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Seymour Dix

F 1 Today's race

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11 minutes ago, Midland Red said:

So you think that Fundin, Briggs, Moore, Craven and Knutsson should have started from the gate, with the likes of Pete Brough and Nick Nicholls off 20 yards?

Or the scratch golfer should have a few shots start over an 18 handicapper?

Yes!

I spent 40 years playing darts competively. When I started out as a teenager, I was playing against players better than me, including the world's best. I got my arse kicked - consistently. All that did was make me determined to keep going until I was the one kicking arses, and in 1991, I reached the position of World No. 1.

So, working my arse off for all those years, is it fair that I should be penalised? Excellence and effort should be rewarded. By handing out handicaps, all you are doing is saying to people, "It's okay, you don't have to put any effort in, or be any good - we'll give you a start."

Competitive sport SHOULD be competitive. You win some, you lose some. You beat people that are better than you, and you lose to people worse than you. That's life.

If you get tired of losing, you have a choice; you work hard and get better, or you quit...

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6 minutes ago, Kester said:

Why would it be an embarrassment when he's on their junior driver programme and 'on loan' at Williams?    Mercedes have lost Lewis a few wins over the years, putting him on a poor strategy or messing up safety car periods - what 'embarrassment' were they trying to avoid then?

Yeah, when I saw a comment yesterday, saying that it would be "embarrassing" for Hamilton, I couldn't believe it!

A quality driver in a quality car winning ONE race, would embarrass a multi-World Champ when he wasn't even competing??? :rolleyes:

I'm sure nobody would have been happier to see George win than Lewis Hamilton!

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1 hour ago, Kester said:

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Kester said:

But even if that were true, then if Lewis hadn't delivered at any stage of his career then he wouldn't still have the opportunities to perform.  As soon as he hit Formula 1 in 2007 he was competitive and beating Alonso, regarded by anyone with any knowledge as one of the quickest and most consistent drivers of his generation.  

Formula 1 has always been a combination of engineering and driving performance.  How many of the champions of any era were in the best car that season?  Answer, the majority of them.  In any era the best drivers knew the importance of being in the best car possible.   If anyone could win in the Mercedes and the driver doesn't matter then why don't they sack off Hamilton and get Latifi, Magnussen, Grosjean or anybody else in.  They'd save a packet.  Similarly, Red Bull could get rid of Verstappen, Ferrari chuck Leclerc.  But they won't, because it's not all about the car.  I see some gibberish online 'He wouldn't win in a Haas', well no of course he wouldn't.  But Hamilton or Verstappen would drive it a lot quicker than Magnussen or Grosjean do.  That's the point.

Is it boring that Hamilton keeps winning?  yes, it is a bit.  But it was boring when Shumacher kept winning too, in the best car, with bespoke tyres, with a team mate who was paid to jump out of his way.  Ultimately, it's up to the others to catch up, that's how it works.

 

Thanks for the input as I have no personal knowledge of Hamilton or his background only that I found John's comments rather interesting if somewhat forthright but, then again, he has strong views on many things!

Edited by steve roberts
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6 hours ago, Midland Red said:

It seems to indicate that the car is far superior to the rest, hence Hamilton’s success

Of course it is, but with limited practice Russell still showed he could drive it quicker than Bottas who's driven the car all season. 

Hamilton is now in the best car because he was always a great driver and also managed his career well. Mercedes weren't particularly the best team when he joined, but perhaps him joining was part of the equation.

Edited by Humphrey Appleby
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1 hour ago, chunky said:

Yeah, when I saw a comment yesterday, saying that it would be "embarrassing" for Hamilton, I couldn't believe it!

A quality driver in a quality car winning ONE race, would embarrass a multi-World Champ when he wasn't even competing??? :rolleyes:

I'm sure nobody would have been happier to see George win than Lewis Hamilton!

You obviously can’t see the point :o

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2 hours ago, steve roberts said:

John Davis gave an interesting viewpoint regarding Lewis Hamiton in a recent interview. Basically he suggets that Hamilton was given a better opportunity early in his career because of his background whereas more potentially talented drivers were overlooked? I'm not familiar with the modern Motor Racing scene so can't offer a personal viewpoint on that particular subject.

The best drivers don't always make it to F1 for various reasons. With the sport being a multi-billion dollar business these days, as well as being a very good driver, you need to be good with the media and sponsors, be photogenic, as well as bring a sizeable amount of money to the team. 

However, whether one likes Lewis Hamilton or not, he got his opportunity because he was a incredibly talented driver who got his foot in the door. F1 teams were not - and are still not - charities giving drives to the underprivileged.

As a general rule, to reach F1 you have to come from a quite a wealthy background, have daddy or another benefactor pay for you to join the best karting teams from the age of around 8, and then be able to call their rich friends to sponsor you through the various formulas. Lewis Hamilton did it having little or none of this sort of backing, and I have every respect for him not only making it to F1, but being the very best and able to call the shots.

Whilst he is currently in the most superior car, you only have to look at how he usually gets more out of it than Bottas, who is himself a very good driver.

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2 hours ago, Kester said:

But Hamilton or Verstappen would drive it a lot quicker than Magnussen or Grosjean do.

George Russell's performance in Bahrain put into perspective how God awful the Williams is, and it's been something of an achievement to even get it up into the midfield. 

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Just now, Humphrey Appleby said:

George Russell's performance in Bahrain put into perspective how God awful the Williams is, and it's been something of an achievement to even get it up into the midfield. 

He's definitely been making the car look better than it is.  Last year, in his rookie season, during races he comprehensively out-drove Kubica but it was hard to judge whether it was his skill or Kubica's difficulties which were at play.  

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1 hour ago, Kester said:

ILesser formula have partially reversed grids etc and it works fine in the BTCC for instance, which I love.  But let's be honest, it's a bit Mickey Mouse.  

In the BTCC, I think there's much less different in performance between the cars, so there's less of a safety concern with slower drivers starting at the front. In F1 though, it would just be carnage if all the fastest cars started at the back.

It might be interested though if F1 had a couple of short qualifying heats that mixed up the grid positions, but so that everyone got a fair share between front-and-back positions. The GPs are much more interesting when the grids get mixed up for whatever reason. 

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7 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

In F1 though, it would just be carnage if all the fastest cars started at the back.

Exactly...

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8 minutes ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

In the BTCC, I think there's much less different in performance between the cars, so there's less of a safety concern with slower drivers starting at the front. In F1 though, it would just be carnage if all the fastest cars started at the back.

It might be interested though if F1 had a couple of short qualifying heats that mixed up the grid positions, but so that everyone got a fair share between front-and-back positions. The GPs are much more interesting when the grids get mixed up for whatever reason. 

Agree, likewise with rain/changeable weather - anything that throws a curveball.   I suppose another option is only having a one lap shot when down to the final 10 qualifiers.

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45 minutes ago, Kester said:

Agree, likewise with rain/changeable weather - anything that throws a curveball.   I suppose another option is only having a one lap shot when down to the final 10 qualifiers.

I think any sort of system to decide the starting grid needs to allow all the cars to run on track at the same time. The track conditions can change during a session, whether rain, temperature, or just rubbering in. 

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1 minute ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

I think any sort of system to decide the starting grid needs to allow all the cars to run on track at the same time. The track conditions can change during a session, whether rain, temperature, or just rubbering in. 

Good point.  What about 'fastest lap in reverse'? should sort the men from the boys.

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On 12/7/2020 at 8:33 PM, Kester said:

Agree, likewise with rain/changeable weather - anything that throws a curveball.   I suppose another option is only having a one lap shot when down to the final 10 qualifiers.

We had single lap qualifying a number of years ago and that was dreadful. 

It's a bit like how the Speedway GP did the qualifying laps (draw) last year. The problem in F1 is the best lap is the first flying lap. Unlike in the SGP most often the first rider on track gained the fastest time and the nearer to the track prep mid line up meant less chance of a good finish.

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Cracking end to the race yesterday- going to enjoy this season mainly because SKY have finally seen sense and re-instated Ted`s notebooks !!!

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