RS50 359 Posted July 6, 2019 4 hours ago, mikebv said: Maybe also give 200 tickets to the away club for each match, to sell only from their ticket office at a tenner a pop? And risk some clever sod buying the lot and selling them to home fans for £12.00 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fortythirtyeight 838 Posted July 6, 2019 2 hours ago, mikebv said: Exactly. .. So charge away fans a tenner... Who knows maybe the club could help with a subsidised coach hire or two? 100 away fans cheering on their team might inspire their riders a bit more.. But more importantly it would make the meeting an 'event' (like other 'proper' team sports have), giving it meaning, purpose and relevance, (not to mention atmosphere), which some might find worth in attending again.. Clubs have no money but you want them to subsidise a coach for the 20 or so away fans that they may be lucky to have follow them who would follow them anyway? How do you police the 'away' fans? Do they have to produce I.D.??? I travel 80 miles each week to my nearest track, am I an ' away ' fan ? Fans don't travel because it's too expensive to attend two meetings a week , with travel, entrance and food, it's only the hardcore that still follow their team. An example was my club last season when they gave an award to ONE fan who had attended every fixture , home and away.....ONE fan! says a lot really. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cityrebel 2,960 Posted July 6, 2019 57 minutes ago, Fortythirtyeight said: Clubs have no money but you want them to subsidise a coach for the 20 or so away fans that they may be lucky to have follow them who would follow them anyway? How do you police the 'away' fans? Do they have to produce I.D.??? I travel 80 miles each week to my nearest track, am I an ' away ' fan ? Fans don't travel because it's too expensive to attend two meetings a week , with travel, entrance and food, it's only the hardcore that still follow their team. An example was my club last season when they gave an award to ONE fan who had attended every fixture , home and away.....ONE fan! says a lot really. It was a rarity to see a coachload of Leicester fans turn up at Eastbourne last sunday. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,240 Posted July 7, 2019 5 hours ago, RS50 said: And risk some clever sod buying the lot and selling them to home fans for £12.00 I doubt touting would be a problem in a domestic Speedway meeting. . Fair play though if someone wants to travel to pick them all up and travel back and stand outside a venue and try and sell them... Maybe like the Poles do there could be an 'away end' (or a bench as it would probably only need) so the tickets marked 'away fans only' can only be used there.. I am sure this would put off any 'sharp practice' because as everyone knows 'your place is your place' week in week out and no one would want to lose 'their place'.. Bottom line is hardly any away fans travel now and the atmosphere is crap at most Speedway meetings.. Manchester Library will have more atmosphere and noise on a daily basis than the NSS does on a race night, (and that's a track that delivers great racing to be excited about!).. As a kid in the 70's I remember the Aces v Sheffield matches in particular and they stand out because hundreds of tigers fans came to watch. Cant remember much about the racing but do remember the noise created and the atmosphere generated by those followers.. Similar the Aces v Wolves matches of the early to mid nineties at the Dog Bowl, again the racing was secondary to what I remember about the 'banter' and the fact the result actually meant something given the passion of both sets of supporters.. Poland is a perfect Speedway example of how away fans generate that tribal atmosphere so important at a 'team sport event'. All in their teams colours replica T shirts.. And obviously many other team sports rely on the away following to generate atmosphere in their grounds, hence 'twenty is plenty' was adopted even by the 'God is Money' Football administration, as away numbers were dropping at some clubs... Hardly any away fans go now so nothing will change atmosphere wise until they do.. Time to think a bit more radically on how you can get them there.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,240 Posted July 7, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Fortythirtyeight said: Clubs have no money but you want them to subsidise a coach for the 20 or so away fans that they may be lucky to have follow them who would follow them anyway? How do you police the 'away' fans? Do they have to produce I.D.??? I travel 80 miles each week to my nearest track, am I an ' away ' fan ? Fans don't travel because it's too expensive to attend two meetings a week , with travel, entrance and food, it's only the hardcore that still follow their team. An example was my club last season when they gave an award to ONE fan who had attended every fixture , home and away.....ONE fan! says a lot really. You wouldn't be an 'away fan' just because you live 80 miles away as that is your team.. You would only be an 'away fan' if you purchase your ticket from the 'away club'.. Now in your case as you live 80 miles away from your own teams circuit that might mean you have another team closer? I suppose therefore if that is the case you could buy a ticket from them and attend as an 'away fan' when the teams meet, but that would be very much an isolated scenario I would suggest. . To 'police it' tickets would only be sold in person at the away venue, no post, no emails etc.. Maybe more than just 'one fan' would be encourged to attend all season if they had some savings to be made to motivate them? Oe maybe just let them in for free? Then the restrictive travel costs, and any expenditure on the night, is the only outlay.. As can be seen from your example, hardly any away fans are there now so clubs would hardly lose any significant revenue.. And just maybe it will grow the overall experience to encourage more locals to attend more regularly? Edited July 7, 2019 by mikebv Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JamesHarris 390 Posted July 8, 2019 Quote Going a little away from the subject here but look at the size of the crowd in this. Promoters would be c****g in their pants to have this today. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RS50 359 Posted July 8, 2019 Recently saw an old photo of Sheffield speedway. Think it was from 1947 with a crowd of 43000. That will probably be more than the crowd for the entire season now. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
geoff100 1,420 Posted July 8, 2019 1 hour ago, kelvinlapworth said: Cam u imagine todays superstars trying to ride a track like today would give rory something to moam about ! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GWC 495 Posted July 8, 2019 (edited) The sport needs to focus on tracks that can be sustained without the need for dog racing. Its future isn’t good as pressure from real estate development grows and people find chasing dogs not ethical in today’s sanitised world. Losing Coventry and then Rye and Lakeside wasn't in the plan! Edited July 8, 2019 by GWC Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,240 Posted July 8, 2019 (edited) 28 minutes ago, GWC said: The sport needs to focus on tracks that can be sustained without the need for dog racing. Its future isn’t good as pressure from real estate development grows and people find chasing dogs not ethical in today’s sanitised world. Losing Coventry and then Rye and Lakeside wasn't in the plan! Something definitely to consider.. You do feel that it's only a matter of time before greyhound racing is 'hounded out' of existence given it's poor PR... Definitely feels like an orchestrated agenda gathering momentum against the greyhound fraternity.. Not to mention the falling crowds it suffers.. Housing development is much sought after politically too by local MP's so they won't be too favourable towards the greyhound followers I would suggest.. Edited July 8, 2019 by mikebv 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grachan 7,314 Posted July 8, 2019 On 7/6/2019 at 1:18 PM, Fortythirtyeight said: The knock on effect of one league means no doubling up riders therefore top riders will be more in demand and want bigger wages. There will be a huge bun fight for riders and the poorer clubs can not compete. Put the likes of Newcastle or Redcar up against the finances of Poole , Kings Lynn or Glasgow in competing for riders and it just doesn't work. It didn't in 96 when it was one league , one club couldn't even get seven riders! In 96 it was set at EL standard. If the league was set at CL standard then the teams would be the strength of CL teams, so the same as now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fortythirtyeight 838 Posted July 8, 2019 4 hours ago, Grachan said: In 96 it was set at EL standard. If the league was set at CL standard then the teams would be the strength of CL teams, so the same as now. You actually think there's a major difference between the Premiership and Championship now? Other than about a dozen riders it's virtually the same. If you check out the averages for both divisions most Championship riders averages are the same in both divisions and sometimes higher in the premiership. That tells its own story on standards. if they go one division then it will surely have to be set between championship and national league standard to reduce the costs ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HGould 2,213 Posted July 8, 2019 2 minutes ago, Fortythirtyeight said: You actually think there's a major difference between the Premiership and Championship now? Other than about a dozen riders it's virtually the same. If you check out the averages for both divisions most Championship riders averages are the same in both divisions and sometimes higher in the premiership. That tells its own story on standards. if they go one division then it will surely have to be set between championship and national league standard to reduce the costs ? The difference now is that it is the PL Clubs who are making the "one league noises" as they cannot afford inflated points money and guarantees on reduced crowds. That's what Matt Ford originally implied in his article, admitting he lost £20,000 on a "recent meeting" and saying that his Crowds in PL at that time were lower than Eastbourne in CL. That was in early May so crowds may have changed at both venues?, but says ti me if ford is losing £20k that PL rates need to come down to more like CL level and that some riders will have to take a pay cut and those doubling up on top PL and CL money will hope to have more matches in one "Big league" team than in 2 teams one in PL and one in CL. Another poster on here different thread did an excellent study that there were just enough riders in PL/CL to staff 14 teams (7 man teams) or 16 teams (6 man teams).....that'll be the issue - rider availability... How many of the CL Teams can take the plunge and join 1 League??? and what happens if they don't do they go NDL or Close??.. Of those in CL now I would guess Glasgow; Sheffield (if new Owners); Leicester; Somerset would be certain to want to move up. I would guess Edinburgh; Newcastle, Scunthorpe, Birmingham and Eastbourne may want to move up but would be taking a big risk. Berwick and Redcar would struggle I would think to compete on current crowd levels and of the middle 6 probably only Scunthorpe would ultimately take the plunge. So that would be 7 + 5 a League of 12. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fortythirtyeight 838 Posted July 8, 2019 Fair assessment. As for who will run where , if crowds are a determining factor, I believe Sheffield are really struggling and are up for sale, crowds at Berwick, Edinburgh and Newcastle are not as large as I've seen at Redcar this season having visited all of these tracks a number of times this season. However three of these clubs have previously rejected the idea of joining one big division . Mr.Godfrey put a stop to the idea previously so think he showed his hand there. I think 14 teams might be the maximum attracted to the one division concept. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ch958 2,393 Posted July 8, 2019 well you're guessing there a bit: you don't really know the circumstances at, say, Redcar, who rent from the council and keep the catering receipts unlike others who have private landlords and don't get the catering money. The level of a single division HAS repeat HAS to be achieveable for the "smaller" clubs. I'm certain thet evenly matched teams with continuity and fixture variety is an improvement and will prove popular if costs are controlled 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
