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iris123

Norden Stadium

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12 minutes ago, RobMcCaffery said:

Only one of us commentated on it ;-)

The point about Muller's engine is probably very close to the mark.

Either way, maybe it was the surroundings but the whole event just didn't feel 'right'. 

 

I've got a DVD of the meeting with you as commentator Rob!

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Forget exactly how many matches Egon rode for Hull 1976 but know he averaged 8.75 so none too shabby, he was a more than decent speedway rider but think he was strongly 'encouraged' to ride speedway in order for his permission to ride to ride longtrack be processed quicker & more hassle free,  long / sand / grass track being his first love.   I have the official VHS video of 1983 Final with Barry Briggs translating Egon's German commentary, recall the start marshall, who got skittled by an Engine Failed rider (Hans Nielsen) - how often did that happen in a World Final, was at school with Egon.  As well as 'road developing' his bike, he took just the one machine - how's that for confidence, Egon later admitted to practising all he wanted on the Norden track prior to the final.  He also appeared to 'advise' on track watering / grading during the actual meeting.  It's true Hull ran R/R for Egon in 1977, Ian Thomas said Hull fans would be required to pay adult entrance (75p ?) + £2.50 each to meet Egon's demands, so maybe today's entrance + £30 ?  Also, anyone who saw Egon ride will recall Egon's super-wide, 'cow horn'-style handlbars. He wasn't a cheap rider but when the mood struck he was dynamite, had speedway been his main thing reckon he would have been unstoppable....

Edited by martinmauger
spelling, more realistic rating
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4 hours ago, cityrebel said:

Me too, it shows what a load of old fogies we are. I really enjoyed the 1987 two day final. You can't beat a long weekend in Amsterdam!

Yeah, I was in Norden and Amsterdam too! For Norden, we were based in Groningen before heading back to Amsterdam for the "Revenge" World Final.

In '87, we drove over for a five-day trip, and stayed with friends in Apeldoorn. I loved the country so much, I moved there in 1990 for about 18 months!

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3 hours ago, martinmauger said:

Forget exactly how many matches Egon rode for Hull 1976 but know he averaged 8.75 so none too shabby, he was a more than decent speedway rider but think he was strongly 'encouraged' to ride speedway in order for his permission to ride to ride longtrack be processed quicker & more hassle free,  long / sand / grass track being his first love.   I have the official VHS video of 1983 Final with Barry Briggs translating Egon's German commentary, recall the start marshall, who got skittled by an Engine Failed rider (Hans Nielsen) - how often did that happen in a World Final, was at school with Egon.  As well as 'road developing' his bike, he took just the one machine - how's that for confidence, Egon later admitted to practising all he wanted on the Norden track prior to the final.  He also appeared to 'advise' on track watering / grading during the actual meeting.  It's true Hull ran R/R for Egon in 1977, Ian Thomas said Hull fans would be required to pay adult entrance (75p ?) + £2.50 each to meet Egon's demands, so maybe today's entrance + £30 ?  Also, anyone who saw Egon ride will recall Egon's super-wide, 'cow horn'-style handlbars. He wasn't a cheap rider but when the mood struck he was dynamite, had speedway been his main thing reckon he would have been unstoppable....

As you say, Speedway was well down his priority list but he would definitely have been around the top 10 riders in the World so becoming World Champ in a 'one off' final shouldn't have been a massive surprise..

Probably the fact he didn't ride over here that much meant his name and capability didn't resonate with too many over here..

Which at the time was the 'only place to be' in the eyes of so many..

I saw him ride in a World Best Pairs at Hyde Rd, (where him and Hans Wasserman finished 3rd) and got a pair of 'cow horns' for my Raleigh not long after..B)

 

Edited by mikebv
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17 hours ago, oleoleole said:

Peter Adams told us the tale when he was a guest at an NSSC meeting.

Peter was driving Bruce and the World Championship trophy to Germany. When they arrived at the ferry Bruce realised he hadn’t got his passport. With no time to return to the Midlands to collect it, and the need to get the trophy to the final, they decided to hide Bruce in the boot and managed to get him through all the checks to Germany.

As you can imagine that is a very short version of Peter’s long and very funny story.

 

And Bruce's response to Dave, in typical American style, was, 'Yeah, I felt like a rookie traveller!'. The sport really misses those boys! 

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I was also at both Norden and Amsterdam.

It's all very well harping on about track time etc, I refer you all to the 1983 Overseas Final at Belle Vue - 3 Aces riders in it, and the one with the least experience of Hyde Road (Larry Ross) was the only one to qualify easily for the Inter Continental Final, Chris Morton did but had a struggle IIRC and Peter Collins was nowhere near.   Nobody is telling me that Egon had more experience of Norden than  PC did Hyde Road. 

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19 hours ago, Ray Stadia said:

The engine was virtually the first GM and definitely put GM on the map, so a lot of 'getting it right' would have gone on! 

 

18 hours ago, Tigerblade said:

When they both would have raced against him numerous times before.... 

It is a classic case of because he didn't take UK speedway seriously (probably to be far,  speedway in general), the UK didn't take him seriously.  People talk about Egon, and Jerzy Szczakiel being not "world class", but in my opinion, Les Collins, with every respect to the bloke, would have been a bigger "shock" World Champion had he done it in 1982. He was certainly an excellent rider at his peak, but not one of the very top averaging riders of that era. 

Didn't Les Collins ride a GM to 2nd Place in 1982 LA?

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1 hour ago, iainb said:

 

Didn't Les Collins ride a GM to 2nd Place in 1982 LA?

Maybe? I thought Les was a Jawa man, but probably wrong. :unsure:

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5 hours ago, Tigerblade said:

I was also at both Norden and Amsterdam.

It's all very well harping on about track time etc, I refer you all to the 1983 Overseas Final at Belle Vue - 3 Aces riders in it, and the one with the least experience of Hyde Road (Larry Ross) was the only one to qualify easily for the Inter Continental Final, Chris Morton did but had a struggle IIRC and Peter Collins was nowhere near.   Nobody is telling me that Egon had more experience of Norden than  PC did Hyde Road. 

Hmmm. I think you are comparing apples and pears there....

You are omitting to mention that the Hyde Road Track for the 83 Overseas was an absolute quagmire. Had it not been a World Championship meeting, I doubt very much that it would have gone ahead. It doesn't have the same infamy as the 1984 British Final - it wasn't covered on ITV - but the track was very dodgy to say the least.

That's why Mort struggled and so too did other track specialists PC and Shawn Moran. Billy Sanders went out in his last race to win the event, but ended up coming off on his own with his ass in the sludge by the fence. And as much as I liked Phil Collins, he would not have beaten such a classy field in normal circumstances. He was a freak winner in freak conditions.

ps. I was there too...Norden, Amsterdam, Belle Vue

Edited by falcace

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15 hours ago, steve roberts said:

I've got a DVD of the meeting with you as commentator Rob!

Thank goodness for the mute button, eh? My goodness, I haven't even got a copy!

That was a rather, ahem, 'unofficial' job, shot from the terraces. After the event the KM Video proprietor had the cheek to get us into the hospitality tent and chat to Barry Briggs while a very camera-shaped object was hidden in a holdall under a jacket.......

I went 'straight' later, honest!

 

 

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11 hours ago, chunky said:

Yeah, I was in Norden and Amsterdam too! For Norden, we were based in Groningen before heading back to Amsterdam for the "Revenge" World Final.

In '87, we drove over for a five-day trip, and stayed with friends in Apeldoorn. I loved the country so much, I moved there in 1990 for about 18 months!

Ah, Groningen! A superb base for ice racing trips to Assen. I was lucky enough to cover Dutch ice hockey at the time and made many trips to Groningen. Oh those bars and a marinaded pork chop from an 'Automatiek' in the back streets at 2 am. 

Some Ice Racing qualifying events were held there for a while. 

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1 hour ago, RobMcCaffery said:

Ah, Groningen! A superb base for ice racing trips to Assen. I was lucky enough to cover Dutch ice hockey at the time and made many trips to Groningen. Oh those bars and a marinaded pork chop from an 'Automatiek' in the back streets at 2 am. 

Some Ice Racing qualifying events were held there for a while. 

2AM... Lightweight.....  Went to many ice meetings in Assen, and always stayed in Groningen. Had some really good nights out (actually make that great) there with some good company, frequently not getting back to the hotel until it was daylight. Mr Fisher with us on a couple of occasions as well as several riders. Overriding memory was Mark Loram being held on the shoulders of Dutch Lads when they realised who he was, and having to dodge the ceiling fan !!! Mark enjoyed the racing on the Saturday night, but didn't see too much of the Sunday as I recall....

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3 hours ago, Ray Stadia said:

Maybe? I thought Les was a Jawa man, but probably wrong. :unsure:

Les defo rode a JAWA to 2nd in 1982, read somewhere that the 4-valve JAWAs were tricky to set up, 'specially ignition timing and valve clearences, but once sorted they pretty much 'flew'.  Les came so close to winning, he'd already beat victor Penhall, but ran a 3rd in one heat, but 2nd was still a great result....

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Talking on his FB, site it seems Egon doesn't have fond memories of his time at Hull. The travelling was a nightmare, so it seems. But he was laughing about getting injured and Brian Larner sent him to a somewhat dodgy Massage Parlour........:D

Edited by iris123

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1 hour ago, rusky said:

2AM... Lightweight.....  Went to many ice meetings in Assen, and always stayed in Groningen. Had some really good nights out (actually make that great) there with some good company, frequently not getting back to the hotel until it was daylight. Mr Fisher with us on a couple of occasions as well as several riders. Overriding memory was Mark Loram being held on the shoulders of Dutch Lads when they realised who he was, and having to dodge the ceiling fan !!! Mark enjoyed the racing on the Saturday night, but didn't see too much of the Sunday as I recall....

Guilty as charged, but in my defence it was only a pit stop between bars. "ok, it's 2 am, we're closing but there's a great bar down the road open until 6"

I did have to pick up a mic the following day.....

 

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