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The White Knight

European Union - In Or Out?

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, wealdstone said:
  • Most Brexiteers I know voted because of things  they did not like about the EU without thinking two or three steps further. IE will we be better off if the things you do not like are removed.  I have noticed that many that voted leave no longer cite their original reasons but claim such things as the EU   is about to implode.

The things people didn’t like about the EU were obviously removed, or at least didn’t directly affect us once the UK left . If we rejoined the EU the things that people didn’t like before will likely be a problem once we get back. So the question has to asked, that should have been asked in February 2016, which is how do we resolve the issues that turned people against the EU in the first place ?

 For those whose answer is anything to do with gammons , gullible, racists, bigots  or right wing press don’t bother answering because that sort of thing doesn’t advance the discussion.

FWIW I don’t think I’ve heard anyone, except possibly Nigel Farage, say the EU is about to implode, although I don’t spend half my life going round discussing it with people as some seem to.

Edited by E I Addio

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1 hour ago, Blupanther said:

Al Johnson is a conman, i don't believe anything he has said, does say or will say in the future. His handling of the Kung flu and everything he said about brexit has been a monster con...

“ All political careers, unless they are cut short, are destined to end in failure “ - Enoch Powell.

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3 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

It was on many French channels. Most of them laughing at his small island mentality. Most European countries are so over Brexit it’s untrue. It’s done , dusted and the British can’t be trusted to keep their word on their «oven ready » deal they negotiated and signed only a few months ago. 
 

Boris is the international laughing  stock now that Trump has disappeared. There’s only so long he can spin the hardships as a fallout from COVID ( which even that he’s managed to balls up) 

 

enjoy your sovereignty.....

THANKS, will do

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3 hours ago, E I Addio said:

 

FWIW I don’t think I’ve heard anyone, except possibly Nigel Farage, say the EU is about to implode, although I don’t spend half my life going round discussing it with people as some seem to.

Well one of those meme things was doing the rounds just days before the referendum going on about 'If we make the first move and leave there are one or two countries waiting to follow'

Then we had numerous posts on here from TWK and Angry Sid probably even that loon phloppy as well going on about how the EU was about to implode or they at least hoped it would. I can understand if you didn't read them though. Rubbish the lot of 'em

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Jonny the spud said:

It was on many French channels. Most of them laughing at his small island mentality. Most European countries are so over Brexit it’s untrue. It’s done , dusted and the British can’t be trusted to keep their word on their «oven ready » deal they negotiated and signed only a few months ago. 
Boris is the international laughing  stock now that Trump has disappeared. There’s only so long he can spin the hardships as a fallout from COVID ( which even that he’s managed to balls up) 

enjoy your sovereignty.....

The Brexiteers have to keep up their obsession with the EU though, because as the lies, deceit and economic destruction of Brexit has finally been laid bare, they no longer have any fallback but to blame it.

When they voted for Brexit, they might not have thought about Ireland, never bothered to understand the importance of trade with their largest trading partner nor the lack of importance of trade with the likes of India and Australia, never grasped how customs and trade systems work, nor considered British expatriate companies and workers earning money for UK plc when they voted for Brexit. It can never be their fault though, even when they've reaped exactly what they voted for, and can now only resort to circulating jingoist articles that are basically saying the UK should be allowed to break any rules that don't suit it. 

You couldn't make it up...! :rofl:

Edited by Humphrey Appleby
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69 Best Brexit Jokes (2021) – The Ultimate Collection | Forex illustrated

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3 hours ago, PHILIPRISING said:

THANKS, will do

Thé UK playing with yourself ….. kinda apt in this case. 

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16 hours ago, iris123 said:

Well one of those meme things was doing the rounds just days before the referendum going on about 'If we make the first move and leave there are one or two countries waiting to follow'

Then we had numerous posts on here from TWK and Angry Sid probably even that loon phloppy as well going on about how the EU was about to implode or they at least hoped it would. I can understand if you didn't read them though. Rubbish the lot of 'em

Actually Iris I was replying to a post from Wealdstone who was talking about some Brexiteers changing in their tune after we left, and saying that the EU was about to implode, and that’s something I can’t remember hearing although I do remember Farage saying at some stage that Denmark and possibly France might follow. 
To be honest I took very little notice of what was being said anywhere before the referendum , just as I don’t take much notice of political debates prior to General Elections.

The one thing I do remember was Cameron’s meeting with Merkel and Co in Feb 2016, and that’s what most people seem to forget. I really thought that there would be some sort of political fudge at that point , enough to get Cameron home on the referendum. I was astonished when it never happened as these fudges happen all the time in other situations. It was that thought that was behind the point of my post. Brexit was the most divisive issue in the country probably in my lifetime.  To my mind it was a monumental political failure that started with John Major basically railroading us in via Maastricht and exacerbated by Blair’s lies about immigration , telling us there would be 15,000 from Eastern Europe when it turned out to be half a million, plus a number of other things. Immigration was a major elephant in the room. Even the EU recognised that the UK had a particular problem with numbers.

So the point I was driving at was moving towards a more sensible level of discussion of how we resolve the issues that turned over half the population against the EU in the first place because even if we hypothetically rejoined those problems would still be there. The divisions in the nation are not going to be healed by calling  people stupid, gullible, blinkered, racists, Little Englander and all the other names. Either the country remains heavily divided on this ( which seems likely) or there needs to be sensible discussion in BSF land.

 

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

So the point I was driving at was moving towards a more sensible level of discussion of how we resolve the issues that turned over half the population against the EU in the first place because even if we hypothetically rejoined those problems would still be there. The divisions in the nation are not going to be healed by calling  people stupid, gullible, blinkered, racists, Little Englander and all the other names. Either the country remains heavily divided on this ( which seems likely) or there needs to be sensible discussion in BSF land.

Brexit was stupid and blinkered in the eyes of the other 'half' of the country, and as a result UK will remain heavily divided on this issue. Brexiteers have thrown plenty of insults around themselves.

The Tory government could have recognised that opinion was closely divided on the matter and come to a settlement that might have at least placated both sides in the debate. Instead it went for just about the most divisive and destructive Brexit possible, continues to forment bad relations with its closest neighbours in the EU, and even reneges on what it's actually agreed to it. 

Until the UK government stops playing to the populist (but increasingly minority) gallery and starts to show some commonsense and make some accommodation to the fact that a majority of the country now realises leaving the EU was a bad move, then I'm afraid it's pointless trying to have any sensible discussion. The lies told by the Brexit campaign are well known, but at some point the corruption behind it will be fully exposed, and that combined with the immense economic difficulties ahead will change wider public attitudes. 

Edited by Humphrey Appleby
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Expecting lots of spin from this UKIP regime about the trade deal with Australia. 

- The government says the Australia deal will save £34m/year on imports.

- Our population is 66 million.

- so it’s an annual 52p per head saving.

- Equates to 1p per week per citizen.

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1 hour ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

Brexit was stupid and blinkered in the eyes of the other 'half' of the country, and as a result UK will remain heavily divided on this issue. Brexiteers have thrown plenty of insults around themselves.

The Tory government could have recognised that opinion was closely divided on the matter and come to a settlement that might have at least placated both sides in the debate. Instead it went for just about the most divisive and destructive Brexit possible, continues to forment bad relations with its closest neighbours in the EU, and even reneges on what it's actually agreed to it. 

Until the UK government stops playing to the populist (but increasingly minority) gallery and starts to show some commonsense and make some accommodation to the fact that a majority of the country now realises leaving the EU was a bad move, then I'm afraid it's pointless trying to have any sensible discussion. The lies told by the Brexit campaign are well known, but at some point the corruption behind it will be fully exposed, and that combined with the immense economic difficulties ahead will change wider public attitudes. 

As usual , and as expected, everybody Humph didn’t gar his own way so else is to blame. 

 

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29 minutes ago, E I Addio said:

As usual , and as expected, everybody Humph didn’t gar his own way so else is to blame. 

And as usual, it doesn't take the Brexiteers long to revert to type. :rolleyes:

You don't recognise why Remainers have a problem with the way Brexit has been handled, so you're just as much part of the divisive problem. 

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46 minutes ago, Steve Shovlar said:

Expecting lots of spin from this UKIP regime about the trade deal with Australia. 
- The government says the Australia deal will save £34m/year on imports.

- Our population is 66 million.

- so it’s an annual 52p per head saving.

- Equates to 1p per week per citizen.

It's reckoned that the Australian trade deal will add 0.02% to UK GDP, so that'll go a long way towards the 13% hit the economy has taken since 1 January. :rolleyes:

But the reality is this trade deal will be far more beneficial to Australia who can export beef, lamb and wine in direct competition to UK farmers, whereas the UK exports exactly what to Australia in large quantities? Some whisky which is subject to high consumption taxes in Australia anyway, and a few expat products like Marmite. It's nothing but political fluff to gloss over the disastrous arrangements the UK has made with its formerly largest trading partner. 

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Hello Humphrey,

Guess the Australian lamb will have ot compete with the NewZealand lamb  on its journey halfway around the world which is already 50% cheaper than any local lamb ... and I live 20 miles from Romney Marsh which is full of sheep.

The wine  will replace the now overpriced EU rubbish we have to put up  with  :-)   

Not really sure what UK actually exported to anywhere to be honest ... not much is mamade here anymore, helps save the environment.   Seems to be limited containers full of scrap metal and waste products for recycling.  Oh yes and "financial Services" and "bankers" 

 

We always have had lots of "bankers"
 

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