Fromafar 10,359 Posted June 3, 2021 1 minute ago, mikebv said: Hear! Hear! Fans should have zero expectations from Speedway Promoters that what they will be watching would pass as a 'professional sport', or even 'professional entertainment'... How many years of experiencing this kind of thing happening will it take before fans (those who still go), finally realise they expect too much from the Promoters..? "Yer pays her money and yer takes yer chance" when you attend a Speedway Meeting... Will the track be ok because it has rained too much/not rained as much as forecast/been too sunny/not been sunny enough/been too windy/not been windy enough?* Will all the riders be there or will some be in Poland/Denmark/Sweden/Somewhere else? (with the express permission of their clubs who agreed to the meeting you are paying for knowing it would be a 'select' side being put out).? "Caveat Emptor" when it comes to Speedway I would suggest.. Keep your expectations as low as can be and you can rarely feel let down.. They do their best I am sure, and often for the love of the sport rather than expecting to make any money.. Well meaning amateurs who surround themselves with more of the same, pursuing an often expensive hobby... Whether it's good enough or not is judged by how many still attend I suppose.. Or possibly, more accurately, sadly, by that much, much greater number who no longer attend.. Bottom line is moaning won't change anything as plenty have moaned and walked away yet we still have the same issues now that have been around a long, long time.. Those who still attend should stick with it and accept that every now and then the sport will shoot itself in the foot.. Hit the nail on the head Post. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WembleyLion 413 Posted June 3, 2021 52 minutes ago, mikebv said: Hear! Hear! Fans should have zero expectations from Speedway Promoters that what they will be watching would pass as a 'professional sport', or even 'professional entertainment'... How many years of experiencing this kind of thing happening will it take before fans (those who still go), finally realise they expect too much from the Promoters..? "Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer chance" when you attend a Speedway Meeting... Will the track be ok because it has rained too much/not rained as much as forecast/been too sunny/not been sunny enough/been too windy/not been windy enough?* Will all the riders be there or will some be in Poland/Denmark/Sweden/Somewhere else? (with the express permission of their clubs who agreed to the meeting you are paying for knowing it would be a 'select' side being put out).? "Caveat Emptor" when it comes to Speedway I would suggest.. Keep your expectations as low as can be and you can rarely feel let down.. They do their best I am sure, and often for the love of the sport rather than expecting to make any money.. Well meaning amateurs who surround themselves with more of the same, pursuing an often expensive hobby... Whether it's good enough or not is judged by how many still attend I suppose.. Or possibly, more accurately, sadly, by that much, much greater number who no longer attend.. Bottom line is moaning won't change anything as plenty have moaned and walked away yet we still have the same issues now that have been around a long, long time.. Those who still attend should stick with it and accept that every now and then the sport will shoot itself in the foot.. * delete as applicable.. You are right as always Mike. Nothing changes and I could list a catalogue of Speedway disappointments over many years that compared to last night. It is just something some of us have become hardened to. I will of course keep going and so will others but sadly I fear many more won’t and have already given up and I do fully understand why. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigcatdiary 3,165 Posted June 3, 2021 2 hours ago, StevePark said: "The visitors in particular," which means some Birmingham riders weren't happy either. Also it says “On the day itself as well, because of the greyhound trials that were happening on Wednesday this week..." That'll be the BAGS meeting, that happen EVERY Wednesday and will continue to do so throughout the year, meaning the track staff won't get on to the speedway track until after the last race at 159pm for every home meeting this season. Surely whilst the weather is like this means it’s likely they will hit track problems like yesterday on a regular basis. Has the Management access to other week nights or weekend afternoon or evenings when Greyhound meetings are not taking place. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tomhaines 68 Posted June 3, 2021 4 hours ago, GiveusaB said: I agree with your point of view....nobody is suggesting that fans owe clubs anything.... may be some of us old gits are more hardcore than others.....but to want to penalise promoters, who are most likely already out of pocket is a scandalous suggestion IMO! I don't think Peter and David Mason are running our club to make a living.....they're doing it out of passion for the sport! They need our backing to survive and mistakes or no mistakes, they have my gratitude and support unconditionally! Not sure where I’ve suggested ‘penalising the promoters’. I agree they’ll be out of pocket more than anyone. What I’m saying is that any company in any industry cannot be sustainable relying on the goodwill of the hardcore fan/customer/supporter and will fail if they don’t improve their product and offer a good customer experience - there’s far too much competition for time and money nowadays to be as complacent (or is it sheer arrogance/stupidity/naivety?!) as Speedway promoters are about their product and customers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brianbuck 928 Posted June 3, 2021 There's no point in trying to deny that last night's meeting was a complete disaster and has done no good at all to the image of Birmingham Speedway or speedway in general for that matter, but this was the kind of night that all tracks in their turn do experience occasionally, and it doesn't make Birmingham a poorly run club and nor does it make Redcar villanous opportunists! Unfortunately, when these things do happen, there will be a hard core of supporters who must have someone to pin all of the blame on - and for many of these, the regular target is Laurence Rogers, who like him or not, is actually one of the hardest working people in speedway. When I arrived at the stadium in the early afternoon, Laurence was surrounded by a posse of officials from Birmingham City Council who were obviously grilling him for detailed information regarding the covid rules, and he was still with them over an hour later, and when I looked in at the speedway office, he was wading through the mountain of paperwork that had been left for him to complete. I admit was surprised at how dry the track looked, but I could understand the reasoning for delaying putting more water on. When I rang my wife at 5.30-ish, she informed me that it was pouring with rain in Brierley Hill (only about 10 miles away) and the gathering of black clouds above the stadium seemed to indicate that we were going to get the heavy shower that had been forecast for Perry Barr. In the event, all we had were a few spots, so although the decision not to water, was obviously the wrong one in hindsight. Regardless of that though, the track was not in very good condition having only been used once for practice since 2019, and I wouldn't dispute that both sets of riders were not particularly happy with it. I thought we were in a similar situation to Wolverhampton's a couple of weeks back when their opening meeting had to be called off after only two heats - the track staff did their best to put the surface right, but only succeeded in making it worse. The injury to Jordan Stewart just about put the seal on an unhappy evening, and I sincerely hope that his injuries aren't as bad as have been reported. I don't feel that the condition of the track was in any way the cause of the crash, but very few people I think, would disagree that the abandonment of the meeting through lack of medical cover, wasn't the correct one. The old system of two first aid men picking up an injured rider by the arms and legs, and just throwing him onto the centre green, went out of the window 30-odd years ago! As far as the match score is concerned, Redcar were well on top at the time of the abandonment, and I doubt whether the Brummies would have been able to pull back the deficit, and a fair outcome would be for Redcar to be awarded the match. I know that the referee was asked to do this, but this is a decision which no referee has the authority to make - as those who were asking this referee would know perfectly well. If the BSPL do decide that the scoreline should stand though, this would be a wholly just conclusion and one which I don't think many Birmingham supporters would disagree with. In conclusion, yes, it was a disaster of a meeting, but they do happen occasionally, and I for one am not put off my chosen sport through one bad night. I'm not asking anyone to agree or disagree with me. I'm just offering my own take on an unhappy evening. 9 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,271 Posted June 3, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, Midland Red said: Perhaps therein lies the problem. In “the good old days”, them there great promoters like Charles Ochiltree, Ronnie Greene, etc WERE in it to make a living, hence their insistence on running a professional outfit and their valuing their customers, in order to maximise their income. You mean running it like a 'business', rather than an affordable hobby/plaything? Spot on, if livelihoods were on the line I would suggest the minds would be a lot sharper and less nonsense would be allowed to fester... There is no deterrent for not running things 'properly' because the sport is built on finding promoters willing to lose money.. Which then means there can't be financial penalties as the promoters may then just walk away.. Even more so when those who may want to deliver such penalties will themselves invariably one day be in the same boat, or maybe have already been there.... Speedway (in the UK) is what it is... ie. Somewhat contrived,, lacking in credibility, and perceived by many ex fans as pretty amateurish on the operational and presentation sides.... With the ultimate irony being that a sport with such an amatuer infrastructure to it, probably has too many full time professional competitors which it struggles to afford... Best just accept it for what it is and either pay your money or don't... Either way, it won't change... Edited June 3, 2021 by mikebv 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Petecc 352 Posted June 3, 2021 3 hours ago, StevePark said: "The visitors in particular," which means some Birmingham riders weren't happy either. Also it says “On the day itself as well, because of the greyhound trials that were happening on Wednesday this week..." That'll be the BAGS meeting, that happen EVERY Wednesday and will continue to do so throughout the year, meaning the track staff won't get on to the speedway track until after the last race at 159pm for every home meeting this season. Sorry to put you right but, that was the last bags meeting on a Wednesday. Hopefully by next week the problems with the tractors will have been fixed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Biffa 84 Posted June 3, 2021 Replying as a Redcar fan who wasn’t there last night, I feel Birmingham are getting a lot of bad press over this meeting. For those Redcar fans with long memories, think back to Sunday’s match against the Monarchs. We had to have remedial work on bend 2 - twice if I am right, as well as several other track grades & water breaks. If we had a 4.30pm curfew we could have been in the same predicament as Birmingham. God help us if we had a bad crash to contend with as well. This is with full track staff and full track equipment and as many hours as you want to prepare everything. I know people will say it is an afternoon meeting etc but we should be careful what we wish for. It was hot & sunny leading up to Sunday & hot & sunny 4 days after leading to Birmingham’s meeting, so there track has had 4 more days to bake. All the bad press we have given Birmingham could come back to haunt us. Redcar had better have a really well prepared track for Friday or a lot of crap Will be coming our way. Pressures on track staff now I think. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brianbuck 928 Posted June 3, 2021 (edited) Replying to BigCatDiary - Birmingham's very restrictive planning consent stipulates that racing may only take place on Wednesday's, Bank Holiday Sundays and Good Friday. The "Wednesday's" was changed to "Thursday's" for one season in about 2010, before reverting to Wednesday's. Thursday has been retained as an emergency race night (to accomodate rain-off's etc) but is obviously no longer an option now that Premiership clubs are using this night. Bank Holiday Sundays are also not possible now that the stadium uses this day for greyhound racing. Speedway is very much the secondary activity to greyhound racing at Perry Barr is indeed is the case at most other stadia. Edited June 3, 2021 by brianbuck Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Barry The Cat 78 Posted June 3, 2021 2 hours ago, brianbuck said: There's no point in trying to deny that last night's meeting was a complete disaster and has done no good at all to the image of Birmingham Speedway or speedway in general for that matter, but this was the kind of night that all tracks in their turn do experience occasionally, and it doesn't make Birmingham a poorly run club and nor does it make Redcar villanous opportunists! Unfortunately, when these things do happen, there will be a hard core of supporters who must have someone to pin all of the blame on - and for many of these, the regular target is Laurence Rogers, who like him or not, is actually one of the hardest working people in speedway. When I arrived at the stadium in the early afternoon, Laurence was surrounded by a posse of officials from Birmingham City Council who were obviously grilling him for detailed information regarding the covid rules, and he was still with them over an hour later, and when I looked in at the speedway office, he was wading through the mountain of paperwork that had been left for him to complete. Anyone who has been connected with speedway for a number of years knows that Main Man doesn’t really live up to his name, nice enough fella but sadly out of his depth! If the Mason’s are leaving him to deal with the council and match night operations no wonder it turned into a s**t show! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
proud panther 1,505 Posted June 3, 2021 8 hours ago, tomhaines said: “So called fans” are paying customers. This notion that “fans” owe the tracks something is a problem with speedway… if the product is poor then “so called fans” become former fans. If McDonalds consistently served you cold food would you keep going back just because of goodwill? Of course not, a Speedway club is a business and businesses need to do all they can to retain and increase their customer base - not rely on that goodwill which will run out eventually and not sustain your business. Agree with all of your post, apart from the McDonalds quote. It's always cold, & awful. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
speedwaysliders 176 Posted June 3, 2021 3 hours ago, brianbuck said: Replying to BigCatDiary - Birmingham's very restrictive planning consent stipulates that racing may only take place on Wednesday's, Bank Holiday Sundays and Good Friday. The "Wednesday's" was changed to "Thursday's" for one season in about 2010, before reverting to Wednesday's. Thursday has been retained as an emergency race night (to accomodate rain-off's etc) but is obviously no longer an option now that Premiership clubs are using this night. Bank Holiday Sundays are also not possible now that the stadium uses this day for greyhound racing. Speedway is very much the secondary activity to greyhound racing at Perry Barr is indeed is the case at most other stadia. Brian in know way am i having a go at you but suerly the owners of the stadium can apply for an evening race night at the stadium if its not being used!! Ive only just recovered from the evening getting in and out of the stadium was a nightmare what with the traffic and building projects going on for big events in the area that seem to be being pushed through regardless of any common sense regarding road useage.It just seems amazing to me that you have a stadium that cant operate without stupid restrictions 7 days a week in a large city thats alive and kicking . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tapeworm 169 Posted June 4, 2021 I've got a ticket for Zone B1 for Glasgow Tigers' visit next week. I'm too old to stand for the entire duration of the match. Is there any seating in this area? If not, can I bring in my own folding seat? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigcatdiary 3,165 Posted June 4, 2021 11 hours ago, brianbuck said: Replying to BigCatDiary - Birmingham's very restrictive planning consent stipulates that racing may only take place on Wednesday's, Bank Holiday Sundays and Good Friday. The "Wednesday's" was changed to "Thursday's" for one season in about 2010, before reverting to Wednesday's. Thursday has been retained as an emergency race night (to accomodate rain-off's etc) but is obviously no longer an option now that Premiership clubs are using this night. Bank Holiday Sundays are also not possible now that the stadium uses this day for greyhound racing. Speedway is very much the secondary activity to greyhound racing at Perry Barr is indeed is the case at most other stadia. Thanks for that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
geoff100 1,426 Posted June 4, 2021 13 hours ago, Biffa said: Replying as a Redcar fan who wasn’t there last night, I feel Birmingham are getting a lot of bad press over this meeting. For those Redcar fans with long memories, think back to Sunday’s match against the Monarchs. We had to have remedial work on bend 2 - twice if I am right, as well as several other track grades & water breaks. If we had a 4.30pm curfew we could have been in the same predicament as Birmingham. God help us if we had a bad crash to contend with as well. This is with full track staff and full track equipment and as many hours as you want to prepare everything. I know people will say it is an afternoon meeting etc but we should be careful what we wish for. It was hot & sunny leading up to Sunday & hot & sunny 4 days after leading to Birmingham’s meeting, so there track has had 4 more days to bake. All the bad press we have given Birmingham could come back to haunt us. Redcar had better have a really well prepared track for Friday or a lot of crap Will be coming our way. Pressures on track staff now I think. I think on sunday it would have helped if it wasnt the same guy driving the tractor and then driving the water truck.we got that fedup with the delays we took our burger and chips in the stand Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
