Has British Speedway now reached the bottom?

[foamfence 2,917]

12 minutes ago, TheWatcher said:

Booing is now frowned upon by the woke presenters and announcers up and down the country. There is one particular track where you are actually actively encouraged to applaud the away riders, which gets a lukewarm response by and large, especially when they have just stuffed in a 5-1.

Which means it's even less of a sporting contest with support, erm... Not working is it?

[djr 145]

1 hour ago, teaboy279 said:

It still amazes me that with all the mental health awareness these days that people still are so militant in thier dislike for Carter. I choose to remember my favorite speedway rider as a child.

Taking your own life is one thing , taking someone else's life is another thing altogether and probably explains most of the dislike for Carter

He could also have a lot to say, some of which people loved , some of it just wound people up .

In todays world more people around him would be aware he had mental problems, but would anyone tell him to get help ?   you have to hope so

 

 

[mikebv 10,227]

19 minutes ago, djr said:

Taking your own life is one thing , taking someone else's life is another thing altogether and probably explains most of the dislike for Carter

He could also have a lot to say, some of which people loved , some of it just wound people up .

In todays world more people around him would be aware he had mental problems, but would anyone tell him to get help ?   you have to hope so

 

 

Murdered his wife...

Made his own kids into orphans...

I can only presume that there were obviously no divorce lawyers in Yorkshire...

Take away the Speedway connection completely...

Only a vile selfish individual could do such a thing to his own family...

 

 

[Ray Stadia 1,064]

44 minutes ago, mikebv said:

Murdered his wife...

Made his own kids into orphans...

I can only presume that there were obviously no divorce lawyers in Yorkshire...

Take away the Speedway connection completely...

Only a vile selfish individual could do such a thing to his own family...

 

 

I agree, if it was pre-meditated. I think the chances are, it was spur of the moment. Who knows what we are all capable of in the heat of the moment. I'm sure we have all seen 'red mist' at certain times in our life, I know I have! 

[Tinker 203]

Kenny Carter was well liked in Halifax where I live and got tons of local press. Used to love watching the Dukes away from home where all the opposing fans would be booing him which made for a great atmosphere! He'd go out of his way to make them boo even more but alot of it was just showmanship which is sadly lacking today.

However, as good a rider as he was I cannot condone in any shape or form what he did. As Ray Stadia points out though, no one can be sure what his mental state of was at that time and I'm also pretty convinced that the long list of injuries that he had during his racing career (some very bad ones at that) took their toll on him. 

[Fromafar 10,322]

1 hour ago, Ray Stadia said:

I agree, if it was pre-meditated. I think the chances are, it was spur of the moment. Who knows what we are all capable of in the heat of the moment. I'm sure we have all seen 'red mist' at certain times in our life, I know I have! 

To be honest the  whole Carter family Family were a bit unstable .The Father was a total head case IMO.

[steve roberts 9,242]

14 minutes ago, Fromafar said:

To be honest the  whole Carter family Family were a bit unstable .The Father was a total head case IMO.

Having read the excellent book by Tony MacDonald I can only arrive at the same comclusion...a nasty piece of work. Ivan Mauger was annoyed, to say the least, with his bullying involvement during the 1982 World Final.

[Ray Stadia 1,064]

15 minutes ago, Fromafar said:

To be honest the  whole Carter family Family were a bit unstable .The Father was a total head case IMO.

It was only a few months ago that the news was full of the death of Phil Spectre, who died in prison having committed 2nd degree murder (manslaughter as we call it). Was there a news suppression of his contribution to music, was there heck! The BBC and all the rest made sure we knew all about his 'wall of sound' and all the stars he helped bring on. Yes, there was a cursory mention of the young lady he shot, but not much made of it. Therefore, it is quite normal, perhaps bizarrely, that we do still remember the great things people have achieved, even though they have committed atrocities at some point.   

[Pinny 2,536]

Carter is a murdering scumbag. End of. After what he done , how anyone can say otherwise is baffling. 

[waiheke1 4,295]

17 hours ago, Ray Stadia said:

I agree, if it was pre-meditated. I think the chances are, it was spur of the moment. Who knows what we are all capable of in the heat of the moment. I'm sure we have all seen 'red mist' at certain times in our life, I know I have! 

I think the circumstances set out in Tragedy indicate at least a degree of pre meditation. 

[keepturningleft 588]

 

It is clear from many postings over the years here on the forum and on Facebook pages that Kenny Carter enjoys hero worship status amongst many.

Thank goodness I am not the only person who feels deeply uncomfortable by all this.

 

According to Tony Mac’s excellent book, a close friend of Pam’s claimed that Carter regularly hit Pam and prevented her from going out and leading a normal life.

So now it turns out our hero is a wife beater, a man who inflicted mental anguish on his wife and then finally a murderer.

 

If Carter’s actions on that fateful night had come about after some blazing argument resulting in a red mist moment, it may have made this whole wretched business 1% more bearable.

However we know that Carter travelled to the Huddersfield area the day before the shooting to seek out the murder weapon, eventually sourcing one on the day of the murder so he had plenty of time to consider his actions.

The decision he had made, to murder his wife and devastate the lives of two young children, clearly identifies this as a premeditated and truly heinous crime.

 

Some claim Carter had become unhinged over the years and that his actions were fuelled by his, admittedly terrible, upbringing.

Some are also now tagging a mental illness spin (with no proof), on the story but listening to Carter’s many inarticulate, and cringeworthy ranting interviews on World of Sport over the years he comes across as a little more than a hot headed child and frankly, not very bright.

Many people are raised in deplorable and shocking circumstances but don’t go on to murder.

If you take the position that it’s possible to separate Carter’s speedway career from his personal life, then you have to ask yourself this question: Is Kenny Carter’s speedway career more important than Pamela Carter’s life?

It’s interesting to speculate about what might have happened had Carter not killed himself that night.

Presumably he would have spent the rest of the 80’s, all the 90’s and some of the early century in prison.

Would he have been given a heroes welcome home on the day of his release?

As a convicted murderer, I doubt that he could have returned to speedway in any capacity and especially now given the extremely high profile nature of the Me Too movement and the game changing outrage over the murder of Sarah Everard.

Kenny Carter would today almost certainly be banished to complete obscurity, a sad old man.

Would his fans still be lauding him as a hero and legend in these circumstances?

 

But of course by killing himself Carter conveniently avoided all this, thus bestowing upon himself the status of moral coward of the very highest (lowest) order.

 

The achievements of people such as Carter, Phil Spector, Oscar Pistorius and many others in their respective fields, will aways be there on record. Nothing can take that away from them, but what we should do is to stop eulogising them.

Their crimes have cancelled their status as legends or heroes.

RIP Pam

 

[castrolargh 262]

On 3/28/2021 at 5:14 PM, Wee Eck said:

Regardless of his talents on a speedway bike, for Speedway GB’s press office to eulogise a man who murdered his wife, then orphaned his children by killing himself is, in my opinion, the height of bad taste. And what sort of “kind wishes” are they expressing?

I said similar on a facebook group and got accused of dragging dirt up , or such like 

[Byker Biker 468]

Clear views and opinions have been posted on this thread but perhaps now is the time to let this debate fizzle out.

Here's why,

Horrendous crimes leave a legacy for life with those closely linked or related to the victims and perpetrators, the pain and anguish never goes away but does find a tolerable level. Periodically physical and emotional flares occur naturally to exacerbate that pain and anguish (Birthdays, Christmas anniversaries of the event) however the whole episode is relived for months when the event is brought back into the public eye. In the case of a convicted perpetrator every time there is a parole review and talk of release the event hits the headlines and takes everyone back to the beginning again destroying any recovery and progress that has been made. Many Police Officers believe that whilst justice has not been seen to be done a perpetrator taking their own life is an easier outcome for those left behind to live with than a lifetime of constant reminders in the media.

Many of Kenny and Pam's respective family relations are still actively involved with or supporting motorcycle events including Speedway and do read this forum so out of respect for them it might just be time to put this thread to bed.

[foamfence 2,917]

2 hours ago, keepturningleft said:

 

It is clear from many postings over the years here on the forum and on Facebook pages that Kenny Carter enjoys hero worship status amongst many.

Thank goodness I am not the only person who feels deeply uncomfortable by all this.

 

According to Tony Mac’s excellent book, a close friend of Pam’s claimed that Carter regularly hit Pam and prevented her from going out and leading a normal life.

So now it turns out our hero is a wife beater, a man who inflicted mental anguish on his wife and then finally a murderer.

 

If Carter’s actions on that fateful night had come about after some blazing argument resulting in a red mist moment, it may have made this whole wretched business 1% more bearable.

However we know that Carter travelled to the Huddersfield area the day before the shooting to seek out the murder weapon, eventually sourcing one on the day of the murder so he had plenty of time to consider his actions.

The decision he had made, to murder his wife and devastate the lives of two young children, clearly identifies this as a premeditated and truly heinous crime.

 

Some claim Carter had become unhinged over the years and that his actions were fuelled by his, admittedly terrible, upbringing.

Some are also now tagging a mental illness spin (with no proof), on the story but listening to Carter’s many inarticulate, and cringeworthy ranting interviews on World of Sport over the years he comes across as a little more than a hot headed child and frankly, not very bright.

Many people are raised in deplorable and shocking circumstances but don’t go on to murder.

If you take the position that it’s possible to separate Carter’s speedway career from his personal life, then you have to ask yourself this question: Is Kenny Carter’s speedway career more important than Pamela Carter’s life?

It’s interesting to speculate about what might have happened had Carter not killed himself that night.

Presumably he would have spent the rest of the 80’s, all the 90’s and some of the early century in prison.

Would he have been given a heroes welcome home on the day of his release?

As a convicted murderer, I doubt that he could have returned to speedway in any capacity and especially now given the extremely high profile nature of the Me Too movement and the game changing outrage over the murder of Sarah Everard.

Kenny Carter would today almost certainly be banished to complete obscurity, a sad old man.

Would his fans still be lauding him as a hero and legend in these circumstances?

 

But of course by killing himself Carter conveniently avoided all this, thus bestowing upon himself the status of moral coward of the very highest (lowest) order.

 

The achievements of people such as Carter, Phil Spector, Oscar Pistorius and many others in their respective fields, will aways be there on record. Nothing can take that away from them, but what we should do is to stop eulogising them.

Their crimes have cancelled their status as legends or heroes.

RIP Pam

 

He's still a speedway hero, whatever he did and why he did it, he was still magic on a bike, while I accept your views, what happened was tragic, why it happened and all the circumstances, we'll never know. Personally I also liked Garrity as well, he was a great entertainer and despite his many shortcomings, I liked Ward, I've been involved since the early 50s and I still think Darcy was one of the best two or three riders I ever saw. This is a speedway forum and great moments will always be remembered, no matter who created them.

[MattB 177]

7 hours ago, castrolargh said:

I said similar on a facebook group and got accused of dragging dirt up , or such like 

Yes.  I said I was uncomfortable with it on another and got told to grow up