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Wolverhampton 2020

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18 hours ago, BWitcher said:

Even by speedway fan's standards, that is an absolute ridiculous statement.

None of it has anything to do with last year. You don't take advantage of riders being on lower averages than they should be, by building a team 2pts under the limit. That immediately negates much of the expected increase.

Under no circumstances is it a 'pretty good position' to be in.

If you honestly believe that Nicol at reserve and Becker in the main body of the team is stronger than the likes of Andersen/Harris/Nicholls at 2 and Becker at reserve then you have a point... but you cannot possibly think that.

As regards changes... what changes are we going to make? Chances are as we have said there will be some improvement in the team... that would take us back to the limit, so who are you going to change? You won't want to drop those who have been improved..  so any opportunity to strengthen would likely be gone.

If we are up to the 42.5 limit by mid season, with rolling averages, it will mean we are doing very well and cruising into the playoffs, so no need to strengthen. If the team is under performing then there will be scope to strengthen. Who's to say the likes of Woffy, Lindgren etc wouldn't be tempted in for the run in and playoffs, it's happened before, remember.

I fully understand all of your points, they are valid, but it's not a weak team. If they do under perform, there will be room for strengthening.

I would much rather we built to 42.5, but with the riders we have, I am satisfied with the team, and we have 3 great prospects for the future.

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33 minutes ago, Call me wolfie said:

If we are up to the 42.5 limit by mid season, with rolling averages, it will mean we are doing very well and cruising into the playoffs, so no need to strengthen. If the team is under performing then there will be scope to strengthen. Who's to say the likes of Woffy, Lindgren etc wouldn't be tempted in for the run in and playoffs, it's happened before, remember.

I fully understand all of your points, they are valid, but it's not a weak team. If they do under perform, there will be room for strengthening.

I would much rather we built to 42.5, but with the riders we have, I am satisfied with the team, and we have 3 great prospects for the future.

It doesn't matter how you try and twist it.

If we're up to 42.5 by mid season its a blown opportunity as we should have been around 44.5 and dominating.

There is no justification whatsoever for starting 2pts weaker than necessary... only cost.

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9 minutes ago, BWitcher said:

It doesn't matter how you try and twist it.

If we're up to 42.5 by mid season its a blown opportunity as we should have been around 44.5 and dominating.

There is no justification whatsoever for starting 2pts weaker than necessary... only cost.

I don't think it's anything to do with cost at all, had Freddy or Greg made themselves available they would be in.

Personally I would rather watch 3 young riders in Douglas, Becker and Nicol develop than a has been who's career is on a downward spiral

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25 minutes ago, Call me wolfie said:

I don't think it's anything to do with cost at all, had Freddy or Greg made themselves available they would be in.

Personally I would rather watch 3 young riders in Douglas, Becker and Nicol develop than a has been who's career is on a downward spiral

So why is Schlein in the side then?

Why was PK in the side for many years?

It doesn't matter how you twist it, starting two points below the limit is absolutely ridiculous when there is zero reason to do so. You can have all the young improving riders, but you build to the points limit. 

 

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25 minutes ago, Call me wolfie said:

I don't think it's anything to do with cost at all, had Freddy or Greg made themselves available they would be in.

Personally I would rather watch 3 young riders in Douglas, Becker and Nicol develop than a has been who's career is on a downward spiral

Saw Douglas and Nicol in the CL at Eastie last year, both were fantastic having never riden our awkward/tight track before. From the outside the fact you've got riders who could be the backbone of your team for seasons to come can only be good. I understand being under 2 points grates for some, but long term looks the right way to me, only shame is Nichol isn't doubling with us at Eastie. I'm sure all 3 will up their average this season too, playoffs the aim first,  then who knows, Wolves have done it before as we know to our cost,  2002 still annoys me!

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2 hours ago, BWitcher said:

It doesn't matter how you try and twist it.

If we're up to 42.5 by mid season its a blown opportunity as we should have been around 44.5 and dominating.

There is no justification whatsoever for starting 2pts weaker than necessary... only cost.

Nail. Head.

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1 hour ago, gazzac said:

Saw Douglas and Nicol in the CL at Eastie last year, both were fantastic having never riden our awkward/tight track before. From the outside the fact you've got riders who could be the backbone of your team for seasons to come can only be good. I understand being under 2 points grates for some, but long term looks the right way to me, only shame is Nichol isn't doubling with us at Eastie. I'm sure all 3 will up their average this season too, playoffs the aim first,  then who knows, Wolves have done it before as we know to our cost,  2002 still annoys me!

Mikael:D

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Do agree with bwitcher on this. I cannot understand why we are starting the season with a team 2 points below the points limit. 

When the points limit was revealed I wondered whether we would stick with the same 7 as last year. But with Sheffield entering the league that felt like an obvious destination for Howarth who knows that track well and it probably suits him more than Monmore.

If the other 6 riders remain as last season, then the only issue to decide if it has been a successful transfer window is to compare Howarth and Nicol. If Howarth had stayed I suspect he would have averaged a similar amount to last season's 5.72. I would be over the moon if Nicol averaged more than that but I would be confident in saying he wont. So we must be worse off than if we had started with Howarth or someone that could match his average.

There is also an associated factor that Douglas and/or Becker would spend more of the season riding at reserve if Howarth had stayed. Which just adds to the issue

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Howarth's best days at Wolves were when he rode with Freddie. Once Lindgren didn't return, together with injuries, Kyle wasn't as effective.

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1 hour ago, DJWolves said:

Do agree with bwitcher on this. I cannot understand why we are starting the season with a team 2 points below the points limit. 

When the points limit was revealed I wondered whether we would stick with the same 7 as last year. But with Sheffield entering the league that felt like an obvious destination for Howarth who knows that track well and it probably suits him more than Monmore.

If the other 6 riders remain as last season, then the only issue to decide if it has been a successful transfer window is to compare Howarth and Nicol. If Howarth had stayed I suspect he would have averaged a similar amount to last season's 5.72. I would be over the moon if Nicol averaged more than that but I would be confident in saying he wont. So we must be worse off than if we had started with Howarth or someone that could match his average.

There is also an associated factor that Douglas and/or Becker would spend more of the season riding at reserve if Howarth had stayed. Which just adds to the issue

Absolutely spot on.

Now consider replacing Howarth with any of Harris, Nicholls, Hans Andersen, just three who would be available. All three of them would clean up as a second string at Monmore. If they went up in the team, so what you've got Masters, Thorssell or Schlein as a second string. It would have made us much stronger that last year... instead of weaker than last year.

Then, as you say Becker is at reserve.. should he, or indeed Douglas, really start banging in points, look at the calibre of rider to drop to reserve!

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2 hours ago, BWitcher said:

So why is Schlein in the side then?

Why was PK in the side for many years?

It doesn't matter how you twist it, starting two points below the limit is absolutely ridiculous when there is zero reason to do so. You can have all the young improving riders, but you build to the points limit. 

 

I have no problem with Rory being in the team, in fact he would have been one of the first names on my team sheet. He is our captain and will leave a massive hole to fill when he's gone. He may have only been with us for 2.5 seasons but really has embraced the club and put everything into it. When we lose it hurts him more than anyone else, that's the kind of spirit you need in a captain.

Who can forget Freddie getting injured at Belle Vue in 2017, it looked as though we were dead and buried but Rory pulled off a win from nowhere in heat 14 against Tungate and Bewley to take us to the final.

As for PK, well he's a Wolves legend, you can't say the same for the likes of Harris, Andersen or whichever other names you want to bring up.

Like it or not, the team will be what it is, so we have no choice but to embrace it for what it is, a team chosen with one eye on the future, and not a bad one at that.

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Maybe, just maybe, the reason for being 2 points under is that riders can up their averages significantly. Then come about August, for Play-Off's introduce Woffinden, Lindgren, Hancock etc for a final Play-Off push. 

It could be a bit of clever manipulation from the management knowing, when you look at Swindon for example, there's no significant improvement available in Doyle, Batchelor and Jensen. 

There's risks to the logic but the fact that Peterborough, King's Lynn and Ipswich are unlikely to trouble a top 2 of Swindon & Sheffield. It's about staying in touching distance of the top 4, then bang in some killer changes just as the European season starts to wind down. 

Quite possibly, an awesome plan is in the making from CVS and Adams. 

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2 hours ago, Wolfsbane said:

Mikael:D

Your picture is apt :D

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1 hour ago, Daniel Smith said:

Maybe, just maybe, the reason for being 2 points under is that riders can up their averages significantly.

Then come about August, for Play-Off's introduce Woffinden, Lindgren, Hancock etc for a final Play-Off push. 

 

 

Not quite getting this.

How does being two points under the limit help individual riders to increase their averages?

And if they collectively put on two points and increase to 42.5 Woffinden and Lindgren could only come in on a like for like basis to replace the top two riders (Masters or Thorssell) if they had increased their averages to 9.5.

Are you really suggesting that Wolves would sack Masters or Thorssell if they put 2 points each on their averages?

 

 

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1 hour ago, Daniel Smith said:

Maybe, just maybe, the reason for being 2 points under is that riders can up their averages significantly. Then come about August, for Play-Off's introduce Woffinden, Lindgren, Hancock etc for a final Play-Off push. 

It could be a bit of clever manipulation from the management knowing, when you look at Swindon for example, there's no significant improvement available in Doyle, Batchelor and Jensen. 

There's risks to the logic but the fact that Peterborough, King's Lynn and Ipswich are unlikely to trouble a top 2 of Swindon & Sheffield. It's about staying in touching distance of the top 4, then bang in some killer changes just as the European season starts to wind down. 

Quite possibly, an awesome plan is in the making from CVS and Adams. 

That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!

If you were going to do that, starting 2pts under the limit doesn't help you in the slightest, it actually hinders it. As '2pts' of your 'improvement' are wasted just reaching parity.

There isn't a single argument that can make starting 2pts under the limit a good option.

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