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Football 2020/21

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4 hours ago, DC2 said:

Yes, but I’m pretty sure you and I have agreed in the past that being entertaining is more important than winning!

Football, like all sports, goes from tournament to tournament and I’d be happy for England to lose the next five finals playing brilliantly rather than win one playing like Arsenal 1-0.

Italy may have won the ‘82 World Cup but that Brazil team will always stay in my mind.

Winning seems to appeal most to a slightly unpleasant tribal instinct.

Have to disagree here - surely youd rather England win than be an entertaining side?

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C'mon the Sweaties:D

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48 minutes ago, Pinny said:

Have to disagree here - surely youd rather England win than be an entertaining side?

I hope they entertain and lose against Scotland…:D

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Posted (edited)

2-0 down.

ABS B)

Edited by compost
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I thought Alan Rough had retired?

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8 hours ago, CrystalCastles said:

At the same time you don't need be the best attacking or most exciting team in the tournament to win it.

Greece and Portugal have both won it without being particularly good.

 

Not in my mind to be the best attacking team. But if England have any plans to progress in this tournament they need to win & the only way to do that is by attacking & scoring goals.

It frustrates me when we work hard to get a shooting chance that is diverted for a corner. Then from the corner two or three passes later & the ball is safely at the feet of our goalkeeper who launch's a fly ball into an area where players from both sides fight for the ball. We need to play a more positive style with more movement we have a very fast front line but we are not making the best use of those pace players. Kicking the ball around the defenders & goalkeeper in our own half is achieving nothing other than it's a successful pass in the stats.

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Enjoyable game....... I wanted Scotland to win, but wasn't overly bothered, and hats off to the Czechs, whom I always think of being a bit boring and physical....... a bit of a bogey team for England though, at times...... I thought the ref had a good game, let a lot of 'soft' stuff go that other refs would whistle for....... I wish he was reffing Fridays game......... awesome 2nd goal, hats off for that...... 

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13 hours ago, DC2 said:

Yes, but I’m pretty sure you and I have agreed in the past that being entertaining is more important than winning!

Football, like all sports, goes from tournament to tournament and I’d be happy for England to lose the next five finals playing brilliantly rather than win one playing like Arsenal 1-0.

Italy may have won the ‘82 World Cup but that Brazil team will always stay in my mind.

Winning seems to appeal most to a slightly unpleasant tribal instinct.

I have agreed with you very recently that generally being entertaining is important, certainly as a neutral. And i also agree England should play a more attacking game because i think that it suits more of the players.

However International football is far more tactical than English Football and a lot of the time, a game is won because of a mistake.

My point was only that plenty of teams have shown that you don't always need to play attacking football and score lots of goals to progress.

I agree that may be boring/negative and not entertaining, but a lot of the time it gets results.

At the same time, Most opposition teams who you will play to contain and make it hard to entertain, i think if a team plays really well once or twice at a Major tournament that they have done well, the other games is about griding a result out.

England did that against Croatia

On another night England might have scored 2,3 or 4 goals with a bit of luck.

On another night, it's also exactly the type of Game England would have drawn or lost, and got of to a bad start.

 

5 hours ago, Technik said:

Not in my mind to be the best attacking team. But if England have any plans to progress in this tournament they need to win & the only way to do that is by attacking & scoring goals.

It frustrates me when we work hard to get a shooting chance that is diverted for a corner. Then from the corner two or three passes later & the ball is safely at the feet of our goalkeeper who launch's a fly ball into an area where players from both sides fight for the ball. We need to play a more positive style with more movement we have a very fast front line but we are not making the best use of those pace players. Kicking the ball around the defenders & goalkeeper in our own half is achieving nothing other than it's a successful pass in the stats.

The style you suggest would be a much more direct game, and far less possesion based.

However to do that i think you need opposition teams to play differently, but the reality is that for most teams playing England they will play a containing style without the ball, which doesn't make it very easy to get free space even with lots more movement.

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6 hours ago, CrystalCastles said:

I have agreed with you very recently that generally being entertaining is important, certainly as a neutral. And i also agree England should play a more attacking game because i think that it suits more of the players.

However International football is far more tactical than English Football and a lot of the time, a game is won because of a mistake.

My point was only that plenty of teams have shown that you don't always need to play attacking football and score lots of goals to progress.

I agree that may be boring/negative and not entertaining, but a lot of the time it gets results.

At the same time, Most opposition teams who you will play to contain and make it hard to entertain, i think if a team plays really well once or twice at a Major tournament that they have done well, the other games is about griding a result out.

England did that against Croatia

On another night England might have scored 2,3 or 4 goals with a bit of luck.

On another night, it's also exactly the type of Game England would have drawn or lost, and got of to a bad start.

 

The style you suggest would be a much more direct game, and far less possesion based.

However to do that i think you need opposition teams to play differently, but the reality is that for most teams playing England they will play a containing style without the ball, which doesn't make it very easy to get free space even with lots more movement.

I'm sorry you seem to have misunderstood my comment.

The issue is the continued need to play the ball all the way back to our own goalkeeper from an advanced position. Whilst not every ball needs to go forward we do need to keep the opposition under pressure & the smaller the area they have to defend in the more pressure they are under. To many times we pass the ball back & across the field in our own half without even looking for a positive option. A lot of nations play the ball back & forth to force a mistake & find an opening & the higher up this is done the more pressue the defending team is under. Harry Kane is labeled as one of the best strikers in the world & he was coming into his own half to get a touch of the ball, if this is what he has to do then we are not using his best ability which is to score goals within the box.

Edited by Technik
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England somehow need to work out how to come second in the group to avoid France, Germany or Portugal.

If we lost in the semis to say France that wouldnt be deemed a huge failure but to lose in the last 16 to them would be which i wouldnt understand to be honest.

Sterling was awful but scored and Kane looked leggy and lethargic to me and was no threat and missed a sitter. Problem is we only have DCL to replace him , personally i would have took Ollie Watkins just to mix it up a bit........but we have so many defenders we could have left one back especially as Trippier can play both sides.....and ive no idea why Henderson is there 

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:rofl:

Image

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8 hours ago, Technik said:

I'm sorry you seem to have misunderstood my comment.

The issue is the continued need to play the ball all the way back to our own goalkeeper from an advanced position. Whilst not every ball needs to go forward we do need to keep the opposition under pressure & the smaller the area they have to defend in the more pressure they are under. To many times we pass the ball back & across the field in our own half without even looking for a positive option. A lot of nations play the ball back & forth to force a mistake & find an opening & the higher up this is done the more pressue the defending team is under. Harry Kane is labeled as one of the best strikers in the world & he was coming into his own half to get a touch of the ball, if this is what he has to do then we are not using his best ability which is to score goals within the box.

It's very easy to say don't pass the ball back, or side to side,play it forward or to do all of that higher up the pitch 

But International opponents are not going to simply let you do it, because teams don't set up to play that way.

It's far harder to play the ball forward and find space at International level than it is in English football.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, CrystalCastles said:

It's very easy to say don't pass the ball back, or side to side,play it forward or to do all of that higher up the pitch 

But International opponents are not going to simply let you do it, because teams don't set up to play that way.

It's far harder to play the ball forward and find space at International level than it is in English football.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe you did'nt misunderstand my post, I'm not sure you have even read it just the words you want then jump on the keyboard.

If you take the time to read & understand rather than ramble on like an absolute fool my issue is with the need to keep passing all the way back to the goalkeeper then he hoofs the ball up in the air to an area just past the centre circle & then the battle is on to recover the ball & the pressure is off our oppositions defence.

Don't reply now have the common deacency to watch the game against Scotland & count how many times the ball is played back to the England keeper from an advanced position whilst not under pressure

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3 hours ago, Technik said:

Maybe you did'nt misunderstand my post, I'm not sure you have even read it just the words you want then jump on the keyboard.

If you take the time to read & understand rather than ramble on like an absolute fool my issue is with the need to keep passing all the way back to the goalkeeper then he hoofs the ball up in the air to an area just past the centre circle & then the battle is on to recover the ball & the pressure is off our oppositions defence.

Don't reply now have the common deacency to watch the game against Scotland & count how many times the ball is played back to the England keeper from an advanced position whilst not under pressure

I have read your post.

Like lots of England fans, you seem to think that England, do this loads more than other teams.

I however don't think England pass it back to the keeper more than necessary and most of the time there are reasons why teams get forced into doing it.

Its pretty sad that no matter what England fans will simply find fault in performances everywhere. 

Best of luck against Scotland.

 

 

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