Skyjack2

Look at the picture in that article. Zagar is in Eastbourne kit at BV. The article has been written by someone who doesn't 'know' speedway or they would not have used an 'editorially' inaccurate picture. The part about 'admission' is not in "quotation marks" so it's an assertion/asumption by the journalist not taken from an official SCB statement. The Poole riders Tweets created an issue and I don't think there's been a confesion regarding wrongdoing other than calling the meeting off before the referee arrived to make the decision. Check your facts. What did they admit to exactly? The bit in bold italics Mr Cross is exactly why this story has blown up. The absence of any quote from Neil Middleditch or Matt Ford is quite unprecedented. I think it's possible certain people with an interest in speedway didn't expect the NSS to get this far and now they're worried that the balance of power in British speedway is about to shift in favour of Manchester, if the NSS goes ahead and ends up at Kirkmanshulme Lane Gorton, Manchester. With a World Cup and an SGP in Manchester Poole's nose would be seriously out of joint as the 'centre' of British speedway, at one very southern end of the UK. That comes as no surprise to any of us who have any idea about what's really going on. When you look at the product and the stories that surround speedway, the self interest of certain individuals who have benefited disproportionately, says a lot about the reality of what goes on behind the scenes. David Gordon's company built Manchester United's training ground at Carrington. He understands development and construction and Chris Morton MBE is a speedway 'personality'. They both genuinely love speedway and The Belle Vue Aces. If you take the NSS away from them out of spite and jealousy you deserve all you get and you know who you are. The defence rests.

http://www.bellevuea...tem.aspx?id=902 I'm not sure BV ever even said officially that it was a 'burst' water main. See above. The picture of the track published on twitter showed surface water. Not water gushing through the track surface from a burst water main!? See above. A leaking pipe/water main is very different to a burst water main. Pictures were taken by the referee who was sent to inspect the track, to be used as evidence, so how can they be irrelevant!? http://www.bellevuea...tem.aspx?id=903 Where did BV admit to lying? I don't think Chris Morton MBE is a liar or a cheat. He might be guilty of being a bit short but there can't be too many tall ex speedway riders wandering around even in Poole... The BV track is rubbish on occasion, because it has to facilitate about half as many stock car and banger meetings, a season, as speedway meetings. That takes its toll on the track surface. Try that at Poole, or Wolves and see how happy Noddy and Darcy, or Tai and Freddie are? BV are guilty of an early call off not a late one. At worst, they may have jumped the gun because it suited them to call it off and they were aware that Poole fans were travelling a long way. For the next two seasons the earliest call off your likely to get from BV is 6pm when the referee arrives. Comparing this issue to Holocaust denial says a lot more a bout you than it does about anybody else who's made a comment in defence of BV. Perhaps you might like to reconsider that statement...!? BV might have apologised but that doesn't mean they lied. I'm not suggesting BV are perfect but the dodgy Poole Twitter pics of the BV track are as "iffy" as anything BV did in terms of trying to get an advantage out of difficult circumstances. Phillius D. Fogghead ESQ. Manchester Flat Earth Society

They said there was on the day. The track was never claimed to be flooded. It was claimed it was waterlogged on the 2nd bend. We don't know what Darren thought, or what he put in his report when he took pictures. Why not take a picture of the 2nd bend, why go to the other end of the track to take pictures? BV apologised to avoid an unfortunate PR incident. They never said they were guilty of wrong doing, they said they accepted that they had made an error of judgement in cancelling the meeting when they did. It's subtle political manoeuvring. As is taking pictures from the other end of the track instead of taking pictures of the 2nd bend... They are now above BV in the table as a result of the hearing. They've gained an advantage over an opponent.

Poole were fined when Magic missed his flight. BV cancelled a meeting and it seems Poole riders suggested on Twiiter that BV riders were delayed and therefore unavailable and that BV cancelled the meeting unduly for that reason and fabricated a problem with the track to justify the cancellation. What bugs some of us up in BV land is that Poole have got form for using the influence they have with the SCB to get a ruling that they require. If BV appeal there will be a lot of negative publicity attached to their stadium plans and they could do without that. Given that Poole riders moaned about the track on Twitter last time they came to BV, it might seem sensible to try an offer the World Champion a decent track to race on next time. However, they moaned about something else this time and took dodgy photos to justify it. It stinks a bit... If the 2nd bend was fine at 16:07 or 16:15 then take a picture of it and say look it's fine. Don't walk to the other end of the track and say look the tracks fine... here's a picture of the 4th bend. I don't get it!? Posting later at 17:54 that 'there was a little bit of water coming out of turn 2' doesn't help, it sounds like a slightly guilty conscience. Speedway riders are awesome, so I'm not a fan of criticising them. Then again maybe BV cheated to give themselves chance of winning 3 points against Poole next time around when the meeting was rescheduled... It smells like politics again..

Why was the referee sent? Because members of the SCB saw pictures pictures that suggested the track was fine. Why not take accurate pictures of the part of the track that's causing the problem and ask the SCB to send someone. The pictures posted on twitter by Poole riders were a deliberate misrepresentation of the state of the BV track. They deliberately didn't show the problematic part of the track that lead to the cancellation and these pictures also lead to an inaccurate article in the local press, in turn bringing the sport in to disrepute. So if BV are fined £5k, for what we don't know exactly but they've been found guilty and Poole were fined £1k for no Magic, then surely posting inflammatory pictures is equally sanction-able!?

Maybe the Poole riders tweeting pictures of the wrong part of the track muddied the waters and forced the SCB to take action?

The stadium security work for the stadium in the public areas of the stadium. They don't go on the dog track, never mind the speedway track. You're absolutely right about Magic. I think that is exactly why Poole complained to the SCB and why pictures of the BV track were posted on Twitter to back up that complaint. I think pictures of parts of the track that were apparently fine raised understandable questions about a report of a cancellation due to a water logged track. I think BV were fined based on a protest from Poole and the SCB finding was that the meeting could have gone ahead. BV had to make a damage limitation call at shortly after 3:15pm and do what they thought was best. You can't know for sure how fast the track will dry out as we saw on Good Friday 2012. Whether the real reason for the cancellation was that riders were stuck/delayed in Poland, rather than a genuine concern over the track, well I guess only a select few will know for sure and won't be able to acknowledge that publicly either way.

It's up to you what you think. The Tweets from the Poole riders were enough to raise questions and an SCB enquiry was triggered and a hearing was held, as a result of either tweeted pictures, or an official complaint from Poole. I'll ask again. Why go to the opposite end of the stadium to take photographs of the track? I think someone should perhaps ask Chris and Rohan that question. You keep avoiding that fact!? I haven't slandered the referee sent to inspect the track. I know him and I don't think taking pictures approximately 3 hours later gives an indication of what BV faced at the time they published a picture of surface water on the 2nd bend shortly after 3pm. BV said that there was a water leak at the time they published a picture on Twitter. Are you suggesting Zagar deliberately tweeted that he was in a Manchester hotel room when he wasn't? Now who's getting in to slander territory? Why would he tweet that he was in Manchester if he wasn't? I don't know the truth, I was sharing my thoughts on here, as I've done in the past. I've done 10 years reporting on BV. I've done my bit for Elite League speedway. In the past I've known the facts about stories that would've made disappointing reading if published. So the facts weren't published because that's the way the status quo was maintained. I'm entitled to my informed opinion and I think this one is as fishy as the rule that said Jason Lyons' average was too high for BV to have Ricky Ashworth doubling up in 2006, even though that rule didn't exist and was later added to the rule book. There was also the 2004 episode where Rory Schlein was told by the speedway 'authorities' that he couldn't continue to double up for BV and ride in the world under 21 champs. "You can't have two bites of the cherry son." He could and he did but for a few days he was very upset at the thought of having to choose one or the other. I don't know if BV cheated but I do know that two Poole riders posted pictures on twitter taken 200 metres away from the point on the 2nd bend, that BV had tweeted a picture of, showing surface water and claiming there was a water leak. One of those pictures from a Poole rider triggered a story in the Manchester local media. I believe those tweeted pictures brought the sport into disrepute. As to which one, it's hard to know. Who's going to tell the truth about why they took their twitter pics? Either, BV faked a water leak on a sunny day to get a meeting called off and the Poole riders took a picture of a different part of the track at the other end of the stadium in error. Or, BV had a genuine water leak on a sunny day and the Poole riders took a picture of a different part of the track at the other end of the stadium in error. Or, BV faked a water leak on a sunny day to get a meeting called off and the Poole riders took a picture of a different part of the track at the other end of the stadium to get the circumstances investigated. Or, BV had a genuine water leak on a sunny day and the Poole riders took a picture of a different part of the track at the other end of the stadium to get the circumstances investigated. I think that covers it... If you don't agree that's fine. You're entitled to your opinion. I suggest we agree to disagree, or this could get boring.

LOL Apologies to Rohan Tungate. A whistle stop trip to Amsterdam yesterday for the footy appears to have lead to me getting him completely mixed up with Ryan Tunnicliffe, who plays for Manchester United and then using a made up name. Sorry Rohan, I am a '....' insert appropriate label of choice... I'm not defending BV and I'm not saying Wolves were wrong to say they didn't want to ride the track on Good Friday 2012. My understanding was that the BV riders were willing to give it a go in front of a bumper crowd and understandably Wolves weren't keen. The track had been over watered late to keep the dust down and it didn't dry as quickly as expected. I'm not saying Poole were wrong to be annoyed that their meeting at BV was cancelled in circumstances they thought were dubious. Especially after they had been fined for a rider missing a flight and them tracking an under strength side. The referee the SCB sent hasn't refereed many, if any Elite League matches at BV and is therefore less familiar with recent local 'local' issues like the drive off the 2nd bend catching riders out. I know him quite well but haven't seen him at BV for a year or so. The track's been relayed since he did his SCB referee training their a few years ago. He's a good bloke and I like him. I think Tony Swales resigned because he was upset by the circumstances of the Good Friday cancellation and it wasn't worth the further upset for him to carry on. He's a very nice bloke. I may have got that wrong, the bit about him resigning, not about him being a nice bloke. Noddy and 'Rohan' Tweeted photos taken from the opposite end of the BV track to to where the stated problem was. That's a fact. Why didn't they just take photos of the 2nd bend from the pits gate and say we've had it worse than that when we've been before? That's a serious question, that deserves consideration. They took photos from a vantage point that didn't show the 2nd bend. It took them 5 minutes to walk there and 5 minutes to walk back. Why bother when the 2nd bend is right next to the pit gate? Given recent complaints about the BV track if the water pipe leak was genuine, which the BV Tweeted pics showed at the time, it's not surprising BV didn't look a gift horse in the mouth if they had other problems. The fact remains the visiting team had previously complained about the track at BV being of a poor standard, so if there was a problem with the track it makes sense to cancel and re-stage the meeting. If Poole hadn't requested an investigation then there wouldn't be a problem. Chinese whispers soon turns a leaking pipe in to a burst water main. As for riders missing flights I don't know. Matej Zagar eventually ended up in a Manchester Airport hotel at about 21:00 according to his Twitter feed. Based on Poole's response I doubt they'd have voluntarily agreed to postpone the meeting under the circumstances. Until BV's points were deducted yesterday they were ahead of Poole having had 3 matches less. The Elite League table will show BV have been deducted 3 points for the entire season. That's not great PR when they're trying to get a new stadium built. The SCB said they didn't want to give other teams an advantage but did exactly that by giving BV a points deduction that is highlighted on the Elite League table with an asterisk to brand the aces for their shame. The SCB is rarely open about it's decision making process and there are lots of strange goings on behind the scenes, as there are with other sports and businesses. I don't think any members of the FA board have an interest in any football clubs though. CVS and Alex Harkess do, as far as I'm aware and they're also on the SCB board, as far as I'm aware. If a problem with the track on the starting gate at Poole caused a meeting to be postponed, posting a picture on Twitter of the back straight saying the track's fine wouldn't be helpful, so why do it? Perhaps because you have your own agenda. It was a sunny day at BV which clouded over a little later but even close up pictures of the second bend wouldn't show how soft the track was if there was a localised problem from a water leak and the top surface layer dried. So, the SCB's decision is based on the testimony of the attending local referee, evidence in the form of any pictures he took and the BV management's statements to the enquiry. Also perhaps statements from any Poole officials if they lodged a complain which they must have done to trigger an SCB enquiry. I've stood on the 2nd bend at BV when it's been bone dry and the 3rd bend has been spongy on the way in because the water table at that end is lower. There are stand pipe connections at BV often used by John Perrin for watering with a hose pipe, as he preferred that to a water bowser. If one of those leaked under pressure it could easily give you a local flood, that affected only a small area of the track, so BV may have been telling the truth. I haven't asked because I'm not involved at BV any more, which is why I felt able to post on the forum for the first time in a long time. Nothing much has changed, apart from BV being on the cusp of a shovel ready new stadium project. It might be another example of some clubs being more equal than others in terms of influence with the SCB, then again BV may have been stupid enough to risk 6 years of hard work, a £10 million stadium development and their hard earned reputation with the local council and New East Manchester Ltd (the local area development company) for 3 Elite League points. I guess anything is possible... it is speedway after all. Here's hoping they all live happily ever after. Fingers Crossed.

I did check my spelling but I'm statemented dyslexic/dyspraxic and sometimes don't see what's spelt incorrectly. I said I wrote it on an iPhone. Mistakes are easily made and easily forgiven. To the best of my knowledge what I wrote is a fair reflection of reality. BV posted pics of the 2nd bend and Poole riders posted pics taken from the 4th bend terraces. A vantage point at the opposite end of the stadium from the pits that doesn't show the 2nd bend in the photos. In addition to appologising for formatting, I also apologise for any ofense caused by spelling errors. I'm guessing I spelt Ryan's surname incorrectly as I'm not familiar with him, given it was his first trip to KL, as far as I recall. Cheers Luke

Graham may run the SCB on a day to day basis but the SCB's published nomenclature/paperwork/regulations lists CVS and Alex Harkess as members of the SCB board, both are members of the BSPA. The ACU's published nomenclature/paperwork/regulations state that it has no control over the running of speedway in the UK and that speedway in the UK is run solely under SCB regulations. The ACU regulates all other forms of bike sport in the UK apart from events run by MCF. If BV appeal they can appeal to the ACU and eventually the court of arbitration for sport because that's the legal framework in place. In 2012 Wolves effectively cancelled a BV meeting on Good Friday because they didn't want to ride a track they claimed was too wet/heavy and unsafe. Track Curator Tony Swales left BV and was replaced by SCB Track Inspector Colin Meredith. Later in the year FIM/SCB Referee Craig Ackroyd abandoned a televised meeting at BV for similar reasons. At a point later again in the season Poole riders complained about the BV track on Twitter after a meeting and a Wolves rider stated that the upside of being injured meant he didn't have to ride at BV. This year BV cancelled a meeting with Poole shortly after 3pm due to an area of the track on the exit of the 2nd bend being waterlogged. Riders often lift there if it's too grippy. (Artur Mroczka and Rory Schlein both picked up injuries as a result of lifting there and crashing in 2012.) Poole riders then posted pictures on Twitter taken from the opposite end of the stadium to the area of the track affected, claiming the track was fine. These Tweeted pictures were followed by a process where a relatively inexperienced (in Elite League terms) local SCB referee attended the track and took pictures and an inexperienced (in local speedway) journalist contacted Poole rider Ryan Tuncliffe on Twitter regarding his Tweeted picture and subsequently wrote a story in the MEN. Subsequently BV released a statement apologising for the cancelation. An obvious PR requirement given they're at a crucial stage in developing the National Speedway Stadium. BV mgmt have spent 6 years working on a £10 million new stadium project that's nearly shovel ready. To cheat at this stage would be utter madness! BV press officer and MEN journalist Richard Frost was on holiday at the time and I'm no longer able to cover BV for the BBC as I have done since 2005. I haven't spoken to anyone from BV, as I'm no longer involved, so I don't know the truth but there's clearly a lot at stake here and I think the potential to lose the NSS and a European SGP in Manchester means people need to consider their agendas, very carefully. Apologies for formatting. Sent from my bed and my iPhone. Kind regards Luke Jameson

Either BV are guilty of a deliberate misrepresentation of the truth regarding the 2nd bend being waterlogged, or they've been spanked by the SCB for calling it off too early before the referee arrived. Poole riders posting pictures of a different part of the track than the part claimed to be waterlogged is/was not helpful. Especially when an MEN journalist then contacts a Poole rider on Twitter in order to write a story about his Tweeted picture. It would be helpful if the SCB published the facts that influenced their decision and stated what BV are guilty of.

It's always been Tony Mole's vision to take Birmingham in to the Elite League that's why he took over Belle Vue from JP so he'd have experience of running an EL track and he got BV for a song as John Perrin wanted out and needed to clear his debts. Peterborough riders weren't blocked because Rick Frost said Peterborough didn't want to run EL under current circumstances, so KL signed Peterborough's top EL riders, which was an obvious move. The BSPA sanctioned those deals before they realised Coventry's legal action had any teeth. Once Peterborough realised Coventry's legal team had a case to make and also realised that the BSPA weren't going to let Peterborough join the PL, Peterborough got on board with Coventry to follow the path of legal action, in order to preserve their respective clubs' futures. Don't be surprised if Kennethe Bjerre and Niels Kristian Iversen revert back to Peterborough for 2011. In the past Terry Russell, along with Chris Van Stratton and Matt Ford have ruled the roost at the BSPA, as they have had the financial advantage and the control and influence within the sport to move forward with an agenda that they believed was 'In the best interests of the sport' and I think their intentions have always been relatively genuine but clearly, out of necessity, the best interests of the sport also include the best interests of their respective clubs, at the top of that agenda, as these guys area at the centre of the business that is Speedway GB. Avtar Sandhu and Rick Frost have found themselves in a position where they've been backed in to a corner and have nothing to lose. That's a very dangerous position because they are now going to either stay on their own terms and hopefully lay down the foundation for future framework of equality, or if they are forced out, (which I doubt) they'll adopt a scorched earth policy and napalm the lot of it in terms of the Elite League and TV deal and ride off in a helicopter, only it won't be a Bell Huey Cobra liked they used in Nam. This has been coming for 6 years since Hamill and Hancock were sent from Coventry to Oxford in 2004 in Avtar Sandhu's first season at Brandon. You don't sound convinced!? The reason is that if there are less than 8 clubs in the Elite League the Sky deal defaults and Sky are released from their contractual obligations to televise British speedway and they can take their money with them. That means GSI's 20% finders fee revenue stream is gone and a new deal has to be found. No 2010 season review this Xmas on Sky, so the damage is already being done!! Super League got one instead to fill the TX slot that would've ran with the Speedway season review.

So Matt tells us. But when have we ever believed a word he says. The SCB gave a diffinitive ruling last year, after the Poole enquiry, that these kind of matters should be dealt with through the appropriate channels and not aired through match programme articles. Matt should be admonished for bringing the sport in to disrepute, again! However, if Pawlicki says he wants to be a Pirate in 2011 he'll definately be on an assessed 4. Matt'll fix it. How's about that then guys N galls, rattle, rattle, jewellery, jewellery, check me tie and me highlights, I'm a Legend.

QUOTE (Rob B @ Apr 25 2009, 10:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The studio has nothing to do with it, SKY have shown NASCAR and Speedway in HD in the past, in NASCAR all the races from Daytona were in HD. Think it's to do with money, think they have to pay lot more to the host broadcaster for the HD feed. You may not have read it closely enough Rob. Sky have limited availability of HD equipped studios for the panel and presenters - last year's British SGP was in HD from the Venue, with the studio feed carried by the HD truck. Given that NASCAR is on in the middle of the night the 2 HD equipped studios that Sky do have may not be in use for other programmes, so they may have used one for the NASCAR you've seen on the HD Channels!? You can't TX the action in HD and then keep going back to the panel in an SD studio, as the difference in quality would be unacceptable to HD subscribers!? See the post from Uno below AV Forums Sky Sports HD coverage That's my reading of what flagrag is saying anyway. Cheers Luke