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Belle vue v Peterboro 13th june thursday

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also Adrian has attracted 3/4 new sponsorsors for the club bike right/hycote/thornley solictors etc so well done Adrian !!

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4 minutes ago, acef said:

I can’t recall that ever happening at the NSS. I think once we had a rain off during the meeting. BV is a different entity and shouldn’t be put into the same bracket as others. It stands the rain, everyone knows that, and this promotion have an excellent record when it comes to making the right choices vs weather 

Its very difficult to make up the public's mind for them. When its peeing down during the morning/day/night before plenty will make the opinion of either Speedway will be off, it can't run this wet even with excellent facilities like the NSS. Once people have made their minds up not to attend its much harder to get them through the gate even if the sun does come out and its a glorious evening, its not a slight on Belle Vue its a statement based upon my opinions of todays paying public.

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2 hours ago, Halifaxtiger said:

How can the matches before hand be 'devoid of relevance'  ? If you lose them all you can't get in the play offs !!

I ask again. Do you think Leeds United fans believe that their season was 'devoid of relevance' ? 

Teams can't be changed for the play offs now. 

£29 at Halifax Town for an adult and a 16 year old. Not sure how many minutes you get, but it isn't 90. You cannot simply say something isn't value for money without comparing it to the other options. 

Personally speaking, I'd far sooner listen to the needs of my existing customers in the hope of hanging onto them and attracting new ones rather than trying to get those who have left back. Most of the latter, it seems to me, do nothing other than slag speedway off. They very rarely actually highlight any of the reasons for going, simply reasons why you shouldn't and that is overwhelmingly evidenced on the pages of this forum. 

Speedway isn't OK, that's quite clear. But I don't believe its problems will be solved by cutting prices (to precisely what remains to be seen but unquestionably involves a massive financial risk), changing to an unidentified race night and getting rid of the play offs (the meetings which attract by far and away the biggest club attendances during the season).

A few years ago, Belle Vue did a special £10 entry. The first week the crowd was much improved. The second week it was down a bit, the third week back to normal. Result : huge loss.

To me, the answer lies far more in progressive, hugely customer focussed promotion of the kind undertaken by the Isle of Wight, improving the actual product and, indeed, reforming the governance of the sport. 

It needs to be £20 to pay the bills, in fact at these numbers even £20 doesn’t cover the costs!

Unfortunately the demand is as such that £20 is too expensive, for BV at least, and the numbers back this up.

We have a better product than any other track. If BV are struggling to break even, with the quality on offer, then that tells me we are too expensive.

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1 hour ago, waytogo28 said:

Sadly though, two of the main proponents of this attitude are the Chairperson and his Vice Chair of the BSPA. Ooops! Another fine mess they got us into.

They have a couple of jobs to finish before sorting out UK speedway. 

Once they finished delivering that piano up an unfeasibly large amount of stairs they’re off to rob an empty house. Unbeknown to them though there’s a 10 year old kid been left behind.  

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1 hour ago, NeilWatson said:

One fixture in June, three in two weeks at the beginning of July, then 2nd September ( unless you have a different fixture list to me....)

With the fours it averages one a week over the next five weeks. 

Aside from the fours the September one will provide the best crowd, in accordance with my original point. 

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11 minutes ago, acef said:

It needs to be £20 to pay the bills, in fact at these numbers even £20 doesn’t cover the costs!

Unfortunately the demand is as such that £20 is too expensive, for BV at least, and the numbers back this up.

We have a better product than any other track. If BV are struggling to break even, with the quality on offer, then that tells me we are too expensive.

It's not just Belle Vue though is it. When you look at the numbers coming through the turnstiles, it's hard to see how many tracks can remain solvent. Kent are probably one of the few clubs that consistently make a profit.

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14 minutes ago, acef said:

It needs to be £20 to pay the bills, in fact at these numbers even £20 doesn’t cover the costs!

Unfortunately the demand is as such that £20 is too expensive, for BV at least, and the numbers back this up.

We have a better product than any other track. If BV are struggling to break even, with the quality on offer, then that tells me we are too expensive.

There are bills that cannot be cut down on and those that can. Rent, insurance, medical cover is a constant / is rising so the only clear way to reduce costs is on rider wages. Basic enough maths suggests that if you paid the riders half what they are on now you could charge half as much (obviously that isn't 100% correct but for a point to be made lets run with it). All clubs need to state that this year we are only charging X admission therefore wages will be Y. Yes plenty of riders will strop and walk away but there will be enough left over to fill the leagues  (even if those riders do the unthinkable and get another job).

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4 minutes ago, cityrebel said:

It's not just Belle Vue though is it. When you look at the numbers coming through the turnstiles, it's hard to see how many tracks can remain solvent. Kent are probably one of the few clubs that consistently make a profit.

Most are not solvent and are surviving on borrowed money.

 

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4 minutes ago, Sings4Speedway said:

There are bills that cannot be cut down on and those that can. Rent, insurance, medical cover is a constant / is rising so the only clear way to reduce costs is on rider wages. Basic enough maths suggests that if you paid the riders half what they are on now you could charge half as much (obviously that isn't 100% correct but for a point to be made lets run with it). All clubs need to state that this year we are only charging X admission therefore wages will be Y. Yes plenty of riders will strop and walk away but there will be enough left over to fill the leagues  (even if those riders do the unthinkable and get another job).

I think more than half would walk away. Cut rider wages and the sport becomes amateur here.

I don’t think we can just cut wages without first cutting the cost of machinery.

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32 minutes ago, acef said:

I think more than half would walk away. Cut rider wages and the sport becomes amateur here.

I don’t think we can just cut wages without first cutting the cost of machinery.

See i view it as the other way around. Cut wages and riders will naturally cut the costs of machinery. There is no need for new bikes every year, new engines at every new track etc Properly maintained bikes will still be competitive the current mentality is just vanity and superficial (not just riders but clubs also). All those that race because they "love to ride their bikes" will find ways to reduce costs and still make a living out of it.

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1 hour ago, ouch said:

With the fours it averages one a week over the next five weeks. 

Aside from the fours the September one will provide the best crowd, in accordance with my original point. 

If a club races Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday and Friday then nothing for four weeks - that’s an average of once a week too.....

Think you’re missing the point

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35 minutes ago, acef said:

I think more than half would walk away. Cut rider wages and the sport becomes amateur here.

I don’t think we can just cut wages without first cutting the cost of machinery.

Just very roughly working it out, if you say for 4-5 rides

Dope £8

Oil £15

Rear Tyre a guess @ £40-45 ?

£15 -£20 per race for engine service ( so £440-£660) if a rider has the motor serviced every 30 rides. That's probably not a top end UK rider either.

Add to that clutch plates ,baskets, chains, lubes, sprockets, ignition systems, bent bits and engine blow ups.

It's not cheap for the average UK rider:blink:

Would be great for a rider to give us a more accurate figure :t:

 

 

 

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31 minutes ago, Bald Bloke said:

Just very roughly working it out, if you say for 4-5 rides

Dope £8

Oil £15

Rear Tyre a guess @ £40-45 ?

£15 -£20 per race for engine service ( so £440-£660) if a rider has the motor serviced every 30 rides. That's probably not a top end UK rider either.

Add to that clutch plates ,baskets, chains, lubes, sprockets, ignition systems, bent bits and engine blow ups.

It's not cheap for the average UK rider:blink:

Would be great for a rider to give us a more accurate figure :t:

 

 

 

Ball park enough figures but don't forget those running costs apply just the same to a GP rider as they do a development league rider. Adding all the above running costs up over 6 meetings is circa £1200. Thats £200 per meeting. At lower NL level paying £20 per point a rider needs to score paid ten to break even. As you slide up through the leagues you can see those who earn a good living out of it (and see the dedication of those who run at a loss in the lower leagues whilst trying to make their breakthrough) . 

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3 minutes ago, Sings4Speedway said:

Ball park enough figures but don't forget those running costs apply just the same to a GP rider as they do a development league rider. Adding all the above running costs up over 6 meetings is circa £1200. Thats £200 per meeting. At lower NL level paying £20 per point a rider needs to score paid ten to break even. As you slide up through the leagues you can see those who earn a good living out of it (and see the dedication of those who run at a loss in the lower leagues whilst trying to make their breakthrough) . 

If you are professional in the top league then you need to be earning enough for it to be your sole income. Your wage covers pretty much everything.

But like any trade, especially those who are self employed, it’s where supply meets demand.

There is no demand at the top level but this is the devil and the deep blue sea as far as clubs/riders and fans are concerned.

However we address it, someone is going to kip for something and at the moment it’s the clubs and the fans 

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46 minutes ago, Bald Bloke said:

Just very roughly working it out, if you say for 4-5 rides

Dope £8

Oil £15

Rear Tyre a guess @ £40-45 ?

£15 -£20 per race for engine service ( so £440-£660) if a rider has the motor serviced every 30 rides. That's probably not a top end UK rider either.

Add to that clutch plates ,baskets, chains, lubes, sprockets, ignition systems, bent bits and engine blow ups.

It's not cheap for the average UK rider:blink:

Would be great for a rider to give us a more accurate figure :t:

 

 

 

It’s not cheap is it? A rider in the top league over here once said to me he needs to be earning £600 a meeting to meet costs and to live his normal life

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