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Fromafar

Given the circumstances,will riders have to take a pay cut this season

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Skidder1 - agreed - and the ekstraliga contracts currently prohibit riders signed up in Poland leaving. 

So there will have to be re allocation of riders ..,adjustment of points limits and some agreement on use of guests/loan  replacement  riders to get any 2020 uk league programme going. 

With co operation and common sense from the promoters ......... OH DEAR I think have may have scuppered UK speedway 2020. 

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Has to be done by representatives of promoters and riders coming to an agreement on how it could be run. The riders would have to accept no financial guarantees, so their representatives would have to in turn contact all riders and sound them out as to how many would be prepared to go ahead on such a basis. Only when such data has been established, could clubs/promoters make plans on an operating model to run a league or leagues. Hopefully this has already taken place, because if not, there won't be much chance of anything going ahead except possible just NL level.

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If riders have to take less because “ that’s how it is”. Does that mean that entry prices can increase too for the same reason ? 

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3 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

If riders have to take less because “ that’s how it is”. Does that mean that entry prices can increase too for the same reason ? 

 

3 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

If riders have to take less because “ that’s how it is”. Does that mean that entry prices can increase too for the same reason ? 

I see your point,but that would be dodgy moveIMO

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3 hours ago, Fromafar said:

 

I see your point,but that would be dodgy moveIMO

I wasn’t serious, I know a lot of riders who’ve spent (tens of) thousands getting ready for the season. Who’ve had to seek work in an already hard situation and are now being told by the online experts “well, you’ll just have to stop being greedy and take less money”

I wonder if the same experts will be just as cool when their boss says they have to take a pay cut. ? 

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The problem is, if the go-ahead were given for resumption of racing on, let's say, 1st August with a limit on attendance of 500, or 750, or 1000, there's going to be even greater uncertainty over how many will turn up and pay to watch than there normally is. Keep in mind the age factor - if speedway were popular among mostly the under 40's there wouldn't be such a lack of certainty. 

So nobody is going to know, until a few weeks have gone by (presuming reasonable weather), what income the clubs are going to be working with. You never know, it could turn out to be stunningly good, or atrocious. Until thats been resolved more, and as purely a one-off, there's got to be some flexibility on the part of both promoters and riders. We want to ensure the clubs who give things a go don't go bust and stay in existence next season. If some riders decide against going ahead, at least initially for whatever reason, on a flexible basis then fair enough, that decision should be respected and be welcomed back again in 2021. 

It's not a matter of greed, it's a matter of being realistic and working together.

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Flexibility is great, but for many riders who’ve been screwed over by clubs and are owed thousands ( it’s not just in Poland ) the chance of riding and “hoping everything will be fine” will mean that they may prefer to sit the season out. 

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2 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

I wasn’t serious, I know a lot of riders who’ve spent (tens of) thousands getting ready for the season. Who’ve had to seek work in an already hard situation and are now being told by the online experts “well, you’ll just have to stop being greedy and take less money”

I wonder if the same experts will be just as cool when their boss says they have to take a pay cut. ? 

So what's your thoughts (and maybe more importantly Adam's) on standardised equipment? What if clubs owned the machinery and only paid riders a much reduced "wage" as the riders wouldn't have the costs to meet.

Is it feasible to have standardised bikes in Britain, while Sweden, Poland and the GP's continue with the current setup?

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I’ve never met a rider who thinks that standardized equipment is a good thing. Bike set up is crucial if you’re riding a bike at todays speeds. Most riders can tell if the seat is a couple of cms too high etc. 

The difference in riders height / weight / preference of which handlebars / seat etc all comes into play. 
 

you have to have absolute confidence in your equipment to be able to race properly. How many times do you see a rider jump on a team mates for a heat bike and ride just as well as if he was on his own equipment? 

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

I wasn’t serious, I know a lot of riders who’ve spent (tens of) thousands getting ready for the season. Who’ve had to seek work in an already hard situation and are now being told by the online experts “well, you’ll just have to stop being greedy and take less money”

I wonder if the same experts will be just as cool when their boss says they have to take a pay cut. ? 

Sadly I think a great many around the globe will not get the chance to get their salaries reduced as they will lose their salary completely...

Many companies who were already under pressure will take this opportunity to restructure, and change terms and conditions, whilst blaming Covid 19..

With some of those losing, or getting reduced income, being fans of the sport, which can only mean less revenue as 'recession' bites..

I think the most telling line is the one around how much riders pay out getting ready for the season, and it truly is a staggering amount given they get watched performing on their expensive equipment, in many places, by just a few hundred people every week..

It really is a vicious circle that needs to be broken as everyone, it appears, make nothing like the money they should (and deserve), for what they do.

Unless, of course, Poland comes knocking and you become an elite rider, with the salary and individual sponsorship that reflects your position in the high profile sport that Speedway is over there..

Unfortunately, over here we do seem to have a continual race to the bottom, where everyone pays out fortunes, whilst clubs close as they can't make ends meet..

You have to feel for the riders, and the vast majority of fans do genuinely appreciate and admire what they do, but sadly, if the money isn't there to pay them they can't have it..

Just like many millions of others will unfortunately find out the same. .

Edited by mikebv
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5 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

I’ve never met a rider who thinks that standardized equipment is a good thing. Bike set up is crucial if you’re riding a bike at todays speeds. Most riders can tell if the seat is a couple of cms too high etc. 

The difference in riders height / weight / preference of which handlebars / seat etc all comes into play. 
 

you have to have absolute confidence in your equipment to be able to race properly. How many times do you see a rider jump on a team mates for a heat bike and ride just as well as if he was on his own equipment? 

I probably phrased that one wrongly, what I should have said was standardised engines. I realise that every rider will have their seats and so on at different heights. I am thinking, anything to save money.

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14 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

Flexibility is great, but for many riders who’ve been screwed over by clubs and are owed thousands ( it’s not just in Poland ) the chance of riding and “hoping everything will be fine” will mean that they may prefer to sit the season out. 

Completely understandable, especially if they have an alternative (and reliable) source of income. 

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3 hours ago, Big Al said:

Completely understandable, especially if they have an alternative (and reliable) source of income. 

I think it all boils down to the same result..

And that bottom line result is (unpalatable as it may be for some), Speedway (in the UK) cannot support the number of pro riders it currently has..

The 'alternative source of income' should actually be the Speedway racing for many..

Many, many riders over the past years have adopted that philosophy and ended their speedway careers, whilst not millionaires, with a fair few quid to show for their on track endeavours, and still have a 'proper job' to carry on their lives with..

It really should be only those who want to reach World Class level that should invest tens and tens of thousands in the level of machinery needed to assist them in their quest..

And that is a wholly individual, not team, quest it should be pointed out..

Therefore they should be prepared to 'self fund' this quest for super stardom, rather than expect clubs to help subsidise their individual aims and aspirations, through unaffordable (and sometimes business risking), salary levels.

For me, only if you are in the Top 50 or so in the world you should be a pro..

Anyone Heat Leader level in the top division of the UK (so will invariably DU), should consider being at that level, as well as those at Heat Leader level in Denmark....

And anyone in the top five in Swedens and Polands top divisions, and probably Heat Leader level in Poland Div 2, should be pro level..

Apart from that, then 'semi pro' has to be the way forward surely for everyone else until they organically grow to the next level through performance...

And if all you are doing (without sounding disrespectful) is riding domestic Speedway in your own country at 'mid level and lower' then you really shouldn't be spending tens of thousands of pounds on kit which will then require a commensurate level of income to finance not only that, but your life outside Speedway..

 

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like the above post very much ..

can anyone put the top 50 riders on here . would be interesting to see the list as some riders double up/down between the divisions . 

also can you tell us  the 49th and 50th  riders  ?

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1 hour ago, jenga said:

like the above post very much ..

can anyone put the top 50 riders on here . would be interesting to see the list as some riders double up/down between the divisions . 

also can you tell us  the 49th and 50th  riders  ?

The post you refer to suggests only the top 50 in the world. If there was such a list, how many of them would be riding in GB. Possibly only Doyle Pedersen Lambert?

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