If you want to know what’s wrong with British speedway

[walle 2]

 Hi guys , well as an ex swindon second half rider back in the 70 s we had a good crowd with  local lads having a go , some time s I was thrown in the deep end and yes came last but  I gave it a  go on second hand bike s that  were  de tuned to last longer and 1 tyre for the season yes 1 tyre !!  I was broke but still had a go . Briggo  ashby and  broad banks all gave me a hand and I had a ball . but it was a  local and family driven crowd that  would give us lads support .A  lot of wannabe riders like me would have done a lot  better  given the finances . I migrated to Perth in the 80 s and watched racing at Claremont WOW good support, fast and local lads mixing with the tour riders . I pitted for a few lads  and it was better sponsored, Along with  a mixed format . side cars ,midget cars and solo , and junior riders all mixed with good commentary and hamburgers Brilliant to Watch ..my answer to British speedway is to mix it up ,cheaper  bikes  for up and comers . and a good second half . also the pits to be open and available to watch up close .again they do this at the drag racing here too .Briggo used to come out with us after the meeting to practice many thanks Barry .Bill y Wall

 

 

[Trees 2,814]

23 hours ago, Bagpuss said:

Which bit Theresa? 

90 mins duration for meetings Baggy ....

[Bagpuss 10,757]

1 hour ago, Trees said:

90 mins duration for meetings Baggy ....

Sometimes but there have been occasions where meetings at Lynn have gone on past half nine and I just think that is too long. Can’t be helped if there is an injury but when it’s lots of grading and an unnecessary interval it won’t get people coming back. 

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

On 11/17/2019 at 9:57 AM, walle said:

 Hi guys , well as an ex swindon second half rider back in the 70 s we had a good crowd with  local lads having a go , some time s I was thrown in the deep end and yes came last but  I gave it a  go on second hand bike s that  were  de tuned to last longer and 1 tyre for the season yes 1 tyre !!  I was broke but still had a go . Briggo  ashby and  broad banks all gave me a hand and I had a ball . but it was a  local and family driven crowd that  would give us lads support .A  lot of wannabe riders like me would have done a lot  better  given the finances . I migrated to Perth in the 80 s and watched racing at Claremont WOW good support, fast and local lads mixing with the tour riders . I pitted for a few lads  and it was better sponsored, Along with  a mixed format . side cars ,midget cars and solo , and junior riders all mixed with good commentary and hamburgers Brilliant to Watch ..my answer to British speedway is to mix it up ,cheaper  bikes  for up and comers . and a good second half . also the pits to be open and available to watch up close .again they do this at the drag racing here too .Briggo used to come out with us after the meeting to practice many thanks Barry .Bill y Wall

 

 

I remember you riding Billy after the likes of Clark Facey, Mac Woolford ( ect) i can remember you riding against Bobo Valentine , Martin Hitch (ect i loved the second halves. Also  Swindon had a great track record of producing local young riders over the years great days.

[walle 2]

Hi , yes bo bo stayed with me a few times and Martin hitch was a good bloke too , I got on well with dave ashby , and most of us were in it for the ride .  I  had a bingle on track with Jim Woodford on second turn but we went away friends, my last bike was ex mike keen and Jim would mechanic for him .and help me too. I had 6 away meetings with swindon  and scored a few points at belle Vue and out gated a few top riders for a couple of laps . I won  2 world championships in the garage at home HA HA . only wish I had better equipment and a bit of cash to do a full season . still I enjoyed it and still have a few scars to show for it . .an old rider who lived in Oxford helped to fix our engines Gordon Mc Gregor . also  he helped a Doncaster rider Hec Haslinger who lives in Perth and we chat often . tai woofy  has a track that his father help start in Perth and I have watched over the years a lot of local lads go to the uk and do ok .I am amazed at the level of racing now and the equipment is top stuff . again I think cheaper bikes would help a lot of racing be good to watch with the up and young lads .  

[Trees 2,814]

Bump

[A ORLOV 8,628]

The not increasing of the team limit each year so that if riders can be afforded the league gets stronger

[g13webb 4,254]

The biggest single factor of why the fans have stopped going has to be VFM.  It this world of tight restraints, fans find it much harder to find the extravagant admission costs that the promotions are needing to make ends meet.   The equivalent of over a pound a race is excessive. When the majority of those are drawn out processional  affairs,  it doesn't take an Einstein to realise something is drastically wrong.     Our Stadiums are old, our tracks are poor, and not suited to the super fast bikes of today.  We are stuck in a rut from years gone bye, thinking the sport use to work,  and believe it will again...  

Comparing Speedway to other sports like Moto GP,   Superbike Racing,   Formula 1  Saloon car racing,    we must be the only sport that uses the said same bike for every occasion.   You wouldn't see   a MotoGP bike during club meetings,   or a Red Bull F1 car during a endurance race,   so why do we still use those expensive tuned bikes for our bread and butter league meetings that the crowds cant sustain.     Promoters could cut the cost in an instant  by introducing a standard, less powerful option  ( eg. 400cc),  that would be more conducive to our tracks and create closer racing.   We could bring back the second halves and/or  produce a 20 heat schedule.  With cheaper bikes, the admission could be adjusted to an affordable level when hopefully the old fans would feel it was worth giving it another go.

But then again, we could carry on as usual,  losing more fans,  doing nothing.....    

[Daniel Smith 5,645]

7 minutes ago, g13webb said:

The biggest single factor of why the fans have stopped going has to be VFM.  It this world of tight restraints, fans find it much harder to find the extravagant admission costs that the promotions are needing to make ends meet.   The equivalent of over a pound a race is excessive. When the majority of those are drawn out processional  affairs,  it doesn't take an Einstein to realise something is drastically wrong.     Our Stadiums are old, our tracks are poor, and not suited to the super fast bikes of today.  We are stuck in a rut from years gone bye, thinking the sport use to work,  and believe it will again...  

Comparing Speedway to other sports like Moto GP,   Superbike Racing,   Formula 1  Saloon car racing,    we must be the only sport that uses the said same bike for every occasion.   You wouldn't see   a MotoGP bike during club meetings,   or a Red Bull F1 car during a endurance race,   so why do we still use those expensive tuned bikes for our bread and butter league meetings that the crowds cant sustain.     Promoters could cut the cost in an instant  by introducing a standard, less powerful option  ( eg. 400cc),  that would be more conducive to our tracks and create closer racing.   We could bring back the second halves and/or  produce a 20 heat schedule.  With cheaper bikes, the admission could be adjusted to an affordable level when hopefully the old fans would feel it was worth giving it another go.

But then again, we could carry on as usual,  losing more fans,  doing nothing.....    

I'd go the other way with regards to engines. There's only so much grip, traction and speed you can get out of a bike. I'd ramp up the cc to 800. In one fowl swoop the need for engine tuners has gone. No advantage can possibly be gained in a tuned engine with that big a cc. 

[Baldyman 6,243]

I don't think it matters what's done or not done, speedway will never be a big popular sport again the way its known now. 

For it to stand even half a chance, it needs totally changing and re inventing.   Even then it would find it hard to get the younger generation in, it isn't a phone in their hands or a console online, they can't drink it, smoke it or sniff it, or swipe left or right at it. 

[Bald Bloke 3,281]

49 minutes ago, Daniel Smith said:

I'd go the other way with regards to engines. There's only so much grip, traction and speed you can get out of a bike. I'd ramp up the cc to 800. In one fowl swoop the need for engine tuners has gone. No advantage can possibly be gained in a tuned engine with that big a cc. 

Riders will tune anything to get an advantage. All the work is done in the cylinder head and camshaft. The modern top riders speedway bike puts out around 75-78 bhp at the crank @ silly revs, 13500+ rpm ish, which is silly revs for a single cylinder 4 stroke. Hence they need work after 30 miles. 800cc is huge for a single, and would weigh more, but in mild/ standard state of tune that might last 80 races or so ( 80 miles) might put out around 65 bhp.. Which is plenty really, but riders will always have work done to increase power for big tracks, and to change where the engine puts out it's power. Sealed engine is the only way to stop this I think.

The thing is, when  you make an engine that can go a long time before work, it's an engine that goes off the boil ( for competition use) after a while due to a loss of compression. While on the road 3 of 4 bhp would be hard to notice for most. On a speedway track, it's huge.

 

Edited November 24, 2019 by Bald Bloke

[sommelier 1,118]

5 hours ago, Bald Bloke said:

Riders will tune anything to get an advantage. All the work is done in the cylinder head and camshaft. The modern top riders speedway bike puts out around 75-78 bhp at the crank @ silly revs, 13500+ rpm ish, which is silly revs for a single cylinder 4 stroke. Hence they need work after 30 miles. 800cc is huge for a single, and would weigh more, but in mild/ standard state of tune that might last 80 races or so ( 80 miles) might put out around 65 bhp.. Which is plenty really, but riders will always have work done to increase power for big tracks, and to change where the engine puts out it's power. Sealed engine is the only way to stop this I think.

The thing is, when  you make an engine that can go a long time before work, it's an engine that goes off the boil ( for competition use) after a while due to a loss of compression. While on the road 3 of 4 bhp would be hard to notice for most. On a speedway track, it's huge.

 

What amasses me, is that all the top tuners have not come up with semi rubber mounting engine to frame. The BHP that must be lost through vibrations must be at least 5 BHP. it would only take a steel outer sleeve, ie through crankcase then rubber then a center steel sleeve for the engine bolt to pas through engine plate

[g13webb 4,254]

11 hours ago, Daniel Smith said:

I'd go the other way with regards to engines. There's only so much grip, traction and speed you can get out of a bike. I'd ramp up the cc to 800. In one fowl swoop the need for engine tuners has gone. No advantage can possibly be gained in a tuned engine with that big a cc. 

My thoughts were aimed at cheaper bikes that were more sustainable.  We cant have this situation where the bikes being used are costing the earth.    

[walle 2]

I remember this topic being discussed by Eric boocock who wanted standard engines to save on cost .I think he was looking at Honda . but it is a complete package as the frames wheels e t c are all getting expensive . without decent gear it is hard to race and be in control . the new age of entertainment with internet and mobiles has killed a lot of other hobbies too .local clubs are a great form of fun for the die hards , as for league racing the best is being done with whats available . there  is more overseas racing now , so the old British racing dominance has gone to some extent . sponsors for the second half of a meeting would be better and let the riders chase the money on the track with handicap positions to mix it up . 

[waytogo28 2,054]

On 11/24/2019 at 7:57 PM, g13webb said:

The biggest single factor of why the fans have stopped going has to be VFM.  It this world of tight restraints, fans find it much harder to find the extravagant admission costs that the promotions are needing to make ends meet.   The equivalent of over a pound a race is excessive. When the majority of those are drawn out processional  affairs,  it doesn't take an Einstein to realise something is drastically wrong.     Our Stadiums are old, our tracks are poor, and not suited to the super fast bikes of today.  We are stuck in a rut from years gone bye, thinking the sport use to work,  and believe it will again...  

VFM has been the cause of my dwindling ( but not yet extinguished ) enthusiasm for the sport that has been THE sport of my life. And the increase in the number of drawn out processional races does matter to me. Simpler . cheaper . longer lasting bikes that allow for competitive racing must be part of the way forward ( if there is to be a way forward in the UK ). The riders own skills on track will come to the fore once again.