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Covid-19 Are we being told the truth ?

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4 hours ago, DC2 said:

 

7/10 comes from the post I was answering.

7/10 applies to over 65s and children at school, and possibly (although I do not know the exact percentage) everyone with an illness that affects their immune system (such as diabetes).  In addition about 20% of carers and medical staff take the vaccine, making in total about 40% of the population?

It does make you wonder, with no deaths of children under 13 in the UK:

is the flu vaccine protecting against coronavirus?

Let’s hope the government can get around to testing children and checking the vaccination record of people who have contracted or died.

 I checked the NHS website which suggests that the 70% applies only to pensioners.

However your comment in bold print raises an interesting point. Firstly I wonder how they calculate figures for flu. Do they have an autopsy on every person that dies ? I don't know but I doubt it. A lot of people say they have flu when they have a heavy cold. How is the doctor to know what to put ion the death certificate if he has not previously treated the patient ? Years ago I had a viral illness that lead to several years of ME. On doctor said he thought it was flu , but from what I have learned since I think it was very likely glandular fever, although the medical certificates simply said post viral syndrome. So personally I treat a lot those statistics with a pinch of salt. 

Another illustration. In January before we had heard of COVID 19  my daughter came back from ski-ing in Italy , feeling a bit off colour to nights later she was showing the symptoms that we now associate with COVID 19  -ie feeling very ill,, a violent cough and could hardly breath. She was so bad  dialled 111 at 3am and they made an appointment straight away to go to hospital were a chest infection was diagnosed and anti biotics were prescribed and she recovered slowly over the next two weeks. A day after I took he to hospital I started to feel ill, with a violent cough and a complete lack of energy which knocked me out for about two weeks.  Now, without being melodramatic did we both have a Covid 19 or a variant of it ? I am not a doctor and I don't know.

The point I am making is that I don't think any particular reliance can be placed on the statistics. I understand the point you are making and why you are making it, but personally I thing there is more to this than meets the eye but in the light of experience I think we have to be very cautious in our opinions at this stage.

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36 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

Brexiteers quickly coming out of the woodwork to express their isolationist ideology shocker... :D

Why is it necessary to speak or people you disagree with as coming out of the woodwork ?  Do you not think some might  regard you as coming out of the woodwork ? 

Hardly necessary on this thread is it ?

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24 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

 I checked the NHS website which suggests that the 70% applies only to pensioners.

However your comment in bold print raises an interesting point. Firstly I wonder how they calculate figures for flu. Do they have an autopsy on every person that dies ? I don't know but I doubt it. A lot of people say they have flu when they have a heavy cold. How is the doctor to know what to put ion the death certificate if he has not previously treated the patient ? Years ago I had a viral illness that lead to several years of ME. On doctor said he thought it was flu , but from what I have learned since I think it was very likely glandular fever, although the medical certificates simply said post viral syndrome. So personally I treat a lot those statistics with a pinch of salt. 

Another illustration. In January before we had heard of COVID 19  my daughter came back from ski-ing in Italy , feeling a bit off colour to nights later she was showing the symptoms that we now associate with COVID 19  -ie feeling very ill,, a violent cough and could hardly breath. She was so bad  dialled 111 at 3am and they made an appointment straight away to go to hospital were a chest infection was diagnosed and anti biotics were prescribed and she recovered slowly over the next two weeks. A day after I took he to hospital I started to feel ill, with a violent cough and a complete lack of energy which knocked me out for about two weeks.  Now, without being melodramatic did we both have a Covid 19 or a variant of it ? I am not a doctor and I don't know.

The point I am making is that I don't think any particular reliance can be placed on the statistics. I understand the point you are making and why you are making it, but personally I thing there is more to this than meets the eye but in the light of experience I think we have to be very cautious in our opinions at this stage.


Here’s a link to the children’s vaccination programme. I recall that 70% are vaccinated:

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/vaccinations/child-flu-vaccine/

60% of primary school children were vaccinated in 2018-19:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/806289/Childhood_flu_annual_report_2018_19_FINAL_.pdf

 

 

Edited by DC2
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The QEH in Kings Lynn reported today that they now have 71 cases, with 12 deaths, 15 have recovered, and one patient is taking part in trials of potential treatments for the infection. 

 

https://www.lynnnews.co.uk/news/qeh-patient-joins-coronavirus-treatment-trial-9105377/

Edited by Bald Bloke

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UK deaths up 684. Up from 569 yesterday.

On our way to the 800s.

Only 22% of tests are positive. Weird.

173,784 tests done, only about 10,000 at most are NHS workers, the rest are people going to hospital with severe Covid symptoms which turn out in 78% of cases not to be Covid. Are the tests flawed?

 

 

Edited by DC2

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23 minutes ago, DC2 said:


Here’s a link to the children’s vaccination programme. I recall that 70% are vaccinated:

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/vaccinations/child-flu-vaccine/

60% of primary school children were vaccinated in 2018-19:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/806289/Childhood_flu_annual_report_2018_19_FINAL_.pdf

 

 

Thanks. On the back of that I checked to see if I could find out how many unvaccinated children die of flu compare to those vaccinated. I cant find any figures and the chances are there are none. However the PHE statisics keep referring to  keep referring to people going to their GP with " flu like illnesses which kind of brings us back to my point  "when is the flu not the flu " if you see what I mean.

I am not sure what this adds to the discussion other than it seems that the statistics seem to refer to the flu as a sort of generic term rather than a specific diagnosis and the statistics have to be looked at in that light, although  of course that doesn't totally invalidate them. 

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1 hour ago, Blupanther said:

 

The tweeter and Hitchens both have it wrong. The figures haven't moved from one column to another at all.. just the formatting gone awry.

The Covid deaths are there as 5 and 103.

That said, an interesting chart to keep an eye on as weeks develop.

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Japan's numbers suddenly increase after the postponement of the Olympics.. there's a surprise :neutral:

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4 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

Thanks. On the back of that I checked to see if I could find out how many unvaccinated children die of flu compare to those vaccinated. I cant find any figures and the chances are there are none. However the PHE statisics keep referring to  keep referring to people going to their GP with " flu like illnesses which kind of brings us back to my point  "when is the flu not the flu " if you see what I mean.

I am not sure what this adds to the discussion other than it seems that the statistics seem to refer to the flu as a sort of generic term rather than a specific diagnosis and the statistics have to be looked at in that light, although  of course that doesn't totally invalidate them. 


Looking at the Covid tests, the flu is about 78% of those!

What’s been happening to that 78% that are struggling to breathe? Are they sent home? How many have died?

 

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Just now, DC2 said:


Looking at the Covid tests, the flu is about 78% of those!

What’s been happening to that 78% that are struggling to breathe? Are they sent home? How many have died?

 

Well, we don't know if it's the flu... it is something that is showing 'serious symptoms' however and presumably clogging up hospital resources.

It's astounding the question STILL hasn't been asked.

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12 minutes ago, DC2 said:


UK deaths up 684. Up from 569 yesterday.

On our way to the 800s.

Only 22% of tests are positive. Weird.

173,784 tests done, only about 10,000 at most are NHS workers, the rest are people going to hospital with severe Covid symptoms which turn out in 78% of cases not to be Covid. Are the tests flawed?

 

 

Maybe similar thing happening as what I said was happening on Hamburg. That people are just imagining they have the symptoms and ringing the hotline for a test 

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One other point, the oft quoted average deaths from flu is around 17,000... but we should also remember pneumonia which often develops from flu, average deaths are around 30,000 a year.

As I said earlier, the number of lives lost due to respiratory diseases was low this winter which meant a lot of people who might normally have been victims survived and are now being taken by Covid.

Had we had a worse flu season, Covid wouldn't be killing so many.

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Just now, iris123 said:

Maybe similar thing happening as what I said was happening on Hamburg. That people are just imagining they have the symptoms and ringing the hotline for a test 

UK have only been testing those with serious symptoms. Most who called were simply told to stay home.

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48 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

Hardly necessary on this thread is it ?

I didn't raise it first. I was responding to others trying to make political capital out of the virus thing. 

No more necessary than you sticking your oar in to comment...

Edited by Humphrey Appleby

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