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Theboss

British Speedway to be reborn?

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17 hours ago, Hacksaw Jim Duggan said:

In the nicest way possible, most of the suggestions on here are a bit, crap - it is nothing out the box, and nothing that hasn't been mentioned and done to death 100 times. 

A new fan will most likely neither notice or care about such things as score boards or the overly done to death obsession with music played at a meeting. A subject that has been tirelessly spoken about on this forum for one which is so meaningless when it comes to reasons why people don't attend. 

As well as not being of interest to most new fans, the things mentioned have done little to retain fans who have left the sport, fans have dwindled out the door as the product has watered down because fans of a sport know what good looks like. 

If people want to stand and listen to music, they go to a thing called a concert, a pub or bar - very few people attend a meeting in the hope they will hear a fantastic song, very few reflect back on their speedway memories and reflect on the music played or the scoreboard - these things aren't the USP, they are a backdrop at best. 

The USP IS the sport, when people wish to attend they want to see fast racing and the best riders - this has shown over the years when the sport had better riders - more people were attending.... it now doesn't have the best riders, less people are attending. 

There is too much speedway in this country, the season is too long, the sport drags on months past it has to, there are too many finals, semi finals and championships  - they all just lose meaning and become lost in each other, in a desperate attempt to boost revenue by hosting more, the sport has just made everything less than, ends up with Finals and Semi Finals overlapping to the point they start to confuse each other. 

Speedway should be a league season, less meetings and attempt to boost the quality again. Once people know they are watching good again, they might consider the sport again.

A Poole fan who was spoiled on Rickardson, Loram, Holder etc isn't coming back for a score board and Calvin Harris music when he is having to watch a team the standard of that they have the last few years.

A new fan likely won't stick around long when they know they aren't watching the best on offer, there has always been a naivety around the idea a new fan would fall for the BS of just watching a good race, for a while at best they might, but more people want to see the best at their sport rather than those less than, most sports attendances reflect that - quality typically equates to a higher attendance. 

If you are asking people for the cost speedway tracks do you need to have some pretty decent USP's - scoreboards, music etc ain't that, people can find that at most other sports in the country which offer far superior stadia and facilities to that which most speedway tracks ever will, when they first walk into most their first impression at most tracks will likely be what a dump it is compared to stadiums and sports they have been at . It is actually probably more beneficial to draw peoples eyes away from most of the dumps they have to stand in. 

Less meeting's really?? that is one of the biggest problems speedway in the uk has at the moment  people get used to not going and find other things to do.At the moment  most teams are very  lucky to get three meetings a month yet you suggest we should have less.Your idea of having less meetings and bringing the best riders back to get the crowds in is a great one but in reality a pipe dream.I am all for your idea so can you explain how the clubs would PAY for it would the increased GATE money do that.?

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So according to yesterday's national newspapers, when Poland start their 2020 league campaign they will only use riders who are willing to committ solely to their league AND LIVE IN THEIR COUNTRY. 

The PNZ obviously see the problems ahead with air travel and want to protect their league, so don't be surprised to see this also be implemented in 2021 and beyond.

Surely this news will make British speedway promoters realise that the current set up with three leagues will no longer be possible and they need to use the time they have now to start again with a clean sheet of paper?

I believe valid fans ideas which should be considered by the promoters are:

- £10 entry

- Regular meetings over a shorter season

- Semi pro riders

- Better sound systems and interviews (score    boards are a good idea but too expensive)

I would add that to reduce costs for everyone involved a fixed appearance fee rather than points money in year 1 which should be deter riders from spending money on fancy carbs and engine rebuilds.

Then in year 2 move to standard engines and introduce money per point.

If rider supply is an issue then it would be a good idea to set up north and south league and allow riders to ride for a team in each division.

Edited by jchapman

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7 minutes ago, jchapman said:

So according to yesterday's national newspapers, when Poland start their 2020 league campaign they will only use riders who are willing to committ solely to their league AND LIVE IN THEIR COUNTRY. 

The PNZ obviously see the problems ahead with air travel and want to protect their league, so don't be surprised to see this also be implemented in 2021 and beyond.

Surely this news will make British speedway promoters realise that the current set up with three leagues will no longer be possible and they need to use the time they have now to start again with a clean sheet of paper?

I believe valid fans ideas which should be considered by the promoters are:

- £10 entry

- Regular meetings over a shorter season

- Semi pro riders

- Better sound systems and interviews (score    boards are a good idea but too expensive)

I would add that to reduce costs for everyone involved a fixed appearance fee rather than points money in year 1 which should be deter riders from spending money on fancy carbs and engine rebuilds.

Then in year 2 move to standard engines and introduce money per point.

If rider supply is an issue then it would be a good idea to set up north and south league and allow riders to ride for a team in each division.

 

Spot on and perfect.

Oh, apart from the last sentence!

And you could have a large, old fashioned cricket style scoreboard to please Grachan (which is a fair point).

Edited by DC2

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2 minutes ago, DC2 said:

 

Spot on and perfect.

Oh, apart from the last sentence!

And you could have a large, old fashioned cricket style scoreboard to please Grachan (which is a fair point).

Sounds good to me. Although I suspect that if you have £10 entry most teams will go bust by the end of the year. But who cares? I got my scoreboard.

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11 hours ago, stevebrum said:

IF Speedway came back I’m sure it would be top flight with an overwhelming majority. I’m sure fans attending regular would have been happy with a level above if still running. 

I can't see Cradley ever coming back.

The fan base has dwindled due to age and apathy.

If the outstanding Tony Mole could not find a track location for them between 2000 and 2010 and make it work, then I have to ask "who can"??

The Money raised to support the Cradley Planning and set up was then squandered and used by Patchett and Pearson who have piggy backed on to the Cradley name for a long time, creamed money off it and done very little to actually support it. Now they have "run for the hills" as the money pit has run dry.

Its 25 years since Dudley Wood closed and I fear Cradley will never return.

Birmingham and Wolverhampton are barely viable, so where is there room for another Club in the midst of that as I see very few Cradley fans (30-40 in 2019) at either track and Cradleys gates last year were probably below 500.

The horse sadly has bolted. 

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11 hours ago, Hacksaw Jim Duggan said:

The 2007 version would thump the Swindon team of last year.

 

Lots of fans say the league has been weakened every year so you’d imagine our 2019 team to be like an NL side compared to the 2007 one, but it isn’t anything like that weak.

Ellis, Musielak and Jensen were better than Chrzanowski, Gjedde and Ulamek.

The only “weakening” has been the loss of a handful of GP standard number 1s and some reserves promoted prematurely from the lower leagues.

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14 minutes ago, jchapman said:

So according to yesterday's national newspapers, when Poland start their 2020 league campaign they will only use riders who are willing to committ solely to their league AND LIVE IN THEIR COUNTRY. 

The PNZ obviously see the problems ahead with air travel and want to protect their league, so don't be surprised to see this also be implemented in 2021 and beyond.

Surely this news will make British speedway promoters realise that the current set up with three leagues will no longer be possible and they need to use the time they have now to start again with a clean sheet of paper?

I believe valid fans ideas which should be considered by the promoters are:

- £10 entry

- Regular meetings over a shorter season

- Semi pro riders

- Better sound systems and interviews (score    boards are a good idea but too expensive)

I would add that to reduce costs for everyone involved a fixed appearance fee rather than points money in year 1 which should be deter riders from spending money on fancy carbs and engine rebuilds.

Then in year 2 move to standard engines and introduce money per point.

If rider supply is an issue then it would be a good idea to set up north and south league and allow riders to ride for a team in each division.

I dont think the Poles will see living in Poland as a pre-requisite beyond 2020.

What we may see is an insistence that they have to be there on a Friday and remain til a Monday.

That helps Sweden more than UK. 

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10 minutes ago, jchapman said:

So according to yesterday's national newspapers, when Poland start their 2020 league campaign they will only use riders who are willing to committ solely to their league AND LIVE IN THEIR COUNTRY. 

The PNZ obviously see the problems ahead with air travel and want to protect their league, so don't be surprised to see this also be implemented in 2021 and beyond.

Surely this news will make British speedway promoters realise that the current set up with three leagues will no longer be possible and they need to use the time they have now to start again with a clean sheet of paper?

I believe valid fans ideas which should be considered by the promoters are:

- £10 entry

- Regular meetings over a shorter season

- Semi pro riders

- Better sound systems and interviews (score    boards are a good idea but too expensive)

I would add that to reduce costs for everyone involved a fixed appearance fee rather than points money in year 1 which should be deter riders from spending money on fancy carbs and engine rebuilds.

Then in year 2 move to standard engines and introduce money per point.

If rider supply is an issue then it would be a good idea to set up north and south league and allow riders to ride for a team in each division.

All good points, but with regards Semi Pro riders its they themseves that decide if they want to be semi pro, its the promoters/sponsors that pay professional rider rates of pay, which the sport itself cant afford. The promoters need to pay a realistic figure that the Sport as a whole can afford and as for Sponsorship the promoters should not be allowed to spend sponsorship money on individual riders but use any sponsorship monies to cover meeting costs, the riders themselves should be responsible  for obtaining their own sponsorship, but semi pro has to be the way to go as the sport can no longer sustain full time riders in the UK, indeed why should supporters and promoters continue to have to subsidise these riders.

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15 minutes ago, DC2 said:

 

Spot on and perfect.

Oh, apart from the last sentence!

And you could have a large, old fashioned cricket style scoreboard to please Grachan (which is a fair point).

I can understand why that may not be ideal but I am struggling with ideas on how to share around the limited number of riders that will be available?

 

 

Edited by jchapman

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1 minute ago, jchapman said:

I can understand that may not be ideal but I am struggling with ideas on how to share around the limited number of riders that will be available?

 

How many UK riders do we have in all leagues from last year? 

I’d be quite happy with a top league similar to the CL and a junior league like the NL, with under 23s doubling down into the junior league.

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1 minute ago, DC2 said:

 

How many UK riders do we have in all leagues from last year? 

I’d be quite happy with a top league similar to the CL and a junior league like the NL, with under 23s doubling down into the junior league.

I plan on working that number out later today

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2 minutes ago, jchapman said:

I plan on working that number out later today

 

If you take out the junior teams of Edinburgh and Belle Vue there are currently 24 clubs.

Maybe 16 for the top league and 8 for the junior league?

So we’d need 16 x 7 for the top league, 112.

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The UK still has one advantage over other countries - that is the number of opportunities to race that it offers. Compile a list of 2019's  busiest riders around the world and it is very stark. All of the top 19 raced in at least one British  League. If we are to persuade any non-Brits to base themselves over here then that will be the pull. (There is a problem, in that some of these riders may need but not qualify for work permits in 2021's post Brexit world).

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12 hours ago, DC2 said:

 

Is it indisputable?  Maybe in terms of half a dozen lost GP riders, but otherwise?

 

Yes, it is indisputable. You can pick two teams and compare them, (I think the 2007 team would beat the 2019 team) however every time the points limit is below 42, which it has been numerous times in the last decade, the league gets watered down.

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