Halifaxtiger

I don't believe that the majority of riders make a substantial amount of money racing speedway. There are a number who might well do - the top boys in the GP's riding in two or three leagues or the leading Championship rider doubling up, for example. My suspicion is that those riding Premiership or Championship alone might make some but many in second string or reserve berths or riding NL might have trouble just breaking even, particularly the latter. The thing is, though, is that there has to be an understanding that speedway is little more than part time employment even during the season. I am not sure that that is accepted to the degree necessary. I also do not believe that most promotions are profitable and that they are, like many football clubs, propped up by wealthy individuals indulging in what is a personal hobby, occasionally in the hope that things will improve. It is one reason why I disagree with the vitriolic, personal abuse that we often see on here as speedway fans owe a debt to those individuals. While it is undoubtedly true that speedway could not run without its paying customers, it is equally true that a number of tracks would close without the support of its promoter. Having said all that, I completely agree that it is not a matter of the cost of speedway but its value for money. A top quality meeting, in my view, is worth the £18 that you can occasionally (and it should be made clear that that is the highest price paid - Plymouth will be £10 next season - and probably 75% of clubs charge less) be forced to part with.

Absolutely spot on, Dean I certainly believe that rider demands have played a part in speedway struggling to keep its head above water. Some seem to believe that it is a full time occupation and not only is it not now, it never has been. I can recall Tony Davey, an England International and 9.00 British League heat leader, saying in the 70's that he had to sell his car to buy a new engine. Mick Bell, one time Coventry and Reading second string/reserve, once said that speedway was nothing more than a good paying hobby. Only the top boys - then as now - did well out of it. But its not just finance. Track surfaces and conditions are constantly subject to their interference, usually to the detriment of the racing. Sheffield is the classic example : a superb racing track destroyed by rider demands. It says everything about their attitude that when Scunthorpe, by far and away the best circuit in the country, was named track of the year they took to the internet in droves to make derisory, critical and mocking comments. My intention here is not, in anyway, to blame riders entirely for the situation that the sport is in - that would be grossly unfair. But there has to be a realisation on their part that the paying fan comes first (and last) every single time. If they have to take a pay cut so that entrance charges do not increase, so be it. If the track is prepared in a way to maximise customer satisfaction, shut up complaining and get on with it.

And that is what will count in 2017. But its not just Tatum's ability on the mechanical side. I have no doubt he will be able to tutor the team about actual riding and I have an idea that he is an excellent motivator too, based upon the Lakeside v Poole meeting early last season. Poole were winning easily when Tatum turned up, delayed by the traffic in the area. Lakeside then - especially Lewis Bridger - came out spectacularly fired up and won the meeting comfortably. A very good man to have on your side of the pits indeed.

Halifax Town £16. Aside from the track, there's nothing wrong with the stadium at all. Indeed, the quality of the facility only goes to highlight just how much of a shame it is that the shape of the circuit is so poor.

Crap track, yes - although Coventry isn't that much better. The rest - facilities, viewing, cold, parking - are nonsense.

Belle Vue running, Leicester running, Coventry running. All three open to serious doubt at the end of 2016. The BSPA and, in particular, Buster Chapman must take a great deal of credit for that.

Simply have to move on from that, however true it maybe.

Its 'rubbish news' that the Bees survive and could well be back at Brandon ? I'd like to hear your description of the news had it been complete closure. Compared to the situation we had three days ago its both fantastic and incredible.

Isn't anybody actually happy that Coventry Bees are continuing to ride and there is the aim of that being at Brandon ?

I think we all do. I think it also highlights the stark contrast between the reaction to Jon Armstrong (who is older) signing for Mildenhall and Mason signing for Lakeside. That is just about the only justification that I (and, I suspect, others) would accept.

Very true - although, to be fair, its not just promoters that spout that but fans too. 'Use it or lose it' has been heard many times on the pages of this forum. It doesn't matter that the stadium is a dump, the customer service aggressive, hostile and abusive, the surface dreadful, the racing worse and the team awful, you still have to go. Passionate fan that I am, I have never accepted that. As is the case with any business, it is for the speedway promotion to attract people by making their product and the customer experience as good as it can be. I have yet to be convinced that that is the case in quite possibly the majority of tracks across the country.

As a matter of fact I was. Both. Not one of those who stands on a corner and does nothing but lean on a flag.

Hopefully long before then but if its good news March would be OK. Part of the problem is the setting of deadlines. I am all for that, but you simply can't keep extending them. If there was a chance that the stadium would be saved but it was not clear at what point that would be sorted, no dead line should have been set.

The point is everything - and I mean everything - should be done to put the paying customers needs first. Not after the promoters, or the track staffs, or the riders. Far too many tracks put what their customers want below the needs of others and then wonder why they don't come back. Scunthorpe never have an interval. Do they have stronger bladders in Lincolnshire ? As has most accurately been pointed out, when it suits intervals are dropped. What you are saying is that your paying customer will be forced to stand around for 15 minutes in potentially freezing cold conditions getting bored, dispirited and fed up so the track staff can go to the can. This thread is full of people - quite rightly - complaining about unnecessary delay and yet you agree with it. That's extraordinary. Ask yourself this. Is a person more likely to attend again if he isn't standing around getting cold or not ? You must surely be having a laugh. Most are volunteers (I was). They also get to watch the meeting free and I am not aware of a track that has ever had a major problem recruiting them. I can certainly say that I have been to around 700 meetings across the country in the last 10 years or so and I have never known one postponed or delayed due to a shortage of track staff. The paying customer comes first, every single time. My apologies. You are absolutely right. Thing is, though, is that the matter of unnecessary delay is extremely important right across the sport.

As far as I am aware, in many cases there is no obligation to do so but some do as a matter of good will. On the other hand, tracks that own their stadiums - Eastbourne & King's Lynn come to mind - have them. Bad enough putting riders interests over fans but track staff ????

I think some delay is inevitable - football doesn't need to have work on the pitch undertaken during the match, for example. Having said that, two hours is the very maximum it should take to run and a norm should be 90 minutes. Every effort should be made to cut down unnecessary time lapses, intervals being the main one. No fan likes them and there are many - including me - who can't stand them. We can only hope that at some point in the future promoters learn that what they take at food bars they lose at the turnstiles. I went to a meeting at Birmingham last March. On an absolute freezing night, we had a 20 minute interval. That's just ridiculous.

And yet if Coventry run in 2017 there will be more stand alone tracks in operation than there were in 1987, and even if they don't there will be the same number. Lower leagues, maybe, but there will be. Sort of flies in the face of an argument that the sport is 'all but finished', doesn't it ? As to being an ex-promoter, you mean that he is one of the very few people on this forum who put his money where his mouth is and ran a speedway track (including a PL championship winning team). An ex promoter who now runs a free training school, funded entirely out of his own pocket. Who sponsors riders year in, year out. Do we need more people like Tsunami involved, or less ?

My point is that if someone of the financial means, track record for success at speedway tracks and passion for the sport like Tony Mole won't take the club up it says a great deal about why they are in the NL.

Someone like Tony Mole, for instance ?

Do you need to be reminded of what happened the last time Birmingham were in the top flight ? They, and others, are in the NL for a very good reason.

I think everyone can accept that a person has a right to retrieve their own assets. But until someone can explain how ripping out seats, smashing them up and dumping them in a skip is 'retrieval of assets' I don't accept in anyway that that is what Sandhu intended. The intention was to render the stadium unfit for racing of any kind.

My understanding is there is a lot of circumstantial evidence to suggest that's true. I'll await the outcome of the police investigation. I think its pretty clear whose men went into Brandon and trashed the place. If Sandhu gets done for that (as you would think he would), we'll know he has no connection or influence over Brandon Estates. If he doesn't, you would have to ask yourself just why that was the case. I really don't get that one. If Brandon hadn't been trashed this issue wouldn't have arisen. It wasn't Horton who sent people in to do that.

How many said that in 2010 ? (and by the way that is 7 years ago). I'd say the problems at this stage of the year were far, far worse then but we're still here. The funny thing is that I'd say they are created at least in part by the same man. The situation with Belle Vue, Leicester and Coventry is not symptomatic of the sport as a whole and the fact that they are having difficulties at the same time is coincidental, for the simple reason that the principal difficulties are all different. At Belle Vue, it was the losses run up by the promotion. At Leicester, it was just the promotion. At Coventry, the stadium. As to the BSPA, I have on many occasions been extremely critical of them. This time, however, I totally agree with Tsunami that Buster Chapman has 'played a blinder'. Belle Vue are running. Confirmation awaiting, but they are. I am not sure of Chapman's role in that but he has definitely played a part. At Leicester, he has almost single handedly saved the speedway team by purchasing the lease to the stadium himself. If he is involved in trying to sort Coventry out I for one am thankful for it and, to me, it defies reason that anyone is being critical of the part he has played. I think Mick Horton has a case to answer here but, lets face it, it wasn't his workmen that went into Brandon and did so much damage that they made it unfit for purpose. Had that not happened, Coventry Bees fans would be talking about the new season, not talking about the finish of their team.

Come on, Phil. I can't think of anyone better qualified to show you how not to do it

Dave Tattum.