Hector Austin 51 Posted April 29, 2015 Stoke already in dissary man! another defeat at a weakenend Brum tonite pal. Need to get da winning formiula Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Falcon Hammer 576 Posted April 29, 2015 Apart from the fact that it was too dry and slick Little bit, but some great races by Luke Chessell, Shaun Tedham, Tom Perry & Danyon Hume. Main thing was the track was not rutty & no soft parts, like previous. I enjoyed it anyhow Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TMW 533 Posted April 30, 2015 Stoke already in dissary man! another defeat at a weakenend Brum tonite pal. Need to get da winning formiula I thought that but when you think about it. Long tail but Perry & Ellis in hts 13 & 15, which by enlarge they will probably win, it's leaving a lot to chance in hts 12 & 14 to actually get ahead Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teddy2706 166 Posted April 30, 2015 (edited) Welcome to thread Oldsparky - and thanks for getting straight to the crux of the matter with your pertinent comments! You are, of course, spot on and crowd numbers at Loomer Road had been dwindling in the couple of PL seasons prior to the move into the National League (though that move did prompt a significantly larger immediate exodus). Though I would question whether this was really the reason that the team taken down into the NL ... I know it is the reason that Dave Tattum gave for taking the team into the NL (as part of the "5-year plan"), but I never believed it personally. My own view is that he took the easy option to address the falling profitability of his business. His decision to move into NL meant that he could significantly cut his costs with regard to riders' pay and by not significantly reducing the cost to attend he could then benefit financially. The better - and in my opinion - correct option would have been to address the many promotional shortcomings (a number of which you mentioned in your post) and improve the product on offer to the paying public, but that would obviously have taken more effort. I can't take issue with any of the criticisms of the promotion that you list in your post, because you are quite simply right! And I know only too well that you could have added many more examples to the list! I also know that even if Dave Tattum were to take the team back into the PL next season (though I don't expect he will) then there will be a good number of exiles who would still not return. Personally, I would, because I promised that on the Stoke forum at the time and I would be true to my word. However, if Stoke are to ever return to the Premier League and if increased numbers of spectators are to be attracted through the gates, then I suspect it will take a change of promoter to achieve it. Sadly, many of the Stoke Exiles are lost to speedway completely, an unforseen casualty to the sport resulting from dis-satisfaction with the Stoke product. Stoke fans weren't wonderful at away support, that philosophy ensures that those same Stoke fans are not attending any other tracks. Edited April 30, 2015 by oldsparky Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
griffo 20 Posted April 30, 2015 An awful lot of sense spoken there. Is there still that hole coming into bend three?. One of the top tracks abroad was designed on the shape of Stoke I think and when correctly prepared it is a great race track. I remember Tom Owen and Tony Lomas riding it like they were in an armchair. you are right in your assumption that one of the tracks in Europe was designed on the exact Ground plans as Loomer Road it was the one built by Ole Olsen at Vojens In 1974 I was Stadium Manager at Stoke and I was in the office at when Russ Bragg the Owner gave Ole the plans for Stoke as Ole and Mauger both thought it was the best laid out Track and many people over the years have made the same comment Cheers Griffo 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stoke Potter 242 Posted April 30, 2015 Little bit, but some great races by Luke Chessell, Shaun Tedham, Tom Perry & Danyon Hume. Main thing was the track was not rutty & no soft parts, like previous. I enjoyed it anyhow I agree, some good races. If they got some decent watering equipment it would be better still. you are right in your assumption that one of the tracks in Europe was designed on the exact Ground plans as Loomer Road it was the one built by Ole Olsen at Vojens In 1974 I was Stadium Manager at Stoke and I was in the office at when Russ Bragg the Owner gave Ole the plans for Stoke as Ole and Mauger both thought it was the best laid out Track and many people over the years have made the same comment Cheers Griffo Do you still have a copy of those plans Griffo? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheCookster 57 Posted May 1, 2015 Sadly, many of the Stoke Exiles are lost to speedway completely, an unforseen casualty to the sport resulting from dis-satisfaction with the Stoke product. Stoke fans weren't wonderful at away support, that philosophy ensures that those same Stoke fans are not attending any other tracks. Perhaps it needs a consortium of supporters to buy out the current promotion and take the club forward themselves. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teddy2706 166 Posted May 1, 2015 Perhaps it needs a consortium of supporters to buy out the current promotion and take the club forward themselves. Perhaps it does, you are not alone in this thought. Others have wondered about a 51% stakeholding similar to the Bundesliga. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stoke Potter 242 Posted May 1, 2015 Unfortunately it's impossible to buy something that isn't for sale. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheCookster 57 Posted May 1, 2015 Unfortunately it's impossible to buy something that isn't for sale. Most things are for sale if the price is right. There was certainly some talk about five years ago that Dave Tattum was open to approaches and there was a figure being bandied around that he would supposedly be prepared to accept. However, that was based around a complete buy-out of the promotion rights rather than just a majority share. I am not sure whether that would hold the same appeal to him. Since that time Malcolm Vasey has also bought into the club as co-promoter, so that would need to be factored into the equation too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vog 200 Posted May 1, 2015 Most things are for sale if the price is right. There was certainly some talk about five years ago that Dave Tattum was open to approaches and there was a figure being bandied around that he would supposedly be prepared to accept. However, that was based around a complete buy-out of the promotion rights rather than just a majority share. I am not sure whether that would hold the same appeal to him. Since that time Malcolm Vasey has also bought into the club as co-promoter, so that would need to be factored into the equation too. Malcolm, as far as I know, hasn't bought in to the club. Last time I checked the records at companies house (Which was about a year ago) there were still only 2 shares sold, with the assumption being they are to Dave and Caroline. Frankly, Stoke is never going to progress. It's often mooted that there is a requirement that for Dave and Caroline to continue to use the stadium, speedway has to run. They run Speedway as cheaply as possible (To try and cover the costs) and skim the money from the Stock cars. Stock cars put money in to keep the stadium up to some form of habitable level, and the bar takings soar on those nights. 5 year plan, 10 year plan, 100 year plan, it makes no difference. The owners will never sell, Stoke will never get any better, and they will stay NL because it is cheaper. Such a shame, but something that won't ever change. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stoke Potter 242 Posted May 1, 2015 It's often mooted that there is a requirement that for Dave and Caroline to continue to use the stadium, speedway has to run. I have heard that but I don't understand the logic of it, why would the Corbetts put such a restriction in place? I think it's a myth. There are also other revenue streams in addition to the stocks, i.e. ambulance storage and road building equipment storage, to name but two. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheCookster 57 Posted May 1, 2015 Malcolm, as far as I know, hasn't bought in to the club. Last time I checked the records at companies house (Which was about a year ago) there were still only 2 shares sold, with the assumption being they are to Dave and Caroline. Frankly, Stoke is never going to progress. It's often mooted that there is a requirement that for Dave and Caroline to continue to use the stadium, speedway has to run. They run Speedway as cheaply as possible (To try and cover the costs) and skim the money from the Stock cars. Stock cars put money in to keep the stadium up to some form of habitable level, and the bar takings soar on those nights. 5 year plan, 10 year plan, 100 year plan, it makes no difference. The owners will never sell, Stoke will never get any better, and they will stay NL because it is cheaper. Such a shame, but something that won't ever change. I don't know for a fact whether Malcolm has bought into the promotion or not. However, my assumption was that there would be some form of formal agreement, otherwise why would he be listed as 'co-promoter' rather than just 'manager'? Malcolm wouldn't necessarily have had to buy into Dave and Caroline's business to do that (which would explain why it wouldn't show up in that company's records at Companies House). It could be done along the lines of a form of joint venture, such as you often see in the television and film industries, where two or more production companies co-operate to fund and promote a programme or film. I suspect that Stoke will probably stay in the NL as long as the Tattums are involved, as you say Vog, but I am too positive by nature to simply accept that nothing will ever change ... there just needs to be the right catalyst for change! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
griffo 20 Posted May 1, 2015 I agree, some good races. If they got some decent watering equipment it would be better still. Do you still have a copy of those plans Griffo? Sorry Matey Ole took them with him 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TMW 533 Posted May 1, 2015 (edited) I don't know for a fact whether Malcolm has bought into the promotion or not. However, my assumption was that there would be some form of formal agreement, otherwise why would he be listed as 'co-promoter' rather than just 'manager'? Malcolm wouldn't necessarily have had to buy into Dave and Caroline's business to do that (which would explain why it wouldn't show up in that company's records at Companies House). It could be done along the lines of a form of joint venture, such as you often see in the television and film industries, where two or more production companies co-operate to fund and promote a programme or film. I suspect that Stoke will probably stay in the NL as long as the Tattums are involved, as you say Vog, but I am too positive by nature to simply accept that nothing will ever change ... there just needs to be the right catalyst for change! According to BSPA regs you have to have a co-promoter. I know of a few who are unlikely to have invested money Edited May 1, 2015 by TMW Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
