June01

Can anyone put me in touch with Rye's official photographer please? Either an email address, or by Twitter, or even on here if possible? Thanks in advance.

Do you, or anyone else, have the date of this meeting please? I know it was rained off and staged the next day, but not sure if it was the 23rd, 24th or 26th June?

Being rather lazy, has Bjarne been reclassified? Is he now a B rider? Just asking because if he's still an A grader the fixture clashes wouldn't matter as Nicki would get priority.

I would think that is Constantine/Konstantin Svinkin, 1987 Russian U21 Champion. Edit: sadly commemorated in the speedway memorial website http://speedwayinmemoriam.yolasite.com

So your programme and speedway.org seem to agree, and arnie's link and Wikipedia seem to tally. The joys of statistics.

Thanks, Arnie. Just wanted confirmation on the final scores for riders 5 (Marek Kepa), 7 (Anders Eriksson), 11 (Zbyszek Holy), 12 (Knud Ellegard), 14 (Josef Aigner) and 15 (Hans Albert Klinge) please, as speedway org say 8,9,7,11,4 and 6 points respectively.

I’m sure I work out my results the same way as you do – take the results, the riding order and the heat format to work out the heat details. I’m terribly anal when it comes to making sure my results are correct before I post them, and use as many sources as possible, which means it can take hours, or even days, to collate, cross reference, total and re-check. In this instance, and having started the heat detail process as I usually do, I have no issues with any riders’ scores except the four previously mentioned – Olszak, Nielsen and now Gundersen and Jensen. In answer to your question of whether I’m happy to accept the above poster’s result as definitive, well, no. I only had a quick look this morning without all the details in front of me, saw the “10” in red, and figured that was “end of problem”. I assumed Jensen’s 14 would fit in with the format/results when revised, and that it could have been a simple typo in the original report that filtered through to other sources...and who am I to question someone who was actually there?! But now I’ve gone through the whole thing I am convinced Olszak (assuming he is O Keirjk in the SS?) and Nielsen scored 6 and 10 respectively, and thanks to your posting of the article which states “Jolly was one of two riders to beat Jensen. The other was…Gundersen” I’m also convinced Jensen finished on 13. So it’s taken much longer than usual, but I think I’m finally there. Thanks to each and every poster on this thread, as your information has been invaluable, and here is what I think the final result was: Junior European Championship - Lonigo - 22.07.78 1..Armando Gigliali (ITA)..0,0,0,1,1 = 2 2..Ryszard Romaniak (POL)..2,1,1,0,2 = 6 3..Roman Jankowski (POL)..1,1,0,0,0 = 2 4..Pavel Karnas (CZR)..3,1,3,1,0 = 8 5..Hans Nielsen (DEN)..3,3,0,1,3 = 10 6..Erik Gundersen (DEN)..2,2,3,2,2 = 11 7..Fausto Birbini (ITA)..0,0,2,2,1 = 5 8..Josef Juza (CZR)..1,0,3,2,2 = 8 9..Mieczyslaw Kmieciak (POL)..2,1,1,0,0 = 4 10..Henryk Olszak (POL)..1,3,0,2,0 = 6 11..Lillebror Johansson (SWE)..0,2,1,1,1 = 5 12..Finn Jensen (DEN)..3,3,3,3,1 = 13 - 1st 13..Kevin Jolly (GBR)..3,2,1,3,3 = 12 - 2nd 14..Nikolai Manev (BUL)..0,0,2,0,2 = 4 15..Steve Finch (GBR)..1,3,2,3,3 = 12 16..Neil Middleditch (GBR)..2,2,2,3,3 = 12 - 3rd 17..[R]..Ladislav Hradecky (CZR)..DNR 18..[R]..Danny Kennedy (AUS)..DNR Ht 1..Karnas, Romaniak, Jankowski, Gigliali [F/Ex] Ht 2..Nielsen, Gundersen, Juza, Birbini Ht 3..Jensen, Kmieciak, Olszak, Johansson Ht 4..Jolly, Middleditch, Finch, Manev [Ex] Ht 5..Nielsen, Jolly, Kmieciak, Gigliali Ht 6..Olszak, Gundersen, Romaniak, Manev Ht 7..Finch, Johansson, Jankowski, Birbini Ht 8..Jensen, Middleditch, Karnas, Juza Ht 9..Gundersen, Middleditch, Johansson, Gigliali Ht 10..Jensen, Finch, Romaniak, Nielsen [F/Ex] Ht 11..Juza, Manev, Kmieciak, Jankowski Ht 12..Karnas, Birbini, Jolly, Olszak Ht 13..Jensen, Birbini, Gigliali, Manev Ht 14..Jolly, Juza, Johansson, Romaniak Ht 15..Middleditch, Olszak, Nielsen, Jankowski Ht 16..Finch, Gundersen, Karnas, Kmieciak Ht 17..Finch, Juza, Gigliali, Olszak Ht 18..Middleditch, Romaniak, Birbini, Kmieciak Ht 19..Jolly, Gundersen, Jensen, Jankowski Ht 20..Nielsen, Manev, Johansson, Karnas Ht 21..Jolly, Middleditch, Finch Please feel free to correct me, but be aware that if I have to go through it all again I may cry.

Thank you, andout, that looks much more like it. Given the SS's rider lineup I'm not convinced they were actually at the same meeting anyway! Quite worrying that out of all available sources not one has the meeting winner's score correct. Thanks again. I don't suppose you have the 1979 final scores as well, do you (she asks cheekily but hopefully!) as there seem to be several discrepancies on that too?

Thanks, but I know the author, and those results come from Wiki. What I'm really after is either someone who has a completed programme, or confirmation the 4th post in the thread is from the SS.

Yeah, but they seem to be using the article you quoted as their source for his position. Speedway.org gives: HN 6, HO 6 The Bulgarian website agrees with 10 and 6, but looking at spelling comparisons it was probably taken from speedway.org Speedweek.com agree with 10 and 6 also, and just to throw a wild card into the equation, Sportowefakty (Przemyslaw Jany) gives HN 11 and HO 6, which doesn't add up mathematically, so I think I can rule that one out. I'm currently posting things all over the place for other results and not having much luck. As you say, it would be nice if there was an official site. Edit: just looking at the 1979 results I can already see I'm going to have problems there too. That one seems to have even more inconsistencies than the others. So if anyone has an offer as to what the final scores were for the World U21 final in 1979 I'm putting in my plea now...

Bringing this back up to see if you still have this info please, Grachan? Several sources are saying Hans Nielsen finished on 11 and Henryk Olszak 5, but others are quoting 10, with Olszak ending on 6. This would make heat 15 the heat in question. I wondered if you (or anyone) can say definitively for my records?

Many thanks for that. It's very much appreciated.

I wonder if anyone can help me with any of the following, from either programmes or other first hand evidence (not the internet) please? British League Riders Championships: 1984 - John Louis' final score Date of 1985 meeting. Riding order for 1989, where the riders were: Shawn Moran Hans Nielsen Brian Karger Martin Dugard Ronnie Correy Jimmy Nilsen Kelvin Tatum Alan Grahame Simon Wigg Rick Miller Richard Knight Lance King Peter Ravn Jeremy Doncaster Paul Thorp Mitch Shirra Sweden: 1952 Swedish Final - Stig Pramberg and Einar Lindqvist's final scores. 1956 Swedish Final - Reserves Arne Carlsson and Olle Andersson (I) replaced who and in which heats (3 rides between them) 1959 Swedish Final - who did reserve Joel Jansson replace and in which heats (3 rides)? 1960 Swedish Final - who did reserve Leif Larsson replace and in which heat (1 ride)? 2003 Swedish Final riding order. Riders: Aleksandr Halyavin: The only information I can find on him is all from the same single source (Wiki's entry for the 1977 U21 European Championship Final) which leads me to believe there is possibly a typo in there somewhere? Jonas Andersson : Where in Sweden was he born? Bernie Aldridge: Date of death (2010)? Peter Baldock: Date of birth and death? Dates of birth for the following: Neil Abrahams Des Allen Peter Bradshaw Mick Beaton John Bowerman Mark Bullivant Jonathan Blake Keiron Boyle Darrell Branford Chris Blythe Neal Barnsley Greg Blair Don Beecroft Phil Baker Wayne Baxter Tracy Bray Barry Bostock Dates and places of birth for the following: Ian Armstrong John Alexander Karl Armstrong Bob Abell Phil Ashcroft Tony Abson Pete Barnes Peter Benjamin Ray Boughtflower Stephen Brown Patrice Blondy Tim Bungay Steve Braidford Keith Booth Glyn Blackburn Gary Brown Dick Baxter Clive Buckler Adrian Baker I have more, but figured it'd be easier to ask in batches.

Ah, now that's more like it. Thanks for clearing that one up! Those seem to be the British Final results and I was after the BLRC. But thank you for going to the trouble of looking it up.

British League results for 1986: http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/thread/5878/british-league-1986 KO Cup results: http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/thread/3318/ko-cup-results-division-1 And riders (including guests - click on each one for their averages) http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/thread/4909/bradford-odsal Edited to add: not sure if you're wanting individual meetings where a Bradford rider has appeared so I'll just leave you a link to our indexes: http://wwosbackup.proboards.com/board/27/introduction-indexes

With all due respect, if existing fans don't know about it, can it be classed as a successful promotion? What you said is going on for your club all sounds very positive, and fair play to Newcastle, but the BSPA are the group responsible for the promotion of the sport overall. People living within a certain radius of the tracks will generally have heard there's a speedway stadium, but it's the wider audience that need to be reached, and that means branching out beyond local speedway areas. The British GP advert is a prime example (I know this falls under a different jurisdiction, but the principle remains). It's great to see, but wouldn't it be better shown during another programme? Perhaps another motor sport, to attract fresh interest? After all, if you want new supporters it's not much use advertising to those who already go.

This forum is around, what? 10 years old? Back then people were saying speedway will be dead in 10 years' time, the final nail in the coffin, etc, and they're saying it now...but it's still here, going on stronger than a lot of people believed. I appreciate some things are frustrating, and not everyone is going to agree with some rules, decisions, team building, but I really don't see how saying RIP speedway is helpful. After all, those who ARE saying it are continuing to at least read the forums and take an interest, so it's clear they once thought fondly of speedway, and probably still do. All the time it has that support it will hopefully keep going. But the point of this thread is how to attract new supporters. I've said it before and my thoughts haven't changed. I've lost count of the blank looks I get if I mention speedway - so many people have no idea it exists, let alone what it is or what it's about. I still think targeted adverts couldn't hurt. Flyers in the local papers...that sort of thing. Also I see lots of promotion in Denmark. Nicki and other riders visiting schools with their bikes, going to hospitals to talk to the kids... Not everyone is going to see speedway and say, "yeah I want to go and watch that" but if they don't even know it exists....?

A hostage situation? Could be the answer.

Denmark do rider grading. They're always worth a chuckle, if nothing else. Even the Danes think they're mad.

As a collecter of results I appreciate this input. So is the general conclusion that Biggs moved up and "rode" at 17 and Westerberg at 18, or did Westerberg simply replace Crutcher at 17? Would appreciate any answers you get.

As a female supporter, the biggest turn off for me is delays. Can't ever recall a time when speedway attracted a young crowd, it's always been a case of "my dad took me" whenever I've asked how anyone got into the sport. Clubs are keeping kids coming through the turnstiles with parents on free or cheap deals, so maybe it's the slightly older market they need to be targeting?

Should have gone the other way and pumped more in, for me. Monster clearly have too much of a monopoly on the series and seem to think this exonerates them and their riders from behaving in a proper manner. A bit of competition might just bring them down a peg or two.

Given the lack of assistance for the position we're lucky to even have anyone willing to give up their time and effort to fill it.

What's Swiderski's average currently?

Just bringing this thread up again to highlight it. From what I've read today Vitaly is making small, but positive, progress. He has had some financial assistance from Russian fans but (and this really shocked me) not a single donation from Europe. Guessing this might be because his case hasn't been greatly publicised, so thought I'd post the information for anyone who might wish to help Vitaly in his rehab but didn't know how (also today happens to be his birthday.) Details are on this page. http://sportowefakty.wp.pl/zuzel/557096/witalij-bielousow-walczy-o-powrot-do-pelnej-sprawnosci-zaczalem-ruszac-palcami-p I have no personal ties to Vitaly, aside from enjoying seeing him ride in the SWC, but this story resonated with me, as I'm sure it does with many other speedway fans.