Parsloes 1928 nearly

The CL/NL is NOT a 'junior league'.. You'll note there ARE junior leagues now - they are NOT the same level as the NL. Also I think you'll find that the site being mentioned here does include BL Div 2 data.

I'd have agreed about Hopwood if you'd said that last year Ben but I was impressed by the lad in 2013... A little known fact is he was the first visiting NL rider to record a maximum at Central Park... TBH Kent could do worse than consider Hopwwod for the Kings' side in '14...

There's no question whatsoever that IF the Evening Standard (in this hypothetical situation of a London track!) did preview and report on matches, that the 'fact' there was a Speedway track operating and a London team would come to the attention of people in a way that the best organised set of websites/social media could never do. Once people got to hear and wanted to know more, yes, then those things like FB etc. would of course be invaluable but the newspaper would without doubt be the best way to actually get people to know in the first place. I'm in no way against the idea of websites, FB etc. having a huge role in Speedway promotion but it puzzles me how people can think that a club could manage by promoting only through such a means. 'Surfing' is a misnomer because no-one ever just randomly surfs; it's always theme based to a lesser or greater extent. Whereas open a newspaper and if a story is there it can catch your eye. If it ain't, it doesn't!!

Please note someone else not me, linked the current discussion on this thread to that 'other' one! But I have to say a strange thing to say that: that they leave out data because they're not interested in it.. So if they weren't 'interested' in Rye House (say...) and left out any reference to that club in their stats that too would be okay would it..?! People are making this as if it's personal, it's not at all..: it began out of puzzlement as to why someone would set up such an excellent resource but leave out key data; and turned into incredulity that actually this ommission is deliberate..

You utterly miss the point! It's not about stats I "want", it's about deliberately leaving out info. out. In the context of this sub-theme about the value of the Internet, one disadvantage of the Internet can be when sites contain completely inaccurate or misleading info. - I was (on that other thread...) simply pointing that out. ------------ IF Speedway was back in London which do you think would be more valuable, a club website (which of course they'd be and would be very useful etc.) or if the London Evening Standard ran previews of every meeting and then reports of those meetings with a photo on the sports' pages?

You've lost me here..! The postings you've copied are relating to a 'history' site which tells an inaccurate history. Not a great example of the internet as a resource is it - as a journalist wanting to check out the career of our World Champ, Tai Woffinden will now find in so doing on that site, that the lad born in Scunthorpe NEVER rode for his home town club! Also explain to me how it is inaccurate to say, "far more people stumble on an article in their local paper than are likely to mysteriously 'surf' their way onto a website of a sport they've never heard of." That is an absolute fact surely..?!

oh okay....

That would indeed be a massive shame- I'm a big fan of our Benji. Excellent value as a rider.

A really top idea. I would love to see some tracks experiment this way - have long thought bands and Speedway would be a great mix!

Hmm, reading has never been Nikko's strongest skill and seemingly not yours either. I haven't said there's anything wrong with a good website (and I most certainly haven't criticised Kent's) - what I was saying was (1) it's an utter nonsense to even remotely suggest any Speedway club would pay someone £300 a week to run one; and (2) that Speedway needs good publicity and a good product and a website alone does not do that. As someone said, good local press attracts people who then may give it a go - far more people stumble on an article in their local paper than are likely to mysteriously 'surf' their way onto a website of a sport they've never heard of. So, for example, failing to have any kind of reception or presentation for the journalists and photographers of the local press at a P&P Day would probably be an error.. So, a website is a very important part of promoting and publicising a new Speedway track but it couldn't possibly standalone or be regarded as the most important thing. As for the comment about the "program" (sic) - I assume Nikko doesn't mean that; that in fact he means the programme..? Well, he's entitled to his opinion but I'd respectfully suggest that the Kent Kings programme can hold its head up high alongside the best in any of the sport's divisions. All new and original material every issue (no 'cut and paste' profiles common in the past and still prevalent in some clubs' meeting progs). And in the context of NL programmes, funny you should use the term 'dinosaur', AJ, because if you look at third tier programmes they are divided into two distinct eras: pre-2002 and post 2002 and it was the Wimbledon Dons programme which I put together and wrote for from 2002 to '05 which marked that change; that upped the stakes in terms of how professional in look and in content a third tier prog should be. This has carried on with the Kent Kings programme - just one element (along with, yes of course, the website) that embelished such a successful first year. Because, despite AJ's doom and gloom comments about what's "wrong" at Kent Speedway and Nikko's totally inaccurate comments on another thread about alarmingly low crowds, we had an amazing first season with great crowds and finished on a high with huge optimism for the future. And the main reason was that once people came through the gate they got a great product and they kept coming back for more and they brought family and friends - a combination of new fans and people returning to watch the sport in the county.

Sinfield was certainly the weak link. Missed the conversion and missed the tackle with 20 seconds to go. Am afraid he now has a total mental block when it comes to playing at Wembley.. :-(

I agree but how on earth does having a brilliant website generate such publicity..?! Unless you look at the website you'd know nothing about it - and if you've never heard of the track or even, dare I say it, the sport, why on earth would you look at the website? We can argue the finer points 'til we're blue in the face and of course people will have their own opinions, but I don't think I've personally seen a more crazy suggestion ever on the BSF (and I'm astonished anyone can agree with it tbh!) that it would be cost effective for a Speedway club to pay £300 a week to someone to update a wesite, FB page and Twitter feed!

Arsenal FC have a really good, professional website. What percentage of the 60k folk who come to every home game go there because the Club has a really good, professional website..? I think we can safely say exactly ZERO..!!

No it really isn't...!! Paying that sort of money would be total and utter madness which is why they wouldn't contemplate doing it..!

Exactly! So why did you suddenly start adding the word 'Development' in your posting..?!

But the FACT of the matter is, no Speedway club would ever contemplate even for a milisecond. forking out money like that for a 'webmaster'..! If a club paid £300 a SEASON for such a 'service' it would be unlikely; he's suggesting £300 a week!!

The World Cup came too late - can you imagine if we'd held on in the semi, played the Aussies yesterday and won... Not actually that big a leap in imagination..! Then clearly one of team (and I'd say Sam Burgess...) would be applicable to be nominated for SPOTY but by then it would've been too late!

I love sport. Yes, I love some sports more than others - obviously Speedway & Football plus Rugby League are higher up for me than , say, Tennis and Horse Racing. But, as I say, I do love basically all sport. So I have to say when Andy Murray won Wimbledon I recognised - as the huge majority of people in the country did - the enormity of the achievement: British's sport's longest wait (since the World Heavyweight voodoo was lifted by Lennox & Frank and then Wiggins winning the Tour De France last year) for a victory in a specific, very major event. And THAT is why Murray will win SPOTY - NOT because of any 'conspiracy' or defeciency in the 'rules'. It does Speedway fans no credit to be so anti other sports - you'd have thought considering the prejudice we face as a sport ourselves, we above all others would demonstrate a good attitude that says, 'live and let live'..

Er, no - obviously your reading skills are as poor as your grammar! No volunteers have any problem at all with riders getting paid; we're all happy to contribute to the sport we love. 'Contribute' being the operative word.. Not just sniping away continually like certain others!!

Last I heard you told us you NEVER buy a programme so frankly I can't think you'd have a tremendously informed opinion on the matter!!

The reason the notion of paying a Webmaster (sic) £300 a week is daft in the context of a Speedway club is because in the huge majority of cases, Club Press Officers & Programme Editors who put in hours of work each week are not paid (I should know, have done both roles in one way or another for many of the past 12 years and got been paid a bean..); not to mention people like announcers and all track & pits staff - all do it voluntarily. Pay someone £15k a year to, er, update feeds and in many cases simply populate a website with articles supplied by the PRO and I think then you'd have a lot of disgruntled folk who'd also want paying! Track Photographers are also not paid but, of course, get a goodly income often by being given exclusive rights to sell their photos at the track which 'employs' them...

Hmm, and it's easy to divert attention from the fact this data-base has deliberately omitted the league racing records of almost all current British riders, by going on about 'well you update it then'..! If the people who put together this web-site feel so strongly that the CL/NL isn't a proper league (which is exactly why they've left out the data, NOT because of the effort to find such data..) then they should stand by that. Am actually puzzled why those who hold the NL in such disdain would even be straying over to look at posts in this section of the BSF anyhow...

Hold on, the data isn't "missing" (you're thinking of the Lost City of Altantis!!) it has been deliberately left out! As all the data on CL/NL racing and riders' records is contained in Malcolm's superbly detailed books it would actually be a simple task to update - it's not there, not because it's some strange hidden data no one can access without years of research, it's missing because that one site CHOOSES to omit it because they don't have any regard for that part of Speedway in this country. They maintain this view that it's 'junior' and not worth any consideration, even though the league racing records of the World Champion and all his team-mates in the current Team GB squad are inaccurate as a result!!

Okay - just seeking clarity from other clubs and how they do things. I wonder what would happen if I exerted copyright over all the words I've written in Speedway programmes since 2002 - many of which have been copied and cribbed in other programmes and on websites..? One 'law' for writers and another for photographers apparently..?

Hmm, it's hardly anyone's fault other than the people who's website it is, that when a Racing Career Record site shows the complete absense of accurate info. (in this case missing out most of a rider's career!)someone is going to point out this ommission. The person pointing it out this time being the Third Tier's most distinguished historian and statistician, Mr. Vasey. And for those who've not followed the other thread, please note the people who compile this website have said it leaves out the CL/NL records not because of problems in updating these but as a deliberate policy because those behind the site regard CL/NL racing as 'junior' and of no interest. Fair enough if that's their opinion but then they need to take it on the chin when others comment on this and criticise such a premise.