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old bob at herne bay

Will British Speedway Survive ?

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1 hour ago, iris123 said:

You didn’t prove it, because you don’t know who has decided to retire or who wants to ride in a national league. You just counted every Tom, dick and harry who competed locally or ride a meeting last season

You didn’t specify that. What’s happened here is that you challenged me in a condescending manner, I proved you wrong, which you can’t accept so you’ve now moved the goal posts. 

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1 hour ago, Ben91 said:

You didn’t specify that. What’s happened here is that you challenged me in a condescending manner, I proved you wrong, which you can’t accept so you’ve now moved the goal posts. 

No I asked you a perfectly reasonable question I. e how many riders are there. You dodged and told me to work it out myself as it was so easy. You then took half a day yourself to come up with some fantasy number, not knowing if they are still riding nor willing to do anything other than local second halves etc

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3 hours ago, iris123 said:

No I asked you a perfectly reasonable question I. e how many riders are there. You dodged and told me to work it out myself as it was so easy. You then took half a day yourself to come up with some fantasy number, not knowing if they are still riding nor willing to do anything other than local second halves etc

No. I read your response this morning and did about half an hour of research that you could have done yourself, because unlike some my life doesn’t seem to revolve around Internet forums. Naturally you wanted me to end up being wrong and with egg on my face and you’d have achieved looking like a real big person online. You would have been ignored if I’m honest because of the tone you took but Greyhoundp took an interest in the subject too and made a comment so I took the time to back up my point. That “fantasy” number that I came up with is hard fact. They are British speedway riders. That was the question that was asked, and then answered. End of. I’m done with discussing it with you. 

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13 minutes ago, Ben91 said:

No. I read your response this morning and did about half an hour of research that you could have done yourself, because unlike some my life doesn’t seem to revolve around Internet forums. Naturally you wanted me to end up being wrong and with egg on my face and you’d have achieved looking like a real big person online. You would have been ignored if I’m honest because of the tone you took but Greyhoundp took an interest in the subject too and made a comment so I took the time to back up my point. That “fantasy” number that I came up with is hard fact. They are British speedway riders. That was the question that was asked, and then answered. End of. I’m done with discussing it with you. 

No. Again, to repeat myself. I asked you a perfectly reasonable question. How many riders are there? To starting post saying there are enough. You then made a strange response by telling me to look myself..........if you state something, it is perfectly reasonable to think you know the answer and if you look back, as I don't think it necessary to quote my post (it is there for all to see) it is absolutely justified to ask you that question...... You decide to not answer, but give a narky response.

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22 hours ago, greyhoundp said:

Well there are 19 senior Teams which means 133 British riders would be needed, I for one dont think there are enough British riders to go round, just to make up a team of seven British riders would most likely mean having some riders trail round a half lap or more that would not bring in spectators. I realise the sport would need to make decisions just to get teams on track, but very much doubt that would be a way forward.

Yet it was fine in the late 80's, early 90's when crowds were far bigger..

You should know that more than anyone with some of the reserves Cradley trotted out in that period!

I've got plenty of tapes with Sam Ermolenko, Ronnie Correy, Jan O Pedersen and the like in the same race as folks like David Haynes.. who literally were nearly half a lap behind.

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22 hours ago, iris123 said:

Just out of interest how many British riders are there currently ?

No....here it is. Perfectly reasonable by any standards

Not knowing you, I made the mistake of thinking a straight question would receive a straight answer.......know better next time

Edited by iris123

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1 hour ago, BWitcher said:

Yet it was fine in the late 80's, early 90's when crowds were far bigger..

You should know that more than anyone with some of the reserves Cradley trotted out in that period!

I've got plenty of tapes with Sam Ermolenko, Ronnie Correy, Jan O Pedersen and the like in the same race as folks like David Haynes.. who literally were nearly half a lap behind.

You sure ? you know that stuff like that never happened in the old days 

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Oh Ah! I remember when you could throw a postage stamp over the four riders just afore they crossed the finish line. Thass why there aren't hardly anybody going to watch nowadays - a course I mean last season as we aint going to have this season.

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One of the biggest effects on league s/way IMO  is the GP's they robbed us of weekend team racing in both leagues really  ( better for kids to go) the best riders either not in the league or treating it as a top up for income or testing and to   sustain fitness levels .

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The message coming out yesterday seemed to be normal life won't return for about 6 months and self isolation will be here for a few months.....so I can't see them opening up sports stadia to the public any time soon

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31 minutes ago, FAST GATER said:

One of the biggest effects on league s/way IMO  is the GP's they robbed us of weekend team racing in both leagues really  ( better for kids to go) the best riders either not in the league or treating it as a top up for income or testing and to   sustain fitness levels .

You can possibly make the argument that the GPs have stolen the Friday/Saturday night slots from British clubs. However, I think Britain's inability to pick a lane and instead choosing to run throughout the week was a large factor in that.

You cannot argue that the GPs have robbed Britain of the top riders though. All the top riders still ride league speedway in Poland, Sweden and increasingly Denmark. Therefore the blame lies solely at the feet of British speedway, their inability to be flexible (running of a Friday before a GP for example), declining crowds/poor sponsorship meaning earnings are comparatively low and going even further back to the 80s and 90s their decision to not invest in the future.

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12 hours ago, BWitcher said:

Yet it was fine in the late 80's, early 90's when crowds were far bigger..

You should know that more than anyone with some of the reserves Cradley trotted out in that period!

I've got plenty of tapes with Sam Ermolenko, Ronnie Correy, Jan O Pedersen and the like in the same race as folks like David Haynes.. who literally were nearly half a lap behind.

Yeah and Jan O would pick them off one at a time :D;) knowing his fellow team mate was making up the numbers. We also had some dam good ones such as Bob Valentine, Ila Teromaa, Kristian Praestbro, Dave Shields and one that didnt work out was Arne Pander. There were as you say others that quickly faded from memory.

There was a time during the 60,s when some of our so called  heat leaders were half a lap behind :D.

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2 hours ago, MattK said:

You can possibly make the argument that the GPs have stolen the Friday/Saturday night slots from British clubs. However, I think Britain's inability to pick a lane and instead choosing to run throughout the week was a large factor in that.

You cannot argue that the GPs have robbed Britain of the top riders though. All the top riders still ride league speedway in Poland, Sweden and increasingly Denmark. Therefore the blame lies solely at the feet of British speedway, their inability to be flexible (running of a Friday before a GP for example), declining crowds/poor sponsorship meaning earnings are comparatively low and going even further back to the 80s and 90s their decision to not invest in the future.

We got out in the early 80's my father saw the sport changing and social demands becoming more  sophisticated my younger brother (  by 4yrs ) lost interest very quickly because there were other distractions and he didn't remotely want to have a go at riding  .You are right about the sport not investing in it's future  but if I am honest my own opinion has changed over the years and I would say s/way is very much like" Marmite" as they say  . My daughter and I have stood in mud and watched  matches and come away moaning about a doggy pass not wet feet ,I know there are many like us on here still but we are a diminishing breed .

Imo one of  the main problems is that the demands of the sport mean it fails to meet the modern outlook ,it is deemed noisy ,anti social and it's fan base is so small that the powers that be feel little if any pressure to assist it's continued existance !

One thing you say is true  though pay enough money and they will come Top Riders that is, as I  always say team sport ridden by individuals but will the fans come ? 

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30 minutes ago, FAST GATER said:

We got out in the early 80's my father saw the sport changing and social demands becoming more  sophisticated my younger brother (  by 4yrs ) lost interest very quickly because there were other distractions and he didn't remotely want to have a go at riding  .You are right about the sport not investing in it's future  but if I am honest my own opinion has changed over the years and I would say s/way is very much like" Marmite" as they say  . My daughter and I have stood in mud and watched  matches and come away moaning about a doggy pass not wet feet ,I know there are many like us on here still but we are a diminishing breed .

Imo one of  the main problems is that the demands of the sport mean it fails to meet the modern outlook ,it is deemed noisy ,anti social and it's fan base is so small that the powers that be feel little if any pressure to assist it's continued existance !

One thing you say is true  though pay enough money and they will come Top Riders that is, as I  always say team sport ridden by individuals but will the fans come ? 

Being noisy, dirt and anti-social are not necessarily bad things. Look at the massive popularity of mixed martial arts. The top fighters earn millions, as do the owners of UFC. It depends how they are promoted. I remember Lakeside promoting speedway as an extreme sport, which I always thought was a great angle for precisely the reasons you describe.

However, other clubs promote it as family friendly, which I never really understood.

Again, a fundamental problem with speedway is that they don't know who their target market is, so take a scatter gun approach to trying to get new fans.

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7 minutes ago, MattK said:

Being noisy, dirt and anti-social are not necessarily bad things. Look at the massive popularity of mixed martial arts. The top fighters earn millions, as do the owners of UFC. It depends how they are promoted. I remember Lakeside promoting speedway as an extreme sport, which I always thought was a great angle for precisely the reasons you describe.

However, other clubs promote it as family friendly, which I never really understood.

Again, a fundamental problem with speedway is that they don't know who their target market is, so take a scatter gun approach to trying to get new fans.

 

Good points, but even MMA is promoted as family friendly at grass roots level.

I’m surprised no one has manufactured “speedway bikes” for kids, normal bikes that resemble speedway bikes and developed little leagues for bike riding.

 

Edited by DC2

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