Dave the Mic

How so? Laguna isn't prepared to do the qualifiers, MJJ couldn't beat the so called no hoper that is Chris Harris and Dudek didn't even compete. Tai was a completely different set of circumstances, having been in the series before and had come through some very testing times which slowed his progress. In the main, the champions have been the old guard in any case, with only Tai and Holder of the brigade winning titles, the likes of Hancock, Gollob, Pedersen and Crump having taken most of the titles in recent times. Tai has been the exception.

I am astounded at the vitriol poured over the riders on this thread, it's a disgrace to be honest. If any of you are brave enough to race the way these guys do, fill your boots and slag off their inclusion and criticise their ability. I'd be happy to have 10% of the ability of these guys, who, by the way, risk their lives to entertain us each time they throw a leg over a bike. Regarding the wild cards, feel free to extol the virtues of anyone else you care to name, including MJJ, Dudek, Jonasson, Laguta even, but a couple of decent performances on the world stage does not a GP rider make, ask Martin Vaculik. I rank none of them as my favourites, but Holder and Gollob pick themselves, AJ and Fred have been consistent performers on the world stage for some time and are worthy of their place in the series. Regarding the likes of MJJ and Jonasson, they had their chance to qualify, like others, and couldn't do so. That being so, how does it make them more deserving than the four picked? It doesn't. Regarding Harris, why can't you get off his case? It's fair to say he hasn't been deserving of the nominations for wild cards he has had, but he hasn't bought them, he was offered them and accepted them. In his position, I suspect any of you would do the same. Likewise in the GP challenge, although in that case, many of the riders that were next in line from the semi finals supposedly declined a place to race, Harris was offered the place and took it. So what? He then finished ahead of many of the riders who have been put forward on this forum as deserving of a place in the GP, and matched Smolinski. Surely, if they can't finish ahead of Harris, supposedly so poor according to many on this forum, how can they possibly be included in the series. You couldn't write it.

MP, the reason for the posting is partly as has been mentioned by 500cc. You mention Danno, but you could easily mention Nermark, Klingberg, Zorro, Tommy Nilsson and Erik Stenlund in the same vein, so why him? None were world class performers but all won the title. Nilsson rode in World Finals as a seed when the finals were in Sweden a couple of times, Kilngberg had a flirtation with the GP, Zorro had one season in a recent series, Nermark was a wildcard and Stenlund was a world ice champion, but never a star on shale. It doesn't make any of them less worthy of their win, does it? Fact is they were best on the day, as Szczakiel was in the 73 World Final. Regardless of what anyone else may think. Rickardsson may not have competed but look at who did - AJ, PK, Henka, Lindback, Lindgren, Mikael Max, Zorro, Stefan Andersson, to name a few. Danno took six rides and dropped a point. That makes him a worthy winner in my book, regardless of the track conditions or anything else. As 500cc says, just because he didn't figure in any other championship, doesn't mean his win was a freak, Loram was never in the top three of the worlds apart from his title in 2000, nor Havelock apart from his win in 92, but I witnessed every heat of both and believe me, they deserved their wins. As Danno did. In addition, you cite his and Nermarks league records as being comparable. That's as may be, but the Elite League in this country, for example, is ten fold weaker than it was when Danno rode and. For me, that makes Nermark's win more remarkable as Danno competed when speedway was arguably stronger with more top class riders around than there are today. I simply was trying to point out that his win was deserved and was ahead of many excellent riders and as 500cc says, given you were out of touch with speedway for a long period, that could easily have spanned Danno's entire career, so the point of posting the results and stating his GP and World Final exploits were to serve the point that he was a decent performer and his title win was not as much of a freak as you might have suggested.

SM-final. Hagfors 2/8. 1.Stefan Dannö Vals 3 2 3 3 3 3 2.Stefan Andersson LS 2 3 3 2 3.Mikael Max LS 3 2 2 1 4.Peter Karlsson Kap 3 0 2 2 0 5.Freddie Eriksson Rosp 2 1 2 1 2 2 1 6.Fredrik Lindgren Pir 3 2 1 7.Antonio Lindbäck Gas 3 3 1 3 3 0 8.Andreas Jonsson Rosp 2 1 3 U 9.Magnus Zetterström Smed 1 3 3 0 2 1 10.Peter Ljung LS 3 2 2 0 1 11.Robert Johansson Väst 2 0 1 1 3 0 12.Daniel Nermark Varg 0 2 2 2 1 F 13.Henrik Gustafsson Ind 3 3 S 1 14.Mattias Nilsson VMS 2 0 1 0 1 15.Björn Gustavsson VMS 1 3 3 1 F 16.Tobias Johansson LS 0 F 17.Peter I Karlsson Vals 2 1 0 18.Magnus Karlsson Kap 0 2 0 19.Jonas Davidsson Rosp 1 1 20.Emil Kramer Örn 0 1 21.Rickard Sedelius TB 1 0 Daniel Davidsson Smed ES Niklas Klingberg Mas ES Tony Rickardsson Mas ES A little harsh on Stefan Danno to be honest. Rode in the SGP for three years and finish third in two finals, ahead of such poor performers as Tony Rickardsson and Nicki Pedersen. He also raced in the last one off World Final in 1994. Twice the rider Nermark is, who, incidentally finished 12th in the meeting you refer to.

If it is Keith Anderson, then he raced for Birmingham in the old British League 2 in 1974 & then the New National League in 1975. He moved up with the Brummies when they moved into the top flight in 1976 & raced a handful of matches but didn't make it at that level & retired soon after I think.

Post of the decade. Fantastic.

That's gotta be post of the year so far. Had me crying. Excellent.

It would be interesting to hear some of Phil's thoughts concerning the County Ground @ Exeter. It is well known he was something of a master at the track - always went home with a hatful of points, no matter what the conditions, circumstances or what meeting it was. Thought it might be good to get an insight given so may riders loathing of the place & it's likely exit from the sport for good in the not too distant future.

My personal choice (as per the original topic), in no particular order, would be:- 1. Jason Crump - as World Champ he has to be in 2. Tony Rickardsson - consistently the best over the last 10 years 3. Tomasz Gollob - record at this level speaks for itself 4. Greg Hancock - see Tomasz Gollob 5. Nicki Pedersen - out & out racer & one of the best, regardless of ones personal view. 6. Scott Nicholls - still England's best bet for the title & still manged to look good although his season was ravaged by injury. 7. Lee Richardson - upwardly mobile & a good bet for regular rostrum places in the coming years 8. Leigh Adams - under achieved at this level, but still capable of winning the thing. 9. Andreas Jonsson - best of the new breed. 10. Hans Andersen - inconsistent, but that is likely to change with experience 11. Bjarne Pedersen - see Hans Andersen 12. Ryan Sullivan - deserves the benefit of the doubt for 2004. A class act however you look at it. 13. Jaroslaw Hampel - in the same mould as Jonsson 14. Antonio Lindback - I don't see how he could be left out. 15. Mark Loram - it would be nice to think this year was a blip. Still the most entertaining racer of the current era. 16. Billy Hamill - a great racer & should still grace this stage. It would be easy to argue a case for so many others though, Max, Karlsson, Zagar, L Dryml, Iverse, Bjerre, Norris, Holta to name but a few. Please don't shoot me down in flames, it's just my opinion!!

Don't have too many specific memories, but just recall that he was always immaculately turned out & one of the most stylish riders around. It was such a shame (from a speedway perspective) that he retired too early. Be great to see an item on him.

Steve Koppe - hard as nails.

Yeah, just received the first 3 issues today - only had a flick throuh, but looks great. Nice to see black & white pages!! And really high quality paper & print. I can't wait to get home from work & bury my nose in some nostalgia. Nice one tmc!

I don't see why everyone is so angry at Mark for not doing so well in the GP's. He didn't let Team GB down in the SWC & he knows as well as anyone how poor he has been in the series this year. I don't suppose for one minute that a) he is that happy about it & he does it on purpose. Mark has nothing to prove to anyone at all, does he? He has been there & done it & there are not many that can say that. He can't win, can he? If he makes an excuse he gets slated, if he says he had a bad time he gets slated. I daresay if he was doing great he would get slated by someone. The person he is letting down most of all is himself - I could understand people getting uptight if he was up with the leaders in the series & yet average 7 points a match in the league, but that isn't the case. He has ridden out of his socks for both Arena & Team GB this season, so what if he isn't at the top of his game in the GP. Why is it that people in this country have to get on the backs of their sporting heroes? Mark has always given 110% in his racing, give the guy a break.

Quite.

If you didn't see it, how can you say it wasn't deliberate? And, you say you won't comment & then you do! I don't say it was . I said that I didn't think it was. . . . I accept that garf, but how can you possibly comment on what did & didn't happen when you say you didn't see the incident?

If you didn't see it, how can you say it wasn't deliberate? And, you say you won't comment & then you do!

Rabbit I agree 100%. Not sure what BSI are trying to do, but some of the prices I have seen are ridiculous. Is it any surprise half the stadia are empty. Cardiff is clearly an exception & it IS a fantastic day out, but even so, there will come a time when people won't pay inflated prices. I recall when the GP first came to stadia like this that BSI said that they would sell tickets @ £10 to fill the venues up. Mmmm.....

My God, so many to choose from. Exeter v Belle Vue late October 1975 - Belle Vue needed a point to win the league from Ipswich, but Exeter triumphed 41-37. Iwas an incredible match. So many miles separated the sides, but Falcons v Aces matches were always like local derbies & that one was no exception. 1983 Weymouth v Exeter Cup final second leg @ Radipole Lane. Weymouth were a quality side then & the Falcons were pretty average to be honest, but the second leg will go down in Exeter folklore. Won the cup with a one point aggregate victory. Terrific match. SWC 2004 play off? 1996 KOCQF Swindon v Exeter @ Blunsdon 48-48. Just one of the most entertaining matches I have seen. Drama, controversy, great racing, it had the lot. Including an honourable draw. 1973 England v Sweden @ Sheffield 40-38. PC & Eric Boocock bringing the house down with a from the back 4-2 in the last race. Now that was a case of "Happiness is 40-38"!! Haven't got time to post any more now, but will try & get back to it.

GM, I do indeed recall him saying that he would never race for England again whilst DJ was in charge. I suspect however, that may have been in response to the very public slating that Jessup gave him. Wonder why he wasn't in charge of the team for very long? And in terms of some liking him & some not, I am not refeering to fans. We all have aour favourites & that is the way it will always be, but there is little doubt that he is respected almost universally by his fellow riders. And, yes, the look on his face ( & Chris Louis') at the end of the programme was funny - they were not amused! And Rotski, I accept you didn't question his approach at the SWC, but in the post I quoted, you didn't slate Havelock for waht he was saying/doing. You just slated him. Nor am I questioning your right to your opinion, we all have that right, which is why people are still referring to the incident in the SWC. However, if you are going to slate someone, at least try & justify it. Having said all of that - well done to Hans, he deserved his win on the day - no question. BTW Rotski, I do like your sig - reminds me of my relationship with my PC

So let me get this right. You are absolutley certain that Hans didn't cheat & that Havvy didn't ride his heart out for Team GB in the World Cup, or that he he isn't one of the most well respected riders amongst his peers? Very perceptive.

What, the idiot that rode his heart out for his country, you mean. Havvy says it how it is & 9 out of 10 times is right on the money. One of the most well respected riders within the sport. The only idiot is you.

There was no need for Sky to put ideas in anyone's heads - what Hans did was as plain as day. And in my case the case against Hans is for cheating, not robbing GB of the SWC.

Just come back to the forum having moved house & no net connection - can't believe this is still running, but having moved on slightly! Agree with you Splatty, company addresses & contact details are freely available on the net, phone book, companies house, etc., etc., So how is publishing their contact details "irresponsible"? That's ridiculous. In addition, as Splatty rightly says, if you feel that you must act on SCB's post, well that's up to the individual, not him. And I suspect if anyone felt that strongly about contacting one of Andersen's sponsors they wouldn't need prompting!

You could be right about the format Steve, but I can't help thinking that it's a retrograde step. What is wrong with the current format - it seems to work pretty well for the most part, doesn't it. I guess from a BSI viewpoint it's better to have less riders to pay prize money to?

Been giving the '05 GP some thought after looking into next year's event. Ticket prices are higher than this year I see. I believe that the number of riders in each event is being reduced to 16 - I assume this is likely to see a reduction in the number of races for each round. So, we get charged more money, to see less racing. That doesn't seem very fair does it? Does sound familiar though. More money for BSI, less action for the paying customer, or have I missed something?