Swindon 1957

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

18 hours ago, chunky said:

I'm sorry, but it is fact. There are rules on online forums and groups for a reason, and John has been shown to break these rules on multiple occasions.

I'm not taking any pleasure in saying it, which is why I have actually tried to help him. Despite what you may think, I do not hate John; I just don't understand why he does some of the things he does.

Really your relationship with Gustix ie) Mr Hyam over the years has been a joke.Myself personally I have made endless mistakes over the years mainly dealing with the likes of you.HELPING him  Gustix really that is laughable really he could help you !!! your arrogance is quite amusing but hey anything you say is a laugh.

Edited July 25, 2020 by Sidney the robin

[chunky 6,068]

Just now, Sidney the robin said:

Really your relationship with Gustix ie) mr Hyam over the years has been a joke.Myself personally I have made endless mistakes over the years mainly dealing with the likes of you.HELPING him  Gustix really that is laughable really he could help you !!! your arrogance is quite amusing but hey anything you say is a laugh.

It would help matters if you tried to act in an adult manner when engaged in discussion, and to read what is being said. Here are some FACTS:

1) Online forums and groups usually have rules and guidelines. Not just about general behaviour and attitude, but things like NO multiple accounts, NO spamming etc.

2) Gustix has broken these rules on the BSF (on more than one occasion), and is punished accordingly.

What I have said here is that "I don't understand why he does things like that", and I really don't. Do you? There is absolutely nothing critical or derogatory in that statement.

I have said many times (both publicly, and to him personally), that John is - and SHOULD be - a valuable member of the BSF. Why he resorts to breaking rules, or even bending them, is beyond me. Yes, I genuinely HAVE tried to help John, because he needs it sometimes.

Recently, he was blatantly posting copyrighted photos on here, and I advised him that he couldn't do that without permission. Whatever you think my opinion of him is, I honestly don't want to see him getting into serious legal trouble (which he can do with things like that). It can also reflect badly on the forum as a whole.

There is nothing that I have said here that is FALSE, or that can be construed as arrogant.

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

Just now, chunky said:

It would help matters if you tried to act in an adult manner when engaged in discussion, and to read what is being said. Here are some FACTS:

1) Online forums and groups usually have rules and guidelines. Not just about general behaviour and attitude, but things like NO multiple accounts, NO spamming etc.

2) Gustix has broken these rules on the BSF (on more than one occasion), and is punished accordingly.

What I have said here is that "I don't understand why he does things like that", and I really don't. Do you? There is absolutely nothing critical or derogatory in that statement.

I have said many times (both publicly, and to him personally), that John is - and SHOULD be - a valuable member of the BSF. Why he resorts to breaking rules, or even bending them, is beyond me. Yes, I genuinely HAVE tried to help John, because he needs it sometimes.

Recently, he was blatantly posting copyrighted photos on here, and I advised him that he couldn't do that without permission. Whatever you think my opinion of him is, I honestly don't want to see him getting into serious legal trouble (which he can do with things like that). It can also reflect badly on the forum as a whole.

There is nothing that I have said here that is FALSE, or that can be construed as arrogant.

Adult really???????? i have actually opologised to you endless times over the years Chunky  to keep the peace no co operation from you EVER .John i don't know him from Adam but you and Iris have had a agenda against him for years shut up keep quiet and pick on me.!!!!!!! 

[chunky 6,068]

1 minute ago, Sidney the robin said:

Adult really???????? i have actually opologised to you endless times over the years Chunky  to keep the peace no co operation from you EVER .John i don't know him from Adam but you and Iris have had a agenda against him for years shut up keep quiet and pick on me.!!!!!!! 

Apologies mean absolutely bugger all if you turn around and then repeat that kind of nonsense the next day - which you invariably do.

Exactly what "co-operation" do you want from me? You are the one who insists we are "at war", yet I have repeatedly told you that we are not. I don't like some of the stupidity you post, but that doesn't mean I hate you or have a problem with you.

I have a problem when you resort to insults and name-calling, and I have a BIG problem when you lie and falsely accuse me of things, but if you don't do that, everything is cool. I have had some  problems with iris123 in the past, but we sorted that out like adults. Even so, that doesn't mean we always agree on things, but that is fine.

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

Just now, chunky said:

Apologies mean absolutely bugger all if you turn around and then repeat that kind of nonsense the next day - which you invariably do.

Exactly what "co-operation" do you want from me? You are the one who insists we are "at war", yet I have repeatedly told you that we are not. I don't like some of the stupidity you post, but that doesn't mean I hate you or have a problem with you.

I have a problem when you resort to insults and name-calling, and I have a BIG problem when you lie and falsely accuse me of things, but if you don't do that, everything is cool. I have had some  problems with iris123 in the past, but we sorted that out like adults. Even so, that doesn't mean we always agree on things, but that is fine.

Really you are a real tool end of, 

  and even if an opology is un genuine at least appreciate  that somebody bothered to you never do  it ever do you ??  You  

are such an arrogant so and so.Gustix/ Mr Hyam again i don't know him from Adam but over the years you have been nothing short of  ( alongside Iris a bully) quite simple sad really.

[chunky 6,068]

3 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

Really you are a real tool end of, 

  and even if an opology is un genuine at least appreciate  that somebody bothered to you never do  it ever do you ??  You  

are such an arrogant so and so.Gustix/ Mr Hyam again i don't know him from Adam but over the years you have been nothing short of  ( alongside Iris a bully) quite simple sad really.

What is sad is that you still insist on insults and name-calling, yet you call ME the bully?

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

Just now, chunky said:

What is sad is that you still insist on insults and name-calling, yet you call ME the bully?

You are a sad individual have a real think ???? 

[chunky 6,068]

Just now, Sidney the robin said:

You are a sad individual have a real think ???? 

Why am I sad?

What do I need to think about?

Why can't you let it go and move on?

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

Just now, chunky said:

Why am I sad?

What do I need to think about?

Why can't you let it go and move on?

I move on but you follow certain people like a bad smell.

[chunky 6,068]

9 minutes ago, Sidney the robin said:

I move on but you follow certain people like a bad smell.

You don't think that I am a valuable member of the BSF with an extensive knowledge of speedway?

Would me leaving the BSF make you happy?

[lucifer sam 3,953]

Getting things back on topic, Swindon's 1957 league victory was astonishing when you look at the London domination post-war from 1946 to 1961, although sadly there was only one London track in the 1957 National League. 

Also, you wonder how good Bob Roger could have been, but for the fractured skull early in 1958.  I think Bob and Arne Pander were the riders who could have really challenged the Big Four (later became the Big Five, after Knutsson's ascension) but for injury.

Wimbledon had a big miss in Ronnie Moore that year who was having a go at car racing in '57 (he also missed much of '58).  On the other hand, Swindon had three good heat-leaders from the side that won the 1956 Division Two and then added to the second string side department to give them a really solid side, with Roger an outstanding No 1.

 

 

[chunky 6,068]

9 minutes ago, lucifer sam said:

Wimbledon had a big miss in Ronnie Moore that year who was having a go at car racing in '57 (he also missed much of '58).  On the other hand, Swindon had three good heat-leaders from the side that won the 1956 Division Two and then added to the second string side department to give them a really solid side, with Roger an outstanding No 1.

The fact that the top six Robins all scored 100 points or more shows you just how solid they were. It is just incredible to see a rider move up a division and do as well as Bob Roger did; that doesn't happen every day.

[lucifer sam 3,953]

7 minutes ago, chunky said:

The fact that the top six Robins all scored 100 points or more shows you just how solid they were. It is just incredible to see a rider move up a division and do as well as Bob Roger did; that doesn't happen every day.

It was less unusual in the days before the points limit - teams often moved up with the same team (1957 was a different situation, because there was an influx of riders from the teams not running - for example, the closure of Poole took Ken Middleditch to Robins).

The likes of Graham Warren, Alan Hunt and Jack Young (already World Champion when he moved up!) went from Second Division to First Division and took it in their stride.

But that's not taking away how good Bob Roger was and what he may achieved without that serious injury early in 1958.

 

Edited July 25, 2020 by lucifer sam

[BL65 655]

Bob Roger had a league average of 9.52 in Division 2 in 1956 and he upped this to 10.27 in 1957 in Division 1, which was indeed remarkable.  He had previously ridden in Division 1 for New Cross in 1952 and 1953, together with Birmingham in 1953.  Another fine achievement was that of Ken McKinlay, who moved up from Division to 2  to Division 1 with Leicester.  In 1956 his Division 2 league average was 10.27 and in 1957 he almost matched it in Division 1 with 9.77, before achieving 10.82 and 10.75 in the next two seasons.

[lucifer sam 3,953]

1 hour ago, BL65 said:

Bob Roger had a league average of 9.52 in Division 2 in 1956 and he upped this to 10.27 in 1957 in Division 1, which was indeed remarkable.  He had previously ridden in Division 1 for New Cross in 1952 and 1953, together with Birmingham in 1953.  Another fine achievement was that of Ken McKinlay, who moved up from Division to 2  to Division 1 with Leicester.  In 1956 his Division 2 league average was 10.27 and in 1957 he almost matched it in Division 1 with 9.77, before achieving 10.82 and 10.75 in the next two seasons.

Hurri-Ken almost repeated the feat of Jack Young.  In the '56 World Final, while still a second division rider, he fell in his final race at Wembley. It cost him a run-off for first place with Ove Fundin.  There was much less gap in standard of riders between the leagues at that point.

Edited July 25, 2020 by lucifer sam