iris123 20,918 Posted November 3, 2019 31 minutes ago, iainb said: Castanga says “The main thinking for us is to harmonise our championship scoring system with other big sports events so that the winner always comes away with the most points, which will help attract and retain a wider audience for our sport.” I can't think of any other World Championship series that has 2 semis and a final, although no doubt somebody will correct me. So if you want to harmonise with "other big sports" (and that's a whole different argument as to whether Speedway is a "big sport") then award the points after 20 heats... other wise leave well alone Castagna comes out with a load of rubbish. And a lot of poor developments for the sport under his watch 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ghostwalker 1,858 Posted November 3, 2019 On 11/2/2019 at 12:05 PM, DutchGrasstrack said: Confirmed rule changes: Points per GP: 20, 18, 16, 14, 12, 11, 10, 9, 8 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, 0 GP 2021: - Top 6 GP 2020 - Top 3 GP challenge - European champion - 5 wildcards 5 wildcards in theory, 3 in reality since 7th and 8th placed riders will be given ones by default anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bavarian 765 Posted November 3, 2019 Castagna is really really bad for the sport. He is misleading it in a totally wrong direction. Speedway is such a special sport - a team Sport first adn foremost - and as such is absolutey different to any other from of motorsport. That's why I am a speedway fan and couldn't care less about road racing or motocross. They ususally only have one long distance race and have to award championship points for that. Speedway has 20+ heat races, plus semi and final, were the riders EARN their points. Perfectly easy to understand. And the winner of the last race in a Gradn Prix (the final heat 23) is the winner of that particular SGP, regardless of the points total scored in all of his races during this meeting. By the way, the winner of that final race DOES actually get the most points (in that race, that is) - three points , compared to two points for second and one for the third. So what, if the rider who wins the final, has not scored the most points on aggregate from all of the races he has ridden that night, nothing wrong with that. It's perfectly fair that he does not automatically get the most points, when he has got beaten more often than another rider/riders. There is absolutely no need to award artificial points in Speedway. I hate this stupid stupid decision by the FIM. Castagna has to go. First they abandoned the hugely popular SWC and gave us a "Speedway of Nations" to fall in line with the "Motocross of Nations", "Flat Track of Nations" and "Enduro of Nations", and now they spoil the SGP by changing from a perfectly fair points scoring system to a totally unfair and unwanted artificial one. I'm fed up. What's Your next idea, Mr Castagna? Do us all a favour and please, please resign from Your position !!! 18 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
iwright71 206 Posted November 3, 2019 1 hour ago, Bavarian said: Castagna is really really bad for the sport. He is misleading it in a totally wrong direction. Speedway is such a special sport - a team Sport first adn foremost - and as such is absolutey different to any other from of motorsport. That's why I am a speedway fan and couldn't care less about road racing or motocross. They ususally only have one long distance race and have to award championship points for that. Speedway has 20+ heat races, plus semi and final, were the riders EARN their points. Perfectly easy to understand. And the winner of the last race in a Gradn Prix (the final heat 23) is the winner of that particular SGP, regardless of the points total scored in all of his races during this meeting. By the way, the winner of that final race DOES actually get the most points (in that race, that is) - three points , compared to two points for second and one for the third. So what, if the rider who wins the final, has not scored the most points on aggregate from all of the races he has ridden that night, nothing wrong with that. It's perfectly fair that he does not automatically get the most points, when he has got beaten more often than another rider/riders. There is absolutely no need to award artificial points in Speedway. I hate this stupid stupid decision by the FIM. Castagna has to go. First they abandoned the hugely popular SWC and gave us a "Speedway of Nations" to fall in line with the "Motocross of Nations", "Flat Track of Nations" and "Enduro of Nations", and now they spoil the SGP by changing from a perfectly fair points scoring system to a totally unfair and unwanted artificial one. I'm fed up. What's Your next idea, Mr Castagna? Do us all a favour and please, please resign from Your position !!! Bet Phillip Rising doesn't agree with you ? 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
willstaxi 280 Posted November 3, 2019 It used be 16 riders 20 heats top points scorer wins ( with run offs if needed) ,then along comes the GP's with A,B.C & D finals followed by various tweaks including the ill thought out knock out system. After a few years we went back to 16 riders 20 heats this time with semi's and a final , the top scorer over the season is world champion, simples. I can see no reason tor another change, we do not need to come into line with other motor sports because speedway is unlike any other, 4 riders 4 laps 60 seconds and it works 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f-s-p 832 Posted November 3, 2019 3 hours ago, Bavarian said: Castagna is really really bad for the sport. He is misleading it in a totally wrong direction. Speedway is such a special sport - a team Sport first adn foremost - and as such is absolutey different to any other from of motorsport. That's why I am a speedway fan and couldn't care less about road racing or motocross. They ususally only have one long distance race and have to award championship points for that. Speedway has 20+ heat races, plus semi and final, were the riders EARN their points. Perfectly easy to understand. And the winner of the last race in a Gradn Prix (the final heat 23) is the winner of that particular SGP, regardless of the points total scored in all of his races during this meeting. By the way, the winner of that final race DOES actually get the most points (in that race, that is) - three points , compared to two points for second and one for the third. So what, if the rider who wins the final, has not scored the most points on aggregate from all of the races he has ridden that night, nothing wrong with that. It's perfectly fair that he does not automatically get the most points, when he has got beaten more often than another rider/riders. There is absolutely no need to award artificial points in Speedway. I hate this stupid stupid decision by the FIM. Castagna has to go. First they abandoned the hugely popular SWC and gave us a "Speedway of Nations" to fall in line with the "Motocross of Nations", "Flat Track of Nations" and "Enduro of Nations", and now they spoil the SGP by changing from a perfectly fair points scoring system to a totally unfair and unwanted artificial one. I'm fed up. What's Your next idea, Mr Castagna? Do us all a favour and please, please resign from Your position !!! I could have written that! Only thing I see different is the scrapping of SWC. It was too expensive and not enough countries could do it anymore. Smaller teams, less expensive was the only way to go... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bavarian 765 Posted November 3, 2019 Sure, but they could and should have retained the SWC for the major nations (let's say the top 8 or 9 countries) every other year, alternating with the SoN pairs event, which could have included all of the other minor speedway nations (maybe 15 or even more). This would have addedd much more variety to teh international speedway calendar and would surely have been much more acceptable, compared to replacing the popular SWC with not quite as popular SoN. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattK 3,447 Posted November 3, 2019 20 minutes ago, f-s-p said: I could have written that! Only thing I see different is the scrapping of SWC. It was too expensive and not enough countries could do it anymore. Smaller teams, less expensive was the only way to go... Is SWC dead and SoN now the annual event? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f-s-p 832 Posted November 3, 2019 1 hour ago, MattK said: Is SWC dead and SoN now the annual event? I don't know what's written on the fancy paper at FIM headquarters, but if you ask me, I can't see 4-5 rider teams coming back to the World championship team speedway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grand Central 2,654 Posted November 3, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, f-s-p said: I could have written that! Only thing I see different is the scrapping of SWC. It was too expensive and not enough countries could do it anymore. Smaller teams, less expensive was the only way to go... No doubt about the problems of the SWC and the need for some changes But that did not mean that they answer was the ridiculous SON format, rules and even more stupid title they came up with. Trouble seems to be that Castagna and chums cannot come up with the right response when needed, no matter what situation they are given. Something NEEDS change because there are real issues needing to be resolved ... Their ham-fisted way gives us a botched product like the SON. Meanwhile something that works really well like SGP scoring and needs no change and they cannot stop themselves messing around with it to make it worse. Why is it that in just about EVERY walk of life, every institution, every international sporting body, every bloody government seems to be headed by total f..wits at the moment ? Edited November 3, 2019 by Grand Central Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PHILIPRISING 7,298 Posted November 3, 2019 5 hours ago, iwright71 said: Bet Phillip Rising doesn't agree with you ? HOW much Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f-s-p 832 Posted November 3, 2019 32 minutes ago, Grand Central said: No doubt about the problems of the SWC and the need for some changes But that did not mean that they answer was the ridiculous SON format, rules and even more stupid title they came up with. Trouble seems to be that Castagna and chums cannot come up with the right response when needed, no matter what situation they are given. Something NEEDS change because there are real issues needing to be resolved ... Their ham-fisted way gives us a botched product like the SON. Meanwhile something that works really well like SGP scoring and needs no change and they cannot stop themselves messing around with it to make it worse. Why is it that in just about EVERY walk of life, every institution, every international sporting body, every bloody government seems to be headed by total f..wits at the moment ? Son is just a title of a competition. The name doesnt bother me. Since the swc was a no go, best pairs was the only way to go. SoN is just a name for it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grand Central 2,654 Posted November 3, 2019 14 minutes ago, f-s-p said: Son is just a title of a competition. The name doesnt bother me. Since the swc was a no go, best pairs was the only way to go. SoN is just a name for it. Dont agree at all. I think the title matters quite a bit. Especially for that illusive 'credibility' everyone seems to value so much. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mark 1,497 Posted November 3, 2019 Could the new points system lead to cheating ? If points from heats 1-20 dont count toward the Championship could a rider who is safe for the semi let a team sponsor mate win a race so that he also reaches the semi. It will happen. 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
racers and royals 8,711 Posted November 3, 2019 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Mark said: Could the new points system lead to cheating ? If points from heats 1-20 dont count toward the Championship could a rider who is safe for the semi let a team sponsor mate win a race so that he also reaches the semi. It will happen. They will still need as many points as possible for the best gate picks in the semi. Edited November 3, 2019 by racers and royals Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
