Jump to content
British Speedway Forum
Sign in to follow this  
Steve Shovlar

Staggered starts. An idea for reruns.

Recommended Posts

How many heats have we all witnessed where a rider falls and then, in the rerun, the rider that was tailed off suddenly pops out of the start and what was a nailed on 5-1 suddenly ends up as a 3-3?

An example of this was last night when Ipswich were on a 4-2, then Fricke knocked off Harris. Berge was tailed off. In the rerun Berge got the drop and managed to get second place, turning what really should have been an Ipswich 5-1 into a 4-2.

So why not stagger the start for the rerun? Riders go for the rerun in the position they were in when the heat was stopped. The leading rider starts from the tapes. The rider in second starts at 5 metres and the rider in third at ten metres. A rider might still come through from 3rd to first but would have done it fairly. It’s frustrating to see a rider who was nowhere in the first running pop out and win.

Please feel free to agree or disagree. Easy to implement. Thoughts?

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought the rules allowed the referee to place the backmarker of 15m in this scenario???????

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, bendover said:

I thought the rules allowed the referee to place the backmarker of 15m in this scenario???????

and when it's been done so many on here criticise

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, bendover said:

I thought the rules allowed the referee to place the backmarker of 15m in this scenario???????

Rule dropped this year!

 

Staggered starts....only ever seen that for Flat Track.....Speedway? I'm open to it!

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How about re-adopting handicap racing as was once tried back in the sixties which, if I recall, upset Briggo who threatened to retire if it wasn't withdrawn!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, steve roberts said:

How about re-adopting handicap racing as was once tried back in the sixties which, if I recall, upset Briggo who threatened to retire if it wasn't withdrawn!

I remember the year they ran the league on a handicap system. Watching Ronnie Moore at Wimbledon off 30 yards was magic! I think it was Briggs, Moore, Craven, Fundin and one other (Knudsen?) who spent the whole season on 30 yards with those on 20 yards, 10 yards and scratch decided each month on the up to date averages. 

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It would at least add some interest and anything that would have half a chance of dismissing gate and go complaints has to be worth a try. Why not trial it in non league so that the purists do not get too upset. Something needs to be done to revitalise the racing given the difference in skill sets of heat leaders versus the others. If the likes of Doyle (using name as an example not having a go before anyone leaps to his defence) are so good prove it in a handicap racing. They would have to work their way to the front while the lesser riders have to learn to ride defensively. It is a shame that so many interesting a different ideas are put forward on here but no one is listening and yet the basic concept is OK it just needs some added spice to make it attractive if only to give the ‘underdog’ half a chance. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Hawk127 said:

It is a shame that so many interesting a different ideas are put forward on here but no one is listening and yet the basic concept is OK it just needs some added spice to make it attractive if only to give the ‘underdog’ half a chance. 

Closed ears and closed minds abound among those who "run" the sport in the UK. Until it has collapsed ( ie no longer financially viable at all ) - possibly there is a faint chance that adapting the sport to make it more exciting might happen. Those old dinosaur fans ( I use that term before critics do ) like myself remember when the best riders in the world were handicapped. Crowds were enormous then ( yes, for other reasons as well, but it put off very few and made it much more exciting for thousands of others ). How we would like to use that word "thousands" were watching nowadays. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, waytogo28 said:

Closed ears and closed minds abound among those who "run" the sport in the UK. Until it has collapsed ( ie no longer financially viable at all ) - possibly there is a faint chance that adapting the sport to make it more exciting might happen. Those old dinosaur fans ( I use that term before critics do ) like myself remember when the best riders in the world were handicapped. Crowds were enormous then ( yes, for other reasons as well, but it put off very few and made it much more exciting for thousands of others ). How we would like to use that word "thousands" were watching nowadays. 

Personally i think its an excellent proposition as there are far too many riders who are gaters only rather than all round speedway racers. However for the sport to survive in any format in the future i fear it will be as exhibition style events with a lot more razzle dazzle included. Other sports have branched into things like X games, arena cross etc and that is where speedway could ultimately head. Staggered starts, even machines, even riders, big tracks, small tracks all could be included. All riders competing for points monies only? Anything new and bold has to be considered if the sport we know remotely as Speedway has any chance of survival.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why not just let the leading rider have first choice of gate position for re-run 2nd place gets 2nd choice etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For a start, the promoters would need to prepare a decent racetrack to give those riders on a handicap a chance to pass.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Speedway is 90 years old. Surely every idea that was originally thought a good idea has been tried and dumped.

Gimmicks are for those with short attention fans. Serious supporters want a credible sport.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, moxey63 said:

Speedway is 90 years old. Surely every idea that was originally thought a good idea has been tried and dumped.

Gimmicks are for those with short attention fans. Serious supporters want a credible sport.

Whilst i agree with the sentiment that you are saying the number of serious supporters is waning whilst the number of short attention fans as you call them are growing. 

Only got to look at the roots of the sport to see its in trouble, youth, amateur & development leagues have all seen a drop in numbers and standard. Continuing on with a 90 year old model will see the same fate as high streets that have failed to move with the times, low foot fall, run down and what is there isn't worth looking at.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, Sings4Speedway said:

Whilst i agree with the sentiment that you are saying the number of serious supporters is waning whilst the number of short attention fans as you call them are growing. 

Only got to look at the roots of the sport to see its in trouble, youth, amateur & development leagues have all seen a drop in numbers and standard. Continuing on with a 90 year old model will see the same fate as high streets that have failed to move with the times, low foot fall, run down and what is there isn't worth looking at.

We often compare speedway with football. Football is a simple sport and is easy to follow. Speedway, though it is a simple sport, four riders, four laps, 3, 2, 1 etc, it is when you start widening the horizons of parts of it and question which jewels might attract and keep supporters. 

Guest riders are a problem. Try explaining that one to an outsider. Riders doubling up and down, that's another one that even hardcore fans scratch their heads a little over. The double-points rule was a good one, in which riders who had the lead had to shut off to allow their team mate through, so they could gain the double points for their side. Yet the rule is a rider will be excluded for not making a bonafide effort to race. Thankfully, though it took a decade and a half, that rule has now gone.

The rule which allows riders to flit to and from various teams is one big laugh. We have an incident right now, don't we, in which a side is so weak that it has failed to win a match. Because of this team's low achieving start to the season, it has therefore been able to sign a rider with the introduction of the new averages. Now, after that dubious ploy, I'd fathom a guess that riders who were in that team, but had mysteriously been off form, will get that form straight back - and the team will crusade right towards the play-offs.

We have seen it before, and it is a big fat farce. Not many years back wasn't there a side that was investigated for chucking points. It was a side that was struggling and riders were having mysterious engine failures. It was still early season and I guess they wanted to lower averages to strengthen when the team level was reset. The play-offs were still in sight and achievable.

I also recall, after their investigation, didn't the authorities reduce the number of play-off places available mid-season down from five to four because, although they said they found no proof of result-manipulating, the fact that they cut play-off places sort of gives you the clue what they thought.

Now, if new fans are attracted by that sort of activity, then they are welcome to it.

Edited by moxey63

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, moxey63 said:

We often compare speedway with football. Football is a simple sport and is easy to follow. Speedway, though it is a simple sport, four riders, four laps, 3, 2, 1 etc, it is when you start widening the horizons of parts of it and question which jewels might attract and keep supporters. 

Guest riders are a problem. Try explaining that one to an outsider. Riders doubling up and down, that's another one that even hardcore fans scratch their heads a little over. The double-points rule was a good one, in which riders who had the lead had to shut off to allow their team mate through, so they could gain the double points for their side. Yet the rule is a rider will be excluded for not making a bonafide effort to race. Thankfully, though it took a decade and a half, that rule has now gone.

The rule which allows riders to flit to and from various teams is one big laugh. We have an incident right now, don't we, in which a side is so weak that it has failed to win a match. Because of this team's low achieving start to the season, it has therefore been able to sign a rider with the introduction of the new averages. Now, after that dubious ploy, I'd fathom a guess that riders who were in that team, but had mysteriously been off form, will get that form straight back - and the team will crusade right towards the play-offs.

We have seen it before, and it is a big fat farce. Not many years back wasn't there a side that was investigated for chucking points. It was a side that was struggling and riders were having mysterious engine failures. It was still early season and I guess they wanted to lower averages to strengthen when the team level was reset. The play-offs were still in sight and achievable.

I also recall, after their investigation, didn't the authorities reduce the number of play-off places available mid-season down from five to four because, although they said they found no proof of result-manipulating, the fact that they cut play-off places sort of gives you the clue what they thought.

Now, if new fans are attracted by that sort of activity, then they are welcome to it.

The problem with any football comparison is that football is the leading sport even at primary school level, everyone can play it and everyone has actually heard of it. There is no doubt the rules of the sport are far too complex and disjointed but also they are kept secret. When tactical rides come into play why not offer up a fanfare to that rider, make a big deal of it rather than a mumbled mention from the announcer that a "tac sub" is occurring. When again football players transfer there are wide ranging big announcements, publicised speculation and grand unveiling. As for average manipulation that can and will always happen all the while there are promotions making money out of it, if riders needed every point they could get that would be taken away immediately. 

Its been mooted many times before that changes don't need to be wholesale but the sport is on a decline at present with only self interests driving it, sadly its being driven into the ground. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. Privacy Policy