by Sidney the robin

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1 minute ago, BWitcher said:

In 1984 he was already a six time World Champion who you had spent your life watching win races.

Just the same as in 2005 I still thought Sam Ermolenko was the greatest. Just as in 2014 I still thought he was the greatest when watching him race at Monmore.. because of what he had PREVIOUSLY done.

Had you watched Mauger ride at the level he did in 84 for the rest of his career you wouldn't be classing him as an all time great.. and had Ermolenko rode at the level he did in 2005 for his entire career I wouldn't be classing him as highly either.

 

Do i judge Mauger on his stats and six titles no I don't,  do i rate Rickardsson on his six titles again no as i said he was not a rider i took to yet his record suggests otherwise.

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Just now, Sidney the robin said:

This is the  worst post that you have ever posted are you seriously telling me you can be accurate on a assessment of rider when you have never seen him ride a astonishing claim.

You do realise speedway results are recorded don't you?

You do understand if a rider wins 95% of his races it means he is better than someone who in the same season or set of seasons won 70% of his races?

You do understand if a rider won the World Title six times and another in the same era was a 3pt reserve it means the first rider is better?

You don't have to have seen any of them ride to know that.

Speedway isn't like sports such as football. It is a measurable sport where the ability of riders in certain eras can easily be mapped.

How they went about achieving those results is a different argument.

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Just now, Sidney the robin said:

Do i judge Mauger on his stats and six titles no I don't,  do i rate Rickardsson on his six titles again no as i said he was not a rider i took to yet his record suggests otherwise.

 

So, if Mauger had never won six World titles, never achieved 10-11 pt averages year after year, but just rode at the level he did in 84 for his entire career, you would still class him as the greatest ever rider?

You provide some great comedy Sidney :)

 

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1 minute ago, BWitcher said:

You do realise speedway results are recorded don't you?

You do understand if a rider wins 95% of his races it means he is better than someone who in the same season or set of seasons won 70% of his races?

You do understand if a rider won the World Title six times and another in the same era was a 3pt reserve it means the first rider is better?

You don't have to have seen any of them ride to know that.

Speedway isn't like sports such as football. It is a measurable sport where the ability of riders in certain eras can easily be mapped.

How they went about achieving those results is a different argument.

Leigh Adams/Dennis Sigalos/ Graham Warren as examples were all great riders all good anough to be a World Champion there records do not show  that  though does it? Yes or No.? 

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