mikebv
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Posts posted by mikebv
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Heat leaders plus 4 to 5 for fhe Aces...
The rest, plus 10 to 12 for the Witches...
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2 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:
I don’t know the percentage that is paid but as I said you do also get revenue from all over the world which are never going to set foot in the stadium and to be honest I don’t think showing on BSN makes a that much of a difference to the attendance because you have to pay either way, I think it did on Eurosport because it was free, be interesting to see the crowd at belle vue this Monday because from what I’m told last Monday v kings Lynn it was very poor and this week v Ipswich it’s on BSN, will it be bigger crowd or smaller ?
Me and my lad will be there weather, (and rider availability permitting), so that is at least two more than last week...
I don't have BSN simply because with Poland, Sweden, SEC, GP and domestic UK Speedway on TNT, all available to be watched, that is "quite enough"....
By Monday I usually have "Speedway fatigue", especially as I am now retired, so I can watch Saturday's Polish meetings as well...
Even Sweden on Tuesday can often be missed, (until the play offs)..
UK Speedway hasn't moved forward one iota with the decades of regular national TV coverage since Sky started showing it, so maybe it's time to ditch it?
Sponsors, however, may be impacted though and they do seem to be the "lifeblood" of many tracks looking at attendance numbers, so maybe the TV coverage is actally keeping some going?
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13 hours ago, Cue Ball said:
Wait for it…
The end is nigh. We’re doomed. Sack everybody and replace them with somebody else who I won’t name because I can’t think of anybody is any better, but that’s not the point…
Fair play to Leicester, deserved winners on the night and could have been a bigger margin if not for mechanical gremlins. We just started off too slowly and never really looked like winning.
When was the last time we were 12 points down at home?
And thank you to BSN for wishing my dad a happy birthday at the end 👍If the promotion was serious they would drop Sedgmen, Kerr and Rowe, and bring in BZ, Laguta and Lebedevs...
Need to be ruthless, there are riders out there, etc etc etc...
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1 hour ago, bellevueace said:
Do you think what BSN pay out to the clubs cover the loss of revenue due to less footfall into the stadium, i would think many families 2 adults + 2 children would make a good saving watching at home? It would be interesting to see how much tv and streaming costs clubs on race day.
It is a balancing act isn't it?
If the weather is dodgy then last minute decision streaming means clubs get some money that they wouldn't if that person had stayed indoors..
On the other hand, if you have paid for a BSN package then you are probably more than likely to use that instead of, rather than attending in person, especially given the oultay and the current economic situation..
In house streaming costs the club to produce, but BSN doesnt, and actually provides income..
TNT definitely impacts attendances, but, they again pay for their coverage, and, let's be honest, clubs do very little to promote the TV meetings in a stand alone capacity, so they must be content with the situation..
Speedway is truly one of the very, very few sports that hasn't seen growth, or major sponsorship, via regular, sustained TV coverage over the past 30 years...
Which suggests the issue lies much closer to home than any TV coverage dissuading people to attend..
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3 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:
2020 was the year speedway should of used to rebrand, rebuild and forge a game plan going forward but it didn’t
I am still truly amazed they didn't...
It was a complete free hit to reset the sport and relaunch it...
Nobody even lost money as they were shut, so what an opportunity to spend some of that cash on some proper relaunch marketing...
That they came back with the "same old, same old", you can only assume they felt nothing needed to change...
Which, if correct, is also truly amazing...
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Let's do some numbers...
For two GP riders it must be (based on info from a few years ago), a minimum, circa £3k a night...
With two, it is £6k...
So, £12k needed in sponsorship and attendance, (and it may be more), from your home meeting to pay them for the next away meeting too..
And, if rumours are true, for some, £3k is on the lower end of the scale...
Taking BV as an example, if you removed Brady and Dan next year, and ran with five rider teams, (the same lads as now), then that would be a huge saving...
10 meetings @ £12k is massive...
You could bank £6k a night from the current outlay, and use the other £6k in knocking six quid off 1000 tickets which might entice those less regulars, or even those who stopped going, to get to the NSS..
Watching the Polish top tier stars is truly a different level, but, the brutal truth is they don't "pack em in" enough to justify the outlay, and, beyond them, you still have the Mickey Mouse aspect that dilutes what their incredible talents deliver.
Good to read that Chris Louis is involved in the future plan. And intelligent fella, and one of the very few that seems to grasp what is needed.....
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3 hours ago, ShanoXtra said:
This forum is dammed if you do and dammed if you dont, it’s funny really. Now it’s all about how expensive the tickets are, when I suggested a few months ago to reduce the cost to get more people in the stadium the reaction was “you won’t get more people because it’s all about the poor promotion”. Again, if people haven’t got something to moan about they aren’t happy, look at the comments on here when even a SGP is on, still people moan about boring racing, maybe change your sport would be my suggestion.
Ipswich town tickets were about £40+ a pop last season and they couldn’t get a win at home for love nor money. People still packed the stadium every week though. The football wasn’t good, but people still supported. I don’t believe it’s just down to money, it’s a factor yes, but not solely money. People pay for many other sports without a problem, it’s more the product with the guesting, no loyalty with the riders, no jeopardy in the league, other stuff like that.
Ipswich Town was full as it is (was), a novelty value of seeing truly some of the worlds best players after so long...
And relegation was a shoe in from an early part of the season so why not still go and watch world class players? Even if they are on the other team..
And £40 is "good" for the Premier League...
The GP and Polish Top League riders generated initial uplift in crowds, but then the "novelty" wore off, (as predicted), and now unfortunately could become surplus to requirements..
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43 minutes ago, Teromaafan said:
Your attire is as good as promoting the sport gets in this country. Fair play. I’ll be wearing a black tee shirt emblazoned with RON MAIDEN on the front. I tell people that he’s the uncle of Steve Harris, but truth is, the letter ‘I’ recently came off on the transfer in the last wash.
You could wear it in the pits helping out a rider...
I have seen arse crack on TV and a "V n Hal n"
T shirt being worn..
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2 minutes ago, ouch said:
I’m not buying the 15 minutes of entertainment thing as there is plenty going on to keep me happy.
Don’t let guests or RR keep you from Belle Vue. We’ve not used them at home this year and hardly used them last year. Usage is on a par with the last five decades.
One off events alway generate more interest and cannot to compared to weekly or bi weekly events when comparing attendance.
With regards Birmingham’s attendance, enough people know when the speedway is on, it’s just they choose not to attend because they don’t like it.
This year has seen a decline in attendance at the NSS due to the high profile events pulling focus and the mentioned squeeze on people’s leisure dollar. With the changes mooted I can see this continuing. People will attend, PCMT, Dan’s testimonial, British Final, GP & play offs plus most BH fixtures. The rest will have a few hundred diehards. Aside from junior or amateur stuff I see the sport becoming a BH thrill treat in the not too distant future. IMO it’s gone too far to turn round. It might over many many years build back up but my own thoughts are it’s done in terms of being the sport we all remember.
Agree on every point apart from the 15 mins of entertainment...
There is zero to keep me entertained during the gaps between racing..
1970's music? Really?
I attended an indoors MX event in MCR ten years ago and every Speedway promoter should have gone to it...
The on track action was only a part of the evening..
You could win a mini MX bike, (just £5 a text), and 1000's of dads texted in. (Me being one)..
They fired, via air gun, t shirts (all small so kids got them), into the crowd, and my lad got one...
Each rider had a merch stall, with shirts, photos, selfies etc..
And Monster Energy Girls... (Ahem)...
The guy in the middle kept the evening flowing, the music reflected the hi octane, adrenaline fuelled sport...
And I didn't have a clue who anyone was but paid seventy quid for me and my then 12 year old lad...
And it was worth every penny..
Some on here say that the gaps between races is a chance to talk with those they stand with and haven't seen since the last meeting, which is fine..
But what do those attending for the first time do? Twiddle their thumbs?
A high octane, adrenaline fuelled sport should have an off track package that reflects it...
UK Speedway's off track entertainment is truly dire...
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2 minutes ago, Pinny said:
Would the fact that present day Guns n Roses sound absolutely terrible have something to do with it?
Seen them live in the MCG here in Melbourne a few years ago and left half way through they were that bad.
His voice wasn't "great" last time I saw him...
Mind you...
His face wasn't either....
I looked more like him than he did....
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2 minutes ago, IainB said:
I was there too! Yes it was expensive but it was 3 hours 10 minutes of non- stop entertainment. I'm going to see Maiden on Saturday at the Olympic stadium, again around the £100 mark but again it'll be around 2 hours of non stop entertainment... although they are operating drummer replacement lol
Is Bomber singing insted of Bruce?
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Just now, THE DEAN MACHINE said:
We know all this but it’s more than speedway itself now,the country is going broke, at this point unless the finance is changed nothing else will make a difference
100℅ agree...
Charging me over £70, for 15 minutes entertainment, to watch a competition where it really doesn't matter who wins it, and providing competitors with 12 months money, for less than six months work...
In front of circa 1000 fans...
Will never work...
My lad plays semi pro football and plays in front of four figure crowds, which UK Speedway would kill for, but none of them has to spend £20k on their kit, and, therefore, none of them, expect to not have to work six months of the year on the money they get paid...
The UK Operating model is simply not for fit purpose, and has been so for decades...
It sounds like someone has finally realised that..
Unfortunately those who have suddenly realised this have also been running the sport for the past decades...
Not holding out any hope...
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3 minutes ago, ShanoXtra said:
We now have some of the best riders in the world finally on British shores. Yet people still would rather “pick and choose” their meetings and not support the sport.
There is no excuse. People on the forum need to actually start attending matches and helping the sport out inside of constantly moaning about this and that. Latest I heard was most matches are “qualifiers” for the play offs. That’s an embarrassing reason to not attend. Polish fans could think the same around this time of the season but they love the sport and just go to watch races. Too much negatively on this forum. Turn your phone off on a Monday or Thursday night and actually go out and watch some speedway instead of just chatting BS. Belle Vue have two of the best riders currently in the world but still can’t be bothered to attend until September as they always state… why?
A Mickey Mouse Sporting League..
Four guests and RR?
Not a problem, please take it seriously like we do, and form an orderly queue...
Swapping two guest riders (so they ride for both teams) in the middle of a play off final ?
Not a problem, please take it seriously like we do, and form an orderly queue..
Bomber helping Ipswich knock BV out in the semis, and then representing Sheffield to beat Ipswich in the final?
Not a problem, please take it seriously like we do, and form an orderly queue...
First v Fourth in the play offs? (Unless of course commercially it is better to change the rules?)
Not a problem, please take it seriously like we do, and form an orderly queue..
Adam Eliis and MJJ only agreeing to ride for the first few weeks of the season, and their club, and the umbrella organisation, not informing the fanbase? (And then making them out to be the bad guys, even though all on here knew the reality)..
Not a problem, please take it seriously like we do, and form an orderly queue..
For me, the wife, and my lad, it is over £70 to attend...
Come on UK Speedway, treat us with a modicum of respect as to what you serve up.,.
And, who knows, we may attend more...
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35 minutes ago, Pinny said:
What I think everyone needs to grasp is that speedway is just not a trendy sport and there is no younger generation of fans flocking through the gates anymore. Its 99.9 percent surviving on the old guard.
Ok, there will be one or two clubs who are making a decent profit from good crowds but they are very much in the minority.
The amount of clubs that have closed in the last few decades speaks volumes.
The sport in the UK has been wrecked by lazy promoters who wont drag the club they promote into the 21st century, scruffy stadiums, ridiculous rule changes by the governing body and riders taking the complete urine. Thats just a couple of major problems, the list is endless.
I have said it for years now, the only way out of this is to completely re format British Speedway and change the league structure. Two leagues sharing the same riders with riders missing every meeting just don't work.
Glaringly obvious for years...
When emergency surgery has been needed for decades, we had sticking plaster, after sticking plaster...
Tens of thousands more still follow the sport than feel attending each week is worthwhile...
Just get them back onside by listening to them, and delivering a great night out for twenty plus quid..
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45 minutes ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:
As much as speedway is its own demise, the current worrying trend in attendances is in part down to the financial crisis currently hitting the world, people are starting to feel the pinch and are picking and choosing what they attend, it’s not just speedway it’s everywhere,every entertainment business, I think it has finally registered at BSPL towers and I’m led to believe that a huge shake up for the sport is happening this winter, it’s very hush hush at the moment but let’s hope it’s just not a new helmet colour
A purple one if history is a guide...
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1 hour ago, bluejam said:
Thanks for your input H Man(you're one of the good guys connected with Brum).
Could you tell us why Birmingham Speedway have been on a downward spiral since LR got involved?
600 to (on a good night), 800, was never going to sustain a competitive team in Div 1..
And, before some come on and say previous promotions did it, they didn't have to lay out big money to expensive top riders as very few rode over here for several of those seasons..
And they also often were in the lower leagues that crowds of 600 to 800 could be coped with...
They simply should have been allowed to ride Mondays in Div 2...
If that meant a few "guesfests" then so be it, (what's several more added to the overall total?)....
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9 minutes ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:
Covid 🙄Was thinking of coming to this but instead I will spend my hard earned money going to see the loch ness monster, funny enough that doesn’t exist either, at which point does British speedway start treating its customers with a bit of respect
Why change the habits of a lifetime?
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1 minute ago, bellevueace said:
During the boom years of the seventies no investment into the sport was made and so began the slow downward spiral that has led to the current situation.
And the Sky money was over a million a year...
For, was it 20 years?
Some top names got to retire from the UK off the back off that...
Before earning shed loads more in Poland...
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3 minutes ago, bellevueace said:
Its sad to see another club disappear and fair play to Tolley for giving it a go and putting his money in but crowd levels have shown there is no appetite for speedway in Birmingham, crazy to think how many clubs have been lost just in London and the West Midlands alone.
With the same old, same old, operating model being used..
I suppose if it was good enough for the 70's it is good enough for now, over fifty years later...
An amazing concept....
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1 hour ago, ShanoXtra said:
Although we did damage to BV in the cup this will be a different meeting completely, I expect BV to put up more of a match now being in the season and with Kurtz / Bewley slightly injured still and also Doyle / King / Thompson / Jenkins not 100% either I think it’ll be the battle of grit and determination mixed with endurance! Should be a good one though, at least BV track isn’t as harsh to ride as others whilst injured so both sets of riders should make it through OK.
Top three v Top three (at the NSS), the Aces shade by maybe four...
Bottom four v Bottom four (anywhere), the Witches are considerably better, (12 points at least I would suggest)...
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Just now, Sir Sidney said:
I suppose the other side to that is how many fewer will turn up to watch and how much revenue is lost as a result. I guess Nigel Tolley has done the calculations
Those who still attend are pretty much "lifers" and will mainly turn up every meeting...
And, with the end of the Brummies, maybe a few more of those who have drifted away from the early Tony Mole days will attend...?
Plus, a few more away fans on a "last chance to see" mission could add a few dozen to the total..
I think he has probably spent enough over the years, so fair play to him for not spending more...
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10 minutes ago, TTT said:
Don't blame Tolley for cutting costs with the amount of money he's put in.
Season's over for Birmingham anyway and the fans wouldn't even turn up even if they got an Ekstraliga rider in imo.
.And require about an extra £5k to £6k outlay to pay for the home and away matches.
Even for an "average" Polish top tier rider...
Who would put hardly one extra person through the turnstile...
That is the reality, hence no point in chucking good money after bad..
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8 minutes ago, Pinny said:
Steve brum should refresh his memory by reading this glowing report of himself in his local newspaper.
how he has the nerve to criticise any rider for missing a meeting after reading that lot is beyond me.
scumbag of the highest order, poncing the taxpayers money like that.
Maybe Wroclaw had paid for his physio...?
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57 minutes ago, YeOldPitGate said:
Only way I can see things surviving is with five man teams of championship standard maybe 8-10 clubs in the new top league. All the top boys would have to depart as we can't afford them and ideally you would need riders who would be committed to being in Britain for 90% of the time needed.
The rot set in during the late 80's and we have limped through to the current last knockings the question is even with five man teams will you find enough riders for UK at Championship standard.
We can't carry on as we are and that decision looks like it will be forced onto promoters by events next year even those who want the current status quo to continue will have to accept it. You have the riders dictating the racing nights and thus end up with teams running on Mondays which is probably the least most attractive night of the week for your average punter.
Going to be an interesting winter that's for sure.
Many years of burying collective heads in the sand, and not listening to those who have drifted away, but still closely follow the sport, has delivered what we have today...
Not sure those who have put the sport currently where it sits, are in anyway capable of sorting it out to be honest.
The issues, and their obvious solutions, have been staring them in the face for two decades at least, and they have steadfastly ignored them...
What will suddenly make them capable now of having a clear vision for the growth of the sport?
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Extraleague Round 12 Fri/Sun 18th/20th July
in International World of Speedway
Posted · Edited by mikebv
Dead rubbers ..
So picking and choosing...
Packed for Wroclaw and Torun I would think...
And the play offs...
A similar pattern to over here...
But obviously they start with many thousands more so less impact financially.
Hopefully a cracker coming up...
@ShanoXtra give us a wave..😁