BWitcher

'Yes I am extremely angry that we are facing the likely situation of going into tonights crucial meeting without AJ but there is more to this than a crash that could have happened on any track in any country once another rider decides to overstep the mark of hard riding to down right dirty, dangerous and disgusting.' So speaks Jon Cook in his programme notes. Lucifer Sam, Jeff and the couple of others who think Gollob did nothing wrong still fail to realise that what he did is simply a total no-no in speedway.

There is no point Steve. Lucifer Sam and Jeff know more about speedway than World Champion Sam Ermolenko, Multi Longtrack World Champion Kelvin Tatum, and International rider Lee Richardson all who deemed the move as dangerous.

It is his prerogative to make such a move, but not when it impedes another rider which this did. You seem to be saying that it is ok if you are slightly in front to change lines and knock off whoever happens to be near you? I think current and ex-riders are better judges than Tony Steele. What has a Wolverhampton fan got to do with the argument? If anything, the fact I am a Wolverhampton fan should make me biased against Jonsson!!! Every post you make seems to a: unwittingly point towards Gollob's guilt and b: Include highly petty little insults, of which there are no call for.

Yes you did, and I have accepted it. Gollob made an earlier than usual turn to stop AJ. Fine, if there is room to do it. There wasn't.

Very true, most fans have not got a clue. However, most riders have hence their disapproval of Gollobs move. You have even spelt out who was at fault above! You said 'Quite simply Gollob, believing the attack was coming down the insibe made an earlier than normal turn to stop AJs run. ' That is what caused the crash, so therefore Gollob was at fault. Left turning early is highly dangerous if there is another rider in close proximity. There would be absolute carnage if this was done on a regular basis.

Why??

Again and again and again. Tatums knowledge of the rules is irrelevant. What he does have very good knowledge of is, what is safe and not safe to do on a speedway bike. As do Ermolenko and Richardson. Its time to draw the debate to a close. You are perfectly happy with riders wiping others out. That is fine, 95% of the rest of the world are not.

:) Once more the best you can do is talk about things that have nothing to do with the debate. Try making a post without throwing churlish insults into it regarding commentators. Or is this now the basis of your argument? Pearson thought Lindgren won the GP so therefore Gollob did nothing wrong. oh dear... Glad to see that you are changing your version though as you continue to dig. First of all you claimed Gollob was 'changing' his line and was somehow entitled to do so. When pointed out that if by changing ones line you knock somebody off it is in fact dangerous your only response was that AJ was not a good enough rider to avoid it! Its a new in speedway to me, having to avoid being knocked off down the straight! Now you claim Gollob was beginning his turn.. Again, as has been pointed out, you don't begin your turn before the start finish/line! Also interesting that he did not begin to turn that early in his other rides either. Also interestng to note that after his intial swerve/turn Gollob then straightened, before turning into the corner at the NORMAL place.

Lucifer Sam has failed to provide one reason to justify AJ's exclusion. It is a show of extreme desperation, and somewhat disparatory to resort to saying that AJ is not a good enough rider to avoid a crash! There is no rider in the world that could do anything about another rider swerving across their path and taking out their front wheel.

I didn't admit it, I was merely mocking your suggestion that a rider is allowed to swerve into another rider if he is half a bike length ahead! There is nothing in the rules that says anything about the 'rider in front can choose his line'. This is just a myth. The fact is, anyone chan choose to change lines, WHEN IT IS SAFE TO DO SO. On this occasion it was not.

He is entitled to change his line when it is safe to do so! He changed his line and collected somebody as a result. THAT IS THE FACT. And now you are getting very petty with your argument. Jonsson is expected to react in an instant when someone crazily swerves across him on the straight! The more you talk, the bigger hole you dig for your argument. Your version is the guy in front can swerve around all he likes, anybody alongside him had better just get out of the way or be mown down. If you're mown down, its your fault. Gollob miscalculated. He thought he was clear of Jonsson and was not.

Ok.. so now we have established, as agreed by you, that Gollob was the one who changed his line. Hence Gollob caused the crash!

Thankyou for finally pointing out that Gollob 'started to turn'. You don't start to turn at Monmore Green BEFORE the start finish line, never mind a 400 metre plus circuit! No twisting of facts needed.

Again you are talking about rules, which is nothing to do with the discussion. Big deal, you claim you spoke to a rider. I spoke to two.. what does that prove? Nothing, neither us even know if its true. What we do know is the opinion of 3 experienced riders opinions who all say the same thing. It was dangerous. I think they will know what is and isn't dangerous IN A RACE. Rules etc? Completely different topic. Please, just try and justify how Gollob swerving left across the start/finish line and collecting Jonsson can be deemed as doing 'nothing wrong'.

Did he clean someone out on the straight when he passed Pedersen? No he didn't. Facts are, Gollob turned left, Gollob wiped out Jonsson. End of! And as for your attempt to suggest that Tatum, Richardson and Ermolenko do not know what is dangerous, and what is not when riding a bike. Well, quite frankly, to suggest you know better is pathetic. It has nothing to do with who won and didn't win a GP. Gollobs move was akin to driving on a motorway on the outside lane, and then swerving into the middle lane, only to clip the front of a car there and send him spinning. Whose fault is it? By your reckoning its the guy in the middle lane..

Dear god, I despair sometimes with people. You have been watching speedway for all these years and yet you still do not appreciate what is a dangerous move. Jonsson did not change his line. Gollob turned left on the straight, which I repeat is a big NO NO and collected him. 3 riders all agreed that it was a dangerous move (Tatum, Ermolenko, Richardson). However, you, with all your years of experience riding a bike think different. I've since spoken to two other riders (one current, one ex) and they also agree Gollob was completely at fault.

You know absolutely nothing about speedway then. One of THE biggest no-no's in speedway is turning left on a rider on the straight. Its one of the most dangerous moves you can do and it invariabley ends in carnage, as in this GP. You will not find one rider who would condone such a move. Whether he looked or not is irrelevant. In fact, if he hadn't of known he was there, he wouldn't have been going left at that point of the straight in the first place. Disgraceful, dangerous move. Should have been excluded.

Seb the Snail. You really don't get it do you. HOWE IS THE THIRD HIGHEST AVERAGING BRIT. That is an average earned on ALL the tracks. Therefore his wildcard position is ENTIRELY justified as he is the best rider on form to take it.

Another idiot. Howe IS the 3rd best brit. Averages do NOT lie.

Shovlar, Howe beat Kennett in the qualifying, when KENNETT was on the inside. Once again, you are talking utter rubbish. As has been pointed out. Howe is the THIRD highest averaging British rider, so therefore, regardless of tonights meeting he is the deserving rider for the wildcard spot. END OF STORY. And Congratulations to Chris Harris. Excellent performance tonight and a great gate in the final.

If you're concerned about seats at Sams meeting, you can purchase tickets in the restaraunt online on the website.

SCB.. read what I said.. he is a much better gater now than he USED to be. We've, luckily, had 16 years of watching PK carve his way through the field! 1996 was his best year for this, he would miss the gate at Monmore 80% of the time yet finished the season average 10.5

PK is a much better gater than he used to be SCB, but he has never been a brilliant starter, far from it. Especially at home! In his race with Piper, I honestly think he was playing to the crowd in that one. He could have gone past him a lot sooner than he did. Not taking anything away from Piper at all who I thought rode intelligently all night.

Thats rubbish. It doesn't matter what age you are, if you are still one of the top riders in the world. This is the problem with the GP and why it is not a 'true' World Championship. PK is a better rider than at least HALF of the field in this years championship.

Is Todd the captain of your team? If so, that is his job. Remind me, was Tony captain? No I don't think so, so all your blubber about it being 'what was expected' is obviously not correct.