Vincent Blachshadow

For me, Hancock and Hamill. Many a heat 13 and heat 15 5-1. What I didn't like was the same pair in a few heat 8 double-tacs. Seeing two of the World's finest outpacing the visiting #2 and #7 just because the visitors had had the audacity to lead by 7 or 8 points by heat 8.

Has any work at all started on this scheme, the whole redevelopment I mean, not just the speedway part of it? As in old buildings demolished, sods lifted, land levelled, bricks laid, metalwork erected, not planning.

I'd say Peterborough Panthers still have the assets, which is why Ms Mahoney came aboard as co-promoter. Certainly, some EL promoters were rubbing their hands at the prospect of freebie riders when Rick stood down although that may not have been the case anyway since we don't know the terms of the deal Mick Horton has. But on hearing an existing co-promoter was staying on those hands stopped rubbing.

I remember it being posted on here that doubling-up riders didn't need to be contracted to the club they were doubling-up with (I believe it was in the Kildemand to Poole, or not - thread). That being the case, priority should lie with the team they do actually have a contract with which would be the PL team.

That may be the case. I'm asking for a logical reason why a rider can gain free entry at a track he is not riding at and does not ride for and why TWK thinks it's right for ex-riders to have that privilege too?

Why? Are ex-professional footballers allowed free entry into any ground they wish to go to? Ex-riders of the particular club may have a case, but not ALL riders and ex-riders.

Of course they would. If signing for an EL team meant they couldn't ride in the PL they'd have to ride EL only and get by on three or four points a match. How many EL riders are in their formative years in the sport? The reason they sign EL at the outset is because they will be loaned out to PL clubs until they become good enough to step up. If that is taken away from them they'd sign at the lower level and wait for an EL team to sign them. If none does, they will still make a living as PL riders. Where will the rider signing EL but not good enough for the top level ride? EL teams would have to buy these riders once they become good enough to ride at the top level ONLY and even then they may decide to stay at PL level - less money per point but more than likely more points scored.Remember, this is only if they can't ride in both leagues.

No it wouldn't. If the riders could ride only EL or PL most riders coming into the sport would sign for PL clubs.

It was just after that he decided Peterborough wasn't for him wasn't it? Just before his 12th meeting. Came back with Poole a couple of years later though, didn't he?

You mentioned history, I just answered the post.

Now there's a thing - I've been led to believe you're the one with history.

Is that your way of saying there isn't one? Unlike you, I can be arsed. I've looked at the SCB page and they're still running on 2013 rules. The BSPA site tells us nothing. The only reference I can see mentions they'll be protected in 'programmed rides' but doesn't mention injuries higher up the order or R/R. So, is there anywhere telling us about these alternatives or is it still merely a work in progress?

Link please

OK, so it's been said that reserves won't ride against the top liners. Has it been said R/R and replacing injured riders rules have changed (which they must have done to stop #6 and #7 riders facing #1s). If so, apologies, but I haven't found it yet and I'd be grateful for a link please.

Having been away some time minus a lap-top and not bothering with internet cafes, I haven't read every thread on this forum so, instead of shouting reserves won't ride against the top guys how about saying 'this won't happen because this IS happening' rather then 'it won't happen because this ISN'T happening'. Reserves have taken the rides of injured riders in the past so presumably this is no longer the case and an alternative rule has come in to cover R/R for the third fourth and fifth average riders.

Quite. They'll race each other, something like heat 2, heat 8 and heat 12 with races in other heats when necessary. Sort of Elite 'development' heats but with the points counting towards an Elite League match. They'll get extra rides, of course, when needed in usual reserve fashion then we'll get the farce you talk about - Darcy Ward v Josh Bates. Course, the occasions of an EL heat leader v NL rider could be reduced if they adopt the sensible move of replacing a rider injured in an incident for which an opponent is discluded by another top-five rider as per R/R.

Some time in the future, after several ambition-lacking years, somebody might come along offering riders free or on the cheap, a bigger cut of sponsorship money and indemnity against losses for two or three years just after the management has said that PL is the way to go and entering the PL KO Cup for the following season. You never know.

This is similar to our speedway isn't it? You know, total misnomers. The Elite League isn't because it hasn't got the 'Elite' any more. The Premier League can't be because it isn't 'premier' (first in position, order, etc) . It's just a name. It's a replacement competition to find Europe's top club, as it always has been, and one that always ended with a one-off final. It's just the qualifying process that's altered and, with so many teams now entering a mini league competition is necessary, followed by a knock-out stage culminating in that old, traditional one-off final.

True, but a one-off final should be something similar to a club's fans, shouldn't it? It certainly is for football.

Cardiff. If you make it worth it, they will come.

Mostly, yes. Although, if you give them a sufficiently good product they will turn out in their thousands to watch it, even at a neutral venue. But the product has to be good enough and worth it.

We've got Halifaxtiger posting that diehards should attend come what may, and we've got orion asking T W K why he goes if he doesn't like the rules. Not exactly working together - are they both on the BSPA?

Why's that? It sure works for football and both rugby codes. It's the one-off final the fans want to see - the big day out for many thousands of them.

Which is why I posted 'every other June and July'.

And call it 'The Craven Shield'. But we all know that calling the play-off winners anything other than 'EL Champions' would be/have been no interest to Sky and would devalue the four team competition in their eyes. So let's devalue the season-long league campaign instead.