BOBBATH

Clearly Bert Harkins and Ross Gilbertson should be added, would put them both above Willie T.

Can somebody find out for me what Fred and these other"mature" guys are drinking so I can order a case for myself!!!

That's a rattling good answer!!!-guess 'elf and safety would ban 'em now.

Had totally forgotten about Sheffield-ta for research Arnie

Whiteknight-glad the rattles brought back a memory for you,someone mentioned that these rattles were relics of WW2 -used by air raid wardens- anyone know if that is true. They were definitely a feature of all football match crowds, but I thought I recalled them being used by speedway fans also. Can anybody shed further light on this rattling good mystery(sorry folks)!!!

Ta tigerowl-have to add one correction. There was a post the other day re Henry Long his birthday was listed as 26.7.1927-so that would make him # 9 -after Derrick Close and before Geoff Mardon-thanks for the info though. We now know the top 19-I haven't heard that Peo Soderman has passed away, so thanx for the info.

Yes they were all the people with the wooden rattles-as per football matches then(what happened to them all-the rattles that is not the forumlanders!!)

I reckon #1 will be Coventry

So was it the real Philip who posted..Full confession - I am the real BOBBATH (who he)??

Cheers Norbold, but forgetting all about Biggs for a minute-wot about Split and the likelihood of him providing some "insurance" by chatting to the other two. I know how to settle this-let's both fly out to Spain or Tenerife or wherever the heck he lives now and ask him-I will even buy him a scotch(you too)

See a post today from Philip Rising-if that is THE Philip Rising who used to write in the Speedway Star in the sixties, he might be interested in this. Reg Fearman and I are in touch via e-mail, we discuss allsorts (not licorice). Anyway we were bemoaning the decline in standards of written English in UK today. We recalled that the standard of writing in the old Stars for example was nothing like the crap you see nowadays in Britain. I particularly recall Philip's writing. Specifically, the Star 11 Sept 1964-pages 10-11"Meet the Finalists" also Sept 25 1964 "Spotlight on PL Finalists". There were many others but I have kept these issues and am looking at them now. So just a note Philip to let you know how appreciated your literate prose and erudition were-they gave a lot of pleasure to me and no doubt countless others. Good on you and you should know your writing is fondly remembered.

Hi Norbold-re heat 19 of 1951 World Final, enjoyed your post and I reckon its a bit of both. Before the race Aub Lawson had 5 pts.,Fred Williams 6 and Split 9. Split just had to win it, as you know. No doubt Jack Biggs was visibly nervous and the others would have observed this. However Split had no way of knowing that he would miss the gate. Knowing Split by reputation only I could see him talking to Fred and Aub and providing a bit of money for assurance they wouldn't screw him. No way these guys ganged up on Jack coz as it turned out, he didn't streak away from the gate.Tho' On page 11 of Speedway News 26 Sept 1951 is a review of the race. Just says"Biggs got into trouble on first bend and then badly tailed off". I dunno what the trouble was- it could be either explanation. Article goes on to say"Aub Lawson was away, followed by Fred Williams with Waterman third. Split tempered a moment of wildness and riding with grim determination passed first Williams and then Lawson to win one of the finest races ever seen". Reading that reminded me of one of the old second half "Rider of the Night Finals" where often the best race of the entire meeting occurred usually with the agreement of the 4 riders. So maybe Split didn't need insurance money to beat Jack by the others ganging up(although there is still the matter of the "trouble" on the first bend), but may be his investment paid off when he needed to pass the others. Always fun to speculate-I guess there may be no-one on Forumland who actually attended the meeting, and except for Split(always a smart operator)all the riders in the race are now gone.. I know you probably have the Speedway News issue I'm referring to Norbold -what do you reckon of my thoughts and do any others have views from -holy cow-almost 64 years ago

With all the changes since the last list-anybody able to figure out the current oldest 16(+2 reserves)

Yes I agree with all the Dave Jessup comments-was there in 1978 and agree he would have beaten Kennett who in my view was lucky to be runner up. As for the Jack Biggs situation in 1951 there has been endless discussion over the years over who said what to who in the final ride before runoff-reckon he lost the run off fair and square though. Some of you probably recall Jack's renewed lease on life career wise when he joined Newport in 1965 and became top scorer in quite a strong team.

Hi Norbold-that's because I didn't see speedway till Newport opened in 1964-wish I'd seen those I just missed-particularly Peter Craven. You being younger than me makes me feel even older!!

I remember the Dave Jessup incident-agree he could have been World Champ that year-don't think it was 1974 though

I woz there folks when Knutsson finally won in 1965, reckon if he'd kept going could have won it again. Were any other forumlanders there at Wembley in 1965-or am I the last survivor!!

Well I'm 68, I'm decaying from the inside out(this cannot be!!) and didn't see any of the riders named in Norbold's post-but did see Briggs ,Fundin , Knutsson, both Moore's Ronnie and Peter,-saw my first World Final in 1965 and my last LA 1982(but not all the ones in between)-did see 1975 , 78 and 81 though. So I'm with CHR on this one. BTW 80 ain't old anymore -Chuck Berry is still performing at 88-apropos of nothing Honor Blackman is 89 but am not sure she still performs in any sense of the word anymore!!! OK OK so kick me off the forum for this ageist comment!!

I think Poole did not race in 1957, when the two NL divisions combined into one. I reckon Poole finished bottom of NL 1 in 1956 and pulled out. So maybe shouldn't be included in the list. Might be wrong though

Wot about Jack Parker!!! BTW I agree with the other names mentioned

Excellent question-wish I had thought of it myself!! Here is my feeling. One is the price of land e.g. London tracks-West Ham (RIP) it was too valuable for the existing use, also secondly change in demographics as someone said the old working class white east enders(and lets face it speedway was mainly a working class sport) have gone elsewhere. This doesn't explain how Sheffield continues-maybe it won't for much longer.-Sheffield is a wonderful track to visit -as an away fan right up there with Long Eaton and Cradley Heath. So perhaps the future is for rural tracks mainly. Wish I coukld go back to the old times though-(barman gimme a pint of Watney's Red Barrel please)!!!

Count me as one of the forumlanders that didn't get Norbold's comment re Chris Harris and Darcy Ward. Who they??

R.I.P. Danny-sorry Gustix to ask whether it was confirmed-reason is sometimes incorrect info gets floated around on social media by pranksters, trolls etc. depending on which social media is involved. Sorry to hear it confirmed nonetheless.

Has this been confirmed ??

Ta customhouse regular. I did visit West Ham several times and always enjoyed it , in fact I went there to my last ever speedway meeting before I left England-Tuesday August 6th 1968. It was a European Semi-Final of the World Championship. Looking at the programme I see Barry Briggs got only 6 pts. and did not qualify as one of the eight who got thru-although as you probably know due to other riders' sickness/injuries he still got to ride in the World Final and finished 2nd to Ivan Mauger. Many years later, on a visit to London, long after West Ham had closed and the stadium been demolished , for old times sake I caught the tube to Plaistow and did the walk to the stadium location just as I used to, Greengate Street, Prince Regent Lane etc.-wintry damp evening not many people about just a couple of feral looking teenagers drinking canned lager. Didn't seem like the old East End I remembered- and found it depressing-so maybe you are right "never go back". BTW what happened to all the old east end families who lived there??-moved out I guess because it seemed like an alien culture and population has moved in.( no non PC comment intended-officer)!!!