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GUEST RIDER BRAINWAVE!!

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On 6/15/2019 at 7:48 AM, waytogo28 said:

I genuinely and sincerely don't believe that racing is better than ever and I really don't think that I am peering through rose-tinted spectacles.

Over the last 20 years the percentage of Gate and Go - tapes to flag processions has risen dramatically. Now averaging 12 from 15 heats - if you are lucky, three decent races with passing or the possibility of doing so. In UK racing.

As for Guests being called Stars or whatever, how does that avoid the feeling that Chris Harris ( for example ) pops up Here There and Everywhere while really riding for another supposedly rival team? 

Because many people won't know it's Harris just that it's a guest rider, that is the point, don't know, doesn't matter ...

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16 hours ago, The White Knight said:

You reckon? :o:o:blink:

Read my post again, it doesn't say that ....

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11 hours ago, mikebv said:

Whilst 'guests are a necessary evil' (in Britain), then the sport (as a team concept) simply won't move forward, because it can't can it? 

Imagine Wroclaw using Dudek to replace the injured Woffy?

ZG fans would lynch him should he score the points for Wroclaw that prevents ZG from qualifying for the play offs..

And Wroclaw fans would lynch him if he scored next to nothing and they didn't. ..:D

In Poland it actually means something. To fans, media and (probably most importantly) the blue chip sponsors. 

And if they ran a guest system it wouldn't have anywhere near the same stature, nor mean so much..

I do though think that guests are here to stay as it's the 'easiest' way of running the sport and provides riders with extra earning potential...

One rider once told me that 'guesting' was the cherry on the top of the icing on top of the cake...

I think now for many riders it now just forms part of the cake, hence will carry on being part of the plan..

Poland have enough money to do what they like, enough strength in depth to cover for their number ones being injured, enough riders attracted to the money available in their league, we don't!

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11 hours ago, mikebv said:

The fact 'no one cared' is (sadly), probably the biggest clue as to the worth of the competitions...

Unless it means something to win, then really, why bother? 

Believe it or not, it does!!

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12 hours ago, orion said:

So if say Jason Doyle is out injured you replaced him with a championship rider of 4.50 ?  

Yes & no, if Doyle was injured your team would look like this

1. Batchelor 7.76

2. Wajiknecht 4.08

3. Ellis 6.76

4. Jensen 4.51

5. Musielak 6.41

6. Perks 3.00

7. Guest 3.00

The team just gets moved around and any guests come in at reserve. I don't think it's right that straight swap guests should be used, I'm a firm believer that a result should be determined by the teams own rider's rather than a track specialist guest that actually performs better than the replaced rider. It gives the opportunity for other riders in the team to step up. Also gives another opportunity to an up and coming rider to make an impression. 

Especially at home that team should have enough to not get beaten if they ride to their potential. 

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23 minutes ago, Daniel Smith said:

Yes & no, if Doyle was injured your team would look like this

1. Batchelor 7.76

2. Wajiknecht 4.08

3. Ellis 6.76

4. Jensen 4.51

5. Musielak 6.41

6. Perks 3.00

7. Guest 3.00

The team just gets moved around and any guests come in at reserve. I don't think it's right that straight swap guests should be used, I'm a firm believer that a result should be determined by the teams own rider's rather than a track specialist guest that actually performs better than the replaced rider. It gives the opportunity for other riders in the team to step up. Also gives another opportunity to an up and coming rider to make an impression. 

Especially at home that team should have enough to not get beaten if they ride to their potential. 

So if they were away not only were they be certain to lose the match the crowd would suffer as well .. The above example is why will still have guests because as  nearly every idea lacks any idea about the money side of the sport 

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46 minutes ago, Daniel Smith said:

Yes & no, if Doyle was injured your team would look like this

1. Batchelor 7.76

2. Wajiknecht 4.08

3. Ellis 6.76

4. Jensen 4.51

5. Musielak 6.41

6. Perks 3.00

7. Guest 3.00

The team just gets moved around and any guests come in at reserve. I don't think it's right that straight swap guests should be used, I'm a firm believer that a result should be determined by the teams own rider's rather than a track specialist guest that actually performs better than the replaced rider. It gives the opportunity for other riders in the team to step up. Also gives another opportunity to an up and coming rider to make an impression. 

Especially at home that team should have enough to not get beaten if they ride to their potential. 

Can see the logic and it does take away the tactical advantage to be gained by having a missing rider who gets replaced by someone who maybe is better at certain tracks..

For me, in this scenario, if no Doyle then RR should be used meaning Batchelor, Eliis, and Musielak (or any rider Rosco wants), should be able to cover all Doyle rides up to each having seven rides max. eg Rosco may want Batchelor to take his own four rides and three of Doyle with Ellis taking his own four and one of Doyles..

They can then have a Number 8 on standby, a 3 point man as you describe, to come in should anyone else get injured during the meeting, or even take some reserve rides if Rosco wants him to..

As the 'genuine No1' is seemingly becoming a thing of the past in the UK then there should be a lessening need for guests as the 'big hitter', who used to score a big portion of a teams points, no longer impacts meetings in the same way..

Using RR would not only provide credibility but it would also give the riders within the team more opportunities to earn more money, rather than have a guest come in and hoover up some cash, and it would maintain both team spirit and team identity..

 

Edited by mikebv
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I've always felt that 'guests' is the wrong word to use and they should be classed as something like an 'injury loan' or 'meeting loan'. As long as there's not 3 or 4 riders missing I don't see it as a huge problem, would think that a simple explanation to a new viewer is enough for them to understand why it happens and accept that at times it's necessary

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I think you'll find the National League of the late 80s ran with a no guest policy up until the league merger with the BL at the end of 1990. 

So it can be done. 

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6 hours ago, Spl77 said:

I think you'll find the National League of the late 80s ran with a no guest policy up until the league merger with the BL at the end of 1990. 

So it can be done. 

Indeed the British League Division Two/New National League and later National League ran for many years without having to resort to using guests. There were a few exceptions and if I recall riders on World Championship duties could be replaced but I can't remember the specifics?

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On 6/24/2019 at 7:23 PM, steve roberts said:

Indeed the British League Division Two/New National League and later National League ran for many years without having to resort to using guests. There were a few exceptions and if I recall riders on World Championship duties could be replaced but I can't remember the specifics?

And that league was fair more successful in the last few years than the old BL. 

Maybe the promoter's should dust off the old NL rule book

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On 6/17/2019 at 8:19 AM, Odds On said:

speedway is all but done, take Saturdays Grand Prix as an example, 16 of the best riders in the world(in theory), 24 races and arguably 20 of those races were pure rubbish, very little in terms of entertainment and excitement.

I would say that 80-90% of speedway meetings see the first 25% of a meeting with no overtaking or excitement other than when a rider gets out of shape.

It is also very noticeable that nowadays riders find it hard to control a bike if the track is anything other than a smooth and shale less..

Right now there aren't many people making money out of the sport, the top riders and engine tuners for sure but the vast majority of riders and promoters are doing their proverbials.

Fans need to realise that in a matter of only a few years there will only be one league in the UK, as Clubs will sadly go to the wall and never return.

Speedway is in the entertainment business,it needs to start entertaining to the wider audience than just the die hard speedway fan.

Absolutely right, why would anyone want to watch Speedway when its a total procession for the majority of the meeting, the sport is not exciting anymore most of it is like the last GP., of course there are exceptions but few and far between. Bikes need to be slower, just because the bikes are fast doesn't make the racing exciting.

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On 6/17/2019 at 8:19 AM, Odds On said:

speedway is all but done, take Saturdays Grand Prix as an example, 16 of the best riders in the world(in theory), 24 races and arguably 20 of those races were pure rubbish, very little in terms of entertainment and excitement.

I would say that 80-90% of speedway meetings see the first 25% of a meeting with no overtaking or excitement other than when a rider gets out of shape.

It is also very noticeable that nowadays riders find it hard to control a bike if the track is anything other than a smooth and shale less..

Right now there aren't many people making money out of the sport, the top riders and engine tuners for sure but the vast majority of riders and promoters are doing their proverbials.

Fans need to realise that in a matter of only a few years there will only be one league in the UK, as Clubs will sadly go to the wall and never return.

Speedway is in the entertainment business,it needs to start entertaining to the wider audience than just the die hard speedway fan.

Truly spot on! Only standardised bikes and results only rewards ( points money ) will give us a return to much better racing ( and it is not in my imagination that it was much better in the last century ). Rocketship bikes have made UK speedway into an even more Gate & Go paradise - with zero entertainment. 

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