speedyguy

I have been to the http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway site's archives and studying that, plus what is being discussed here, the sport in Brazil is probably more akin to short track racing rather than speedway.

There was some comment about speedway in Brazil on http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway about 18 months. It was in regard to 1947 and carried some photos as well. Moderntimes: Argentina v Brazil at speedway - the Argies would win easily! They have been involved in speedway since around 1929. It's evry well organised there...as are midget cars!

There's an article about Wal Morton in the current edition of 'Classic Speedway.'

Spain never became a German puppet state. It remained neutral throughout WW2 - and there were organised escape routes across Spain from occupied to Gibraltar which the Spanish police "seemed not to notice." Franco resisted several efforts by Germany/Italy to enter WW2. The nearest was to send the Blue Division to fight in Russia on the German side - I suppose something similar to the International Brigade? In regard to Spain as a communist state - they are on the western side of the Med and would have been communist without any neighbours. On the other hand, the Adriatic communist states were backed landwise by other communist states. A Spain in communist isolation with possible Soviet bases there would have been a major problem for NATO.

'the smell of diesel and hot metal filling his nostrils' is sheer nonsense. Written by somebody who obviously knows nothing about speedway. Who can explain 'hot metal filling his nostrils' and there has never been a diesel engined speedway bike.

I regard that as an uncalled for reference to Fay Taylour. She undoubtedly had some extreme right-wing views but I am certain never indulged them to the extremes used by fascists in Italy and Germany (on the assumption Nazism and Fascism are identical philosophies). I have read the item on Clem Beckett - it's rather colourful to say the least. The 'democratic' side he fought for in Spain was in fact communist in its outlook. It was backed with arms, advisers and others by the Soviet Union (aka Russia). Spain's gold reserves were paid over to the Soviet Union at that time for the arms etc supplied to them. Germany and Italy backed Franco and his army to prevent a Soviet-style republic being established in Spain. Had Franco been defeated, one doesn't like to think what problems a communist Spain could have caused in the post-war cold war years. Russian bases in the Mediterranean for example.

Gene Bonsignore started racing on the USA's East Coast in 1976-77 and is still active in New York State. He still regularly makes it into the A-main finals at Champion Speedway. Gene celebrated his 60th birthday sometime last year (2008).

Morton and Pymar - both from around 1932 until into the mid-1960s. I guess about 33 years at minimum for both of them. Real great old REAL speedway riders.

Canadian rider Mike Tams rode from 1947 to 1986, most of his latter seasons in Canada and the USA's East Coast. He was born in 1919 in Winnipeg, Canada. That would make him 66 years old at time of his retirement - if my calculations are correct.

Eric Liddell rode for Ashfield Glasgow between 1949 and 1953. in 1949 he scored 10 points for Scotland when they defeated Holland 62-22 in an unfofficial test match at Ashfield. He rode for Ashfield at a time when Keith Gurtner wore blue leathers and Merv Harding wore red leathers. Liddell was famous for wearing silver leathers. Perhaps folk north of the border remember him more than the southerners - maybe that's why he's mentioned among Scotland's Top 20 in the various ratings lists appearing on http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway

The latest Top 20 poll on http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway gives this Top Five in its ratings: 1 - Jim McMillan 2- George Hunter 3- Ken McKinlay 4- Tommy Miller 5- Gordon McGregor ...and Eric Liddell, forgotten man in the first ratings list posted there, continues to move up the chart.

I have a copy but so far have not been able to review the book in depth. However, my initial impressions are extremely favourable. Sme great old photos and I tasted some lovely little stories. My advice is make sure of your copy - it's a limited edition and looks certain to become a collector's item. http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway

Sorry, I was a little confusing over Eric Liddell. Basically, I was asking if he deserved a Top 20 Scottish riders placing and, if so, just where he should be in the list. He came into the ratings after not being named in the first Post on the subject, but seemed by subequent Posters to be fairly well respected by them. Hope that clears up my unintentional confusion.

On the oldtimespeedway site, the list seems basic in its nominations...just 21 riders named for a top 20 list. Was it as close as that in Scotland? After missing a nomination from the founding list, Eric Liddell seems to have come in with some reasonable support. I thought he was a midget car driver...he's listed as the 1953 Scottish champion in this motorsport. http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway

I think P1928 is trying to rewrite the science of geneaology.

Yes, I seem to remember Tommy Miller in NL1. Wasn't he with Coventry. I'll check that later. The debate on http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway has certainly thrown up several interesting names. Doesn't Eric Liddell deserve a better rating than he's been given by several of its Posters?

I cannot see what's upset you about Jeff's Post. I thought it was excellent commentary (see an earlier Post). I think the point Jeff was trying to make was that the descents line was not three Streets but just two Crumps in a family line.

Were you there the night we sadly saw Johnno fall off when Jim Chalkley came inside him on the pits bend? Not the sort of thing that would have happened to Johnno in his prime - he would have just moved over on 'Tiger Tim' and closed down his drive.

An interesting debate is taking place on http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/oldtimespeedway in regard to Scotland's Top 20 riders in the post-war era.

An update on this excellent book. ‘COVENTRY’S TWO SPEEDWAYS’ From: Colin Parker, 59 Clinton Lane, Kenilworth, Warwickshire, CV8. Phone queries to: 01926 854 852. Email: colineparker@tiscali.co.uk Softback, 192 pages, 155 illustrations (30 taken at the two Coventry tracks, some in sepia). Limited print run, unlikely to be repeated. £14.99 plus £1.76 postage, packing. All proceeds to the Speedway Riders Benevolent Fund. THE Lythalls Lane cinder-track opened in July 1928, followed by Brandon in late September. The book tells the story of the two speedways up to the outbreak of war in 1939. It is a comprehensive history of events, of the riders, the promoters and the fans, both the serious and the comical. Every meeting is mentioned and some, either famous or infamous, are covered in more detail. There are stories of temper tantrums, tyre cutting, lay-down engines and guest riders. And although the the early circus-like atmosphere soon changed to more serious professional racing, both venues struggled for survival as the great depression took its toll on provincial clubs. But there were good years as well, with spectacular leg-trailing action and the emergence of a number of local riders from obscurity to become world-class performers. Among riders mentioned is Tommy Farndon in his years at Lythalls and Brandon. There is also a short chapter on the 1935 season when Farndon died after an accident at New Cross. The book carries 18 action and portrait photos of Farndon as well as a photo of his autograph. The book also includes what is regarded as one of speedway’s greatest classic photos, a 1930 action shot taken at Wimbledon of Australian stars Vic Huxley and Billy Lamont. Author Colin Parker said: “What I've done is to include just about every known photo of the two Coventry tracks and then add a few of the very best from elsewhere, but only when relevant to the story. “The cover photo is a good sepia pic of the classic Tom Farndon versus Dicky Case British championship decider in 1935.” There is also a short four-page final chapter on midget cars which ran at Coventry from 1937 to 1939. The photos include one of cars and drivers lined up at Lea Bridge; a 1938 'Brandon Car Speedway' programme cover; an action shot of Charlie Pashley leading Walter Mackereth at Brandon; and a photo of Pashley and other drivers inspecting a Skirrow midget car at Brandon. The book feature almost 150 illustrations, with many photos taken at the Coventry tracks and not previously published; much material is taken from contemporary newspapers, magazines and programmes as well as comments from some of the spectators who were present at the the time. All profits go to the Speedway Riders Benevolent Fund.

And I think the general overall opinion on this backs my definition!

That's is the point. I accept that Neil Street is Jason Crump's grandfather on the maternal side. It's just that it's not a direct male generation thing from Street to the Crumps as P1928 seems to believe...Phil Crump's father is the link in the generation chain...except he wasn't a speedway rider.

Generation (1): Alec Grant, Rob Grant (senior), Rob Grant (junior) Generation (2) Guy Allott, Nicky Allott, Adam Allott Notice something?

But what was Louis Lawson's REAL name? It's been debated but I can't remember it nor find my note on the subject.

My guess would be Graham Miles! Is that worth a separate debate?